Bombardier/Alstom Flexity Deliveries

[Orion V]

1 hour ago, drum118 said:

TTC went to Bombardier first to get a price to do the cars as well some sort of timetable. I am assuming Bombardier decided to do the work in NY as it would not have an impact on the delivery of the new fleet and the cars would be done in Thunder Bay after the last car left the production line.

Why would you say TTC not paying to have the cars rebuilt?? Why would TTC throw out 2 cars when they need them in the first place?? So many why's.

Just wondering why they don't seem to care to do these 2 units. Usually it's because they're either obligated to do it by contract of some form or the money is not enough to justify them doing it on schedule and they have other higher priority units to do first (or higher revenue / contracts to fulfill before they get to these two units). As you said it was originally suppose to be done in Q1 2020 afterall.

Unfortunately these 2 units are not part of the first 66 units with the defects otherwise there's more of a priority to do them as they'll hit 2 birds with 1 stone.

[Mar_AC_23]

They are probably focusing on the rewelding of those 67 units first before they start working on 4471 and 4478. That's just my thinking.

[smallspy]

13 hours ago, Orion V said:

Just wondering why they don't seem to care to do these 2 units. Usually it's because they're either obligated to do it by contract of some form or the money is not enough to justify them doing it on schedule and they have other higher priority units to do first (or higher revenue / contracts to fulfill before they get to these two units). As you said it was originally suppose to be done in Q1 2020 afterall.

Unfortunately these 2 units are not part of the first 66 units with the defects otherwise there's more of a priority to do them as they'll hit 2 birds with 1 stone.

There's another point to this that Dave doesn't seem to understand.

 

The cars have to be taken virtually completely apart to be properly decontaminated. And these are devices that aren't really designed to be taken apart to that level. Sure, you can remove the trucks, and the seats, and the interior panels. But a lot of the wiring and plumbing is going to have to be removed and in a lot of cases replaced, and I suspect that long lengths of it were not designed to be replaced for the life of the vehicle. It may even require that all-new materials were going to have to be sourced and made to replace them. Every single component below the window line is going to have to be removed and at the least thoroughly cleaned, if not replaced.

 

It was always going to take far longer to decontaminate these cars than it was to have to build a new one. And while yes, it seems like a long time to be without them, it may very well be that Bombardier has told the TTC "Screw this, it's just going to take us too long and you're not paying us enough. You'll get them when you get them." And in fairness, the TTC may have also told them "Look, we're not in a hurry. Just do them properly, and send them back when they're done."

 

2 hours ago, Shemar said:

They are probably focusing on the rewelding of those 67 units first before they start working on 4471 and 4478. That's just my thinking.

They're being done at different facilities, and by different staff. There's no correlation between the two projects.

 

Dan

[drum118]

4439 has re-enter service on 504A after being off loaded  June 23 (40 Days)

[drum118]

TTC should be off loading 4423 this week as it is now in Agincourt Yard. Only 135 days so far with 4424 behind it. The plant holiday shut down must be over or CN and CP found space to ship the car. 

Looks like it maybe around the 2nd week in Sept now for the car to re-enter service

[7749]

4442 has arrived at the New Streetcar Way at around 9:40 this morning (Hillcrest). There were also 2 Flexities on a flatbed on a train passing by, couldn't get both of the unit #.

[drum118]

1 hour ago, 7749 said:

4442 has arrived at the New Streetcar Way at around 9:40 this morning (Hillcrest). There were also 2 Flexities on a flatbed on a train passing by, couldn't get both of the unit #.

That should be 4424 as 4442 has not been ship yet and most likely take a spot on a car for its trip soon.

4432, 4433 and 4436 still has to be ship along with 4441. Then its up to TTC to say X will be next.

The other 2 must be 4423 and 4428 that you saw since 4423 was seen in Agincourt the last few days.

