Winnipeg Transit and area

[MMP15]

37 minutes ago, SirAndrew710 said:

I’m surprised they’d replace it, seeing as social distancing is still important. Cases may be down, but the virus isn’t gone.

Me too, but having both signs would be way too cumbersome. Social distancing signage is more important inside the bus than outside. Also I think "Operating Saturday Service" will be much more effective in making people who don't need to ride the bus not ride it, because people know how bad Saturday service is.

15 minutes ago, Isaac Williams said:

Social distancing is pretty much a thing of the past now.

Not according to the Manitoba Government, we still gotta bear with it. We're getting there though.

[SirAndrew710]

21 minutes ago, MMP15 said:

Me too, but having both signs would be way too cumbersome. Social distancing signage is more important inside the bus than outside.

True, though social distancing rules apply off of buses as well.

21 minutes ago, MMP15 said:

Also I think "Operating Saturday Service" will be much more effective in making people who don't need to ride the bus not ride it, because people know how bad Saturday service is.

It could be worse. It could be Sunday service.

[Wpgtransit11-25]

8 hours ago, SirAndrew710 said:

True, though social distancing rules apply off of buses as well.

It could be worse. It could be Sunday service.

There’s also a sign that says Social distancing required but only have seen the practice social distancing and my buddy once signed up the operating Saturday and the operating Sunday service sign 

[Isaac Williams]

2 hours ago, Wpgtransit11-25 said:

There’s also a sign that says Social distancing required but only have seen the practice social distancing and my buddy once signed up the operating Saturday and the operating Sunday service sign 

I'm pretty sure I saw Social Distancing Required one time. Might've been on a training bus, but I don't know.

10 hours ago, SirAndrew710 said:

It could be worse. It could be Sunday service.

It's pretty impressive how horrific the Sunday schedule is. The Saturday schedule is (mostly) tolerable, and still has routes like the 21 and 24 Ness Express. But the Sunday schedule is simply inexcusable in 2020. One time I had a Saturday-Sunday sleepover at a friend's house near Westmount/Fermor. On the Sunday morning, I used Navigo to see what I could do to get home, and I was getting results with a duration of like 90 minutes..... when theoretically I could take 1 bus to get home (16). I don't remember really what the results were, but I suspect it wanted me to start with a 19, which is closer, instead of walking to the 16.

[ConnorsCompShow]

19 hours ago, Wpgtransit11-25 said:

They need city council approval before they can activate the red or blue emergency service 

Holy crap...that kind of defeats the purpose if control can't just snap their fingers and put it into place when they feel a need to use it.

1 hour ago, Isaac Williams said:

I'm pretty sure I saw Social Distancing Required one time. Might've been on a training bus, but I don't know.

It's pretty impressive how horrific the Sunday schedule is. The Saturday schedule is (mostly) tolerable, and still has routes like the 21 and 24 Ness Express. But the Sunday schedule is simply inexcusable in 2020. One time I had a Saturday-Sunday sleepover at a friend's house near Westmount/Fermor. On the Sunday morning, I used Navigo to see what I could do to get home, and I was getting results with a duration of like 90 minutes..... when theoretically I could take 1 bus to get home (16). I don't remember really what the results were, but I suspect it wanted me to start with a 19, which is closer, instead of walking to the 16.

I'm also with you on Saturdays being tolerable. They're nothing compared to Sundays.

[SirAndrew710]

2 hours ago, Isaac Williams said:

It's pretty impressive how horrific the Sunday schedule is. The Saturday schedule is (mostly) tolerable, and still has routes like the 21 and 24 Ness Express. But the Sunday schedule is simply inexcusable in 2020. One time I had a Saturday-Sunday sleepover at a friend's house near Westmount/Fermor. On the Sunday morning, I used Navigo to see what I could do to get home, and I was getting results with a duration of like 90 minutes..... when theoretically I could take 1 bus to get home (16). I don't remember really what the results were, but I suspect it wanted me to start with a 19, which is closer, instead of walking to the 16.

Not to mention that the 66 doesn’t run out to Unicity on Sundays, so if a Charleswood resident wanted to go to Wal-Mart on a Sunday morning, they’d have to take the 79 to Polo and wait up to half an hour for an 11 St. Charles or a 24 when it would be a quick ride on the 66 otherwise. At least in the afternoon, there’s some semblance of timed transfers between the 79 and 24. With regards to the 16, it doesn’t run to Island Lakes at all on Sundays, so it would be a long walk to Southdale Centre to catch a 16 (unless you want to arrange a DART pickup from Beaverhill and ride it as far as Lakewood and Vermillion). I wonder why it wouldn’t suggest riding a 19 to Cottonwood and Drake and grabbing a 16 there.

[Isaac Williams]

Rode the 24 from downtown to Polo, and there were maybe 3 or 4 others on the bus, and 1 person boarded at Polo. But rode the 21 from Polo to Downtown (Bus 659), and it was still relatively packed. Also had 1 drop off at a non-express stop.

[SirAndrew710]

2 minutes ago, Isaac Williams said:

Rode the 24 from downtown to Polo, and there were maybe 3 or 4 others on the bus, and 1 person boarded at Polo. But rode the 21 from Polo to Downtown (Bus 659), and it was still relatively packed. Also had 1 drop off at a non-express stop.

My experience is that even when we’re not in the midst of a global pandemic, the 24 is oftentimes a lot emptier than the 21. The Portage Ave express routes always seem to be pretty busy as well. A Calgary bus on an all-day 21? That doesn’t often happen during a regular schedule period.

[wt_enthusiast_photos]

10 minutes ago, SirAndrew710 said:

My experience is that even when we’re not in the midst of a global pandemic, the 24 is oftentimes a lot emptier than the 21. The Portage Ave express routes always seem to be pretty busy as well. A Calgary bus on an all-day 21? That doesn’t often happen during a regular schedule period.

641 and 659 are on the 21

[Wpgtransit11-25]

14 minutes ago, SirAndrew710 said:

My experience is that even when we’re not in the midst of a global pandemic, the 24 is oftentimes a lot emptier than the 21. The Portage Ave express routes always seem to be pretty busy as well. A Calgary bus on an all-day 21? That doesn’t often happen during a regular schedule period.

There old tired bus and when it starts getting closer to plus 40 we’re gonna start to really hate them and want AC

[SirAndrew710]

5 minutes ago, Wpgtransit11-25 said:

There old tired bus and when it starts getting closer to plus 40 we’re gonna start to really hate them and want AC

Here’s hoping dispatch cleans up their act and starts putting LFRs and XD40s on the all-day work by then. How many more new 400s have been delivered?

[Isaac Williams]

There is also 649 on Route 1. Yes, 649 on the 1.

[tctf101]

37 minutes ago, SirAndrew710 said:

Here’s hoping dispatch cleans up their act and starts putting LFRs and XD40s on the all-day work by then. How many more new 400s have been delivered?

Part of the reason there’s old buses out all day is because NG is closed so there’s less buses also it depends on how buses are parked the day before to determine what goes out 

[Isaac Williams]

I was out in downtown today, and I noticed that buses were still being signed as 22 and 25. TBH, what's the point? The 22 is identical to the 21, and the 25 is identical to the 24, with the "all stops" thing. The 21 doesn't even end at Grace Hospital during rush hour. Might as well sign as 21 and 24 ("Ness-Portage"?) respectively (the run cards can stay the same, because that doesn't matter too much). Andrew also suggested signing the 21 and 22 as 11, though I disagree.

In fact, going back to the 24 Ness-Portage thing, here's what the display could look like.

[SirAndrew710]

1 hour ago, Isaac Williams said:

I was out in downtown today, and I noticed that buses were still being signed as 22 and 25. TBH, what's the point? The 22 is identical to the 21, and the 25 is identical to the 24, with the "all stops" thing. The 21 doesn't even end at Grace Hospital during rush hour. Might as well sign as 21 and 24 ("Ness-Portage"?) respectively (the run cards can stay the same, because that doesn't matter too much). Andrew also suggested signing the 21 and 22 as 11, though I disagree.

In fact, going back to the 24 Ness-Portage thing, here's what the display could look like.

Why would it need to say “Ness-Portage?” The current 24 doesn’t say “DOWNTOWN… VIA PORTAGE.” Wouldn’t “24 NESS DOWNTOWN” be appropriate?

[Isaac Williams]

13 minutes ago, SirAndrew710 said:

Why would it need to say “Ness-Portage?” The current 24 doesn’t say “DOWNTOWN… VIA PORTAGE.” Wouldn’t “24 NESS DOWNTOWN” be appropriate?

For the 24 Express, it makes sense for it to not say Portage. But for the 24 NON-EXPRESS, it would make some sense, like the 47 Transcona-Pembina, or the 16 Selkirk-Osborne, 20 Academy-Watt, etc.

[SirAndrew710]

15 hours ago, Isaac Williams said:

For the 24 Express, it makes sense for it to not say Portage. But for the 24 NON-EXPