VIA Rail train and OC Transpo Bus collision

[imprezzed]

http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/news/story/1.1858868

[ocUser]

Shocking and tragic. How could this have possibly happened!?

My condolences go out to everyone affected.

[awstott]

WOW! Apparently 5 fatalities

Guessing the bus operator was one of them based on some of the images.

[C.Flat]

According to a witness on the radio the bus was going full speed and only started braking as it ran through the barrier

[Centralsmt]

According to a witness on the radio the bus was going full speed and only started braking as it ran through the barrier

Lets wait until the investigation to discover what happened rather than "witness" reports, which are notoriously unreliable

[C.Flat]

Several witnesses

[FS1819]

Probably if he didn't brake and slammed on the throttle, the bus could avoid the train, just.

[OC Transpo 8238]

I've already heard different accounts from various sources- Stop the speculation until someone actually presents hard proof of what happens. Witness' aren't always reliable and I couldn't care how many you say. You weren't there and neither was I, but I'm not throwing out allegations of what happened.

[RailBus63]

Do VIA trains have head-end cameras?

[GM5000]

Probably if he didn't brake and slammed on the throttle, the bus could avoid the train, just.

Transport Canada wants to speak to you about your clairvoyance....

Do VIA trains have head-end cameras?

Yes - but it has been noted elsewhere that his particular unit (915) has not been retrofitted yet.

[TheAverageJoe]

WOW! Apparently 5 fatalities

6 now

[rollsign29]

Probably if he didn't brake and slammed on the throttle, the bus could avoid the train, just.

Yes, because accelerating to try and beat a train, not to mention with a bus, is one of the best time saving, safety conscious decisions possible in this situation.

I'm gonna call you Darwin from now on, ok?

[38 Highland Creek]

_{Saw it on CP24 this morning, the bus involved in the fatal crash is numbered 8017. The front end is completely torn off from the impact, so I don't know its fate.}

[D. DeLarge]

Probably if he didn't brake and slammed on the throttle, the bus could avoid the train, just.

I'm not going to point out all the things wrong with that statement, I just really hope you never consider driving a bus as a career. This isn't Grand Theft Auto.

TSB photos up for anyone who hasn't seen them:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/tsbcanada

[skyfirenet]

Do VIA trains have head-end cameras?

The better question is, is that bus equipped with security cameras?

Probably if he didn't brake and slammed on the throttle, the bus could avoid the train, just.

Or the train would have slammed into the side of the bus rather than ripping the front off.

[FS1819]

I'm not going to point out all the things wrong with that statement, I just really hope you never consider driving a bus as a career. This isn't Grand Theft Auto.

TSB photos up for anyone who hasn't seen them:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/tsbcanada

Legal copy time. It depends on the position of the bus as the driver became aware of the incoming train. It depends on the speed of the bus and the train. Etc.

I admit these two things are not available yet.

*Edit: Right. I misunderstood the entire accident. I thought it were a moving train hitting a stationary bus stopped at the wrong place, based on another article I skimmed through.

Just ignore what I said previously. Sorry for the inconvenience caused.

*Edit 2: Wait. I don't understand how if it was the bus that hit the stationary train, how could the front left frame of the bus be bent like that?

How could the train derail yards away?

May the victims R.I.P.

[GM5000]

Legal copy time. It depends on the position of the bus as the driver became aware of the incoming train. It depends on the speed of the bus and the train. Etc.

I admit these two things are not available yet.

Hands up everyone who has ever been involved in a bus/train incident investigation (looks around....).

Okay, enough speculation the rest of you. People are dead.

[VIATrain95]

R.I.P. To all who have died.

[Bus_Medic]

The better question is, is that bus equipped with security cameras?

Or the train would have slammed into the side of the bus rather than ripping the front off.

Im concerned the dvr might have been destroyed in this case.

It's been my experience that they're typically located in the front end. And while robust, theyre nowhere near as durable as airline event recorders.

I guess we'll see.

[Transit Man]

My thoughts and prayers are to all of those affected today, and especially to the families that lost loved ones.

[GM5000]

*Edit 2: Wait. I don't understand how if it was the bus that hit the stationary train, how could the front left frame of the bus be bent like that?

How could the train derail yards away?

May the victims R.I.P.

greater than 90 degree crossing - work out the angles with your carboard bus and GO train and you will see how it is possible. Everything else is speculation.

[Bus_Medic]

Check and mate.

[Canucktunes]

Is there any level crossing barrier technology out there that would have halted the bus before it could cross the tracks ? Or do you think isolation is in order for the Transitway/Woodroffe Avenue ?

A six lane bridge, four to accommodate Woodroffe Ave and two to accommodate the Transitway, could be a solution if stronger barriers are not feasible.

The land surrounding this crossing is farmland and already owned by the Federal government so an overpass could be constructed with minimal disruption to both the rail and vehicular traffic by adding temporary roads with level crossings while the bridge is being constructed.

The underpass option would not be viable because of the flooding issues and related expenditures mentioned in this Ottawa Citizen article, which also discusses the unfortunate opposition to an overpass a decade ago.

[M.Wright]

Is there any level crossing barrier technology out there that would have halted the bus before it could cross the tracks ? Or do you think isolation is in order for the Transitway/Woodroffe Avenue ?

A six lane bridge, four to accommodate Woodroffe Ave and two to accommodate the Transitway, could be a solution if stronger barriers are not feasible.

The land surrounding this crossing is farmland and already owned by the Federal government so an overpass could be constructed with minimal disruption to both the rail and vehicular traffic by adding temporary roads with level crossings while the bridge is being constructed.

The underpass option would not be viable because of the flooding issues and related expenditures mentioned in this Ottawa Citizen article, which also discusses the unfortunate opposition to an overpass a decade ago.

It was planned, like mentioned in the article.

If they went with it, it'd be much better, and prevented this accident.

[RailBus63]

Is there any level crossing barrier technology out there that would have halted the bus before it could cross the tracks ? Or do you think isolation is in order for the Transitway/Woodroffe Avenue ?

A six lane bridge, four to accommodate Woodroffe Ave and two to accommodate the Transitway, could be a solution if stronger barriers are not feasible.

The land surrounding this crossing is farmland and already owned by the Federal government so an overpass could be constructed with minimal disruption to both the rail and vehicular traffic by adding temporary roads with level crossings while the bridge is being constructed.

The underpass option would not be viable because of the flooding issues and related expenditures mentioned in this Ottawa Citizen article, which also discusses the unfortunate opposition to an overpass a decade ago.

Separating road and rail is a very important safety consideration, but the bigger issue in this incident is why the bus operator failed to apply the brakes to stop at the crossing. An incapacitated operator could have killed people even if the rail crossing was clear.