Edited August 3, 2021 by drum118

[7749]

6 hours ago, drum118 said:

That should be 4424 as 4442 has not been ship yet and most likely take a spot on a car for its trip soon.

4432, 4433 and 4436 still has to be ship along with 4441. Then its up to TTC to say X will be next.

The other 2 must be 4423 and 4428 that you saw since 4423 was seen in Agincourt the last few days.

No, i'm sure it was 4442. I checked the fleet #. There is also this photo from insta which is exactly where Streetcar Way is:  https://www.instagram.com/p/CSIS8felyeH/?utm_medium=copy_link

[drum118]

1 hour ago, 7749 said:

No, i'm sure it was 4442. I checked the fleet #. There is also this photo from insta which is exactly where Streetcar Way is:  https://www.instagram.com/p/CSIS8felyeH/?utm_medium=copy_link

It going for a ride unless we have miss it leaving months ago. I don't have it on my list nor wiki leaving, but not the first time I miss something. An extra flat must had been drop off to get 4442.

I guess 4423 and 4424 are in Lambton now.

4402 could be in service this week since it been 35 day since it arrived. been 28 days since 4420 arrived and 16 days for 4422

[Orion V]

Maybe ttc rider can enlighten us on when 4442 left TTC property months ago?

The cptdb wiki updates mostly from members drum118 and ttc rider reporting as most of us don't follow these.

[ttc rider]

To clarify - everyone is actually correct!

Car 4442 is off property as of this morning (i.e. Tue, Aug 3, 2021).

Car 4442 made its way to Hillcrest under its own power this morning.

Car 4566 was used to load car 4442 onto railcar transporter XTTX 137329 for the trip to La Pocatiere.

The last day of service for car 4442 was Saturday, July 24 on the abridged 504 King route (Springhurst Loop to Cherry Loop).

Of note, railcar transporter XTTX 137329 has been sitting at the loading dock at Hillcrest since July 16, when the previous car (#4422) was re-delivered back to the TTC.

XTTX 137329 never left the loading dock at Hillcrest after car 4422 was unloaded three days later, on July 19,

 

 

[ttc rider]

Car 4442 (transporter XTTX 137329) has yet to be picked up from Hillcrest by CP after being loaded up for transport to Quebec on Aug 3, 2021.

Car 4423 (transporter XTTX 142012) and car 4424 (transporter ITTX 940774) have returned to Toronto after retrofits were completed.

Both have been sitting in CP's Lambton Yard since Tuesday, Aug 3, 2021, with delivery to Hilcrest pending.

[ttc rider]

CP has picked up transporter XTTX 137329, carrying car 4442 from Hillcrest early yesterday morning (i.e. Friday, Aug 6). 

In turn, car 4423 (tranporter XTTX 142012) was delivered to Hillcrest yesterday, as well - currently sitting at the loading dock, to be offloaded early next week.

[7749]

28 minutes ago, ttc rider said:

CP has picked up transporter XTTX 137329, carrying car 4442 from Hillcrest early yesterday morning (i.e. Friday, Aug 6). 

In turn, car 4423 (tranporter XTTX 142012) was delivered to Hillcrest yesterday, as well - currently sitting at the loading dock, to be offloaded early next week.

Yea I forgot to mention that 4442 isnt at that Streetcar Way track anymore and another flexity is there now.

[7749]

4446 has been moved onto the SCW track while 4423 has been moved near Harvey

[ttc rider]

8 hours ago, 7749 said:

4446 has been moved onto the SCW track while 4423 has been moved near Harvey

That is correct!

Car 4423 is back on property as of today (i.e. Tue, Aug 10, 2021). It was towed off the railcar transporter XTTX 142012 by car 4466 at Hillcrest this morning.

To recap, car 4423 had been loaded up for transport to La Pocatiere, QC on Tue, Mar 26, 2021, for a total turnaround time of 140 days, or 20 weeks.

Car 4423 remains at Hillcrest for now, most likely returning to Leslie tomorrow (Aug 11) in the afternoon.

In turn, car 4446 is off-property as of this morning. It headed to Hillcrest under its own power earlier this morning, and after car 4423 had come off, car 4466 was used to load it onto the same transporter (XTTX 142012) for the trip to La Pocatiere, QC.

The last day of service for car 4446 was Friday, July 30 on 506 Carlton.

[drum118]

Don't know if 4424 is at the dock for off loading and if 4428 or 4429 have arrived in Toronto. 4428 is 123 days and 4429 at 101 days.

These are the only legal shots I could get of La Pocatiere QC plant now own by Alstom. Any other shots would be illegal unless invited on site or with a drone.

 

[7749]

2 hours ago, drum118 said:

Don't know if 4424 is at the dock for off loading and if 4428 or 4429 have arrived in Toronto. 4428 is 123 days and 4429 at 101 days.

These are the only legal shots I could get of La Pocatiere QC plant now own by Alstom. Any other shots would be illegal unless invited on site or with a drone.

 

4424 has been loaded at SCW, 4446 has went elsewhere

[drum118]

11 hours ago, 7749 said:

4424 has been loaded at SCW, 4446 has went elsewhere

4446 went to Quebec like all the other ones. I am assuming SCW is the dock for Hillcrest and 4424 hasn't been off loaded yet.

4466 is at the north end of Hillcrest yard

[bus_7246]

4466 is parked there for collision repair from the streetcar on streetcar collision at College & Spadina 

4 hours ago, drum118 said:

4466 is at the north end of Hillcrest yard

 

[drum118]

4424 has finally been off loaded 7 days after 4423 and 139 days since it was loaded onto the flat.

Hard to say, but looks like 4422 is ready to re-enter service  after 30 days and ahead of 4402 that still having issues after 50 days with 4420 at 43 days.

Is 4428 in town as it is the next one to show up at 128.

Then, TTC will have a lots of cars as spare if Metrolinx gets its way by closing the Queen Line down for 5 years to do the Ontario Line between Bay and Victoria.

[Cityflyer]

44 minutes ago, drum118 said:

4424 has finally been off loaded 7 days after 4423 and 139 days since it was loaded onto the flat.

Hard to say, but looks like 4422 is ready to re-enter service  after 30 days and ahead of 4402 that still having issues after 50 days with 4420 at 43 days.

Is 4428 in town as it is the next one to show up at 128.

Then, TTC will have a lots of cars as spare if Metrolinx gets its way by closing the Queen Line down for 5 years to do the Ontario Line between Bay and Victoria.

Why would TTC have lots of spare cars for 501 if they plan to divert streetcars using Richmond Adelaide during those 5 years? If anything, it'll add more cars on 501 to compensate for the longer travel time resulting in longer frequency of service.

[drum118]

15 minutes ago, Cityflyer said:

Why would TTC have lots of spare cars for 501 if they plan to divert streetcars using Richmond Adelaide during those 5 years? If anything, it'll add more cars on 501 to compensate for the longer travel time resulting in longer frequency of service.

That should have been not many spares.

[nfitz]

6 hours ago, drum118 said:

That should have been not many spares.

Hopefully the welding repairs and flood-damaged units are all in service by then. And the extra 60 streetcars are supposed to start arriving in Q1 2023 (averaging about 2 cars per month ... though presumably back-end loaded).

[7749]

9 hours ago, drum118 said:

4424 has finally been off loaded 7 days after 4423 and 139 days since it was loaded onto the flat.

Hard to say, but looks like 4422 is ready to re-enter service  after 30 days and ahead of 4402 that still having issues after 50 days with 4420 at 43 days.

Is 4428 in town as it is the next one to show up at 128.

Then, TTC will have a lots of cars as spare if Metrolinx gets its way by closing the Queen Line down for 5 years to do the Ontario Line between Bay and Victoria.

Yup now 4450 has been loaded at SCW, approximately 9 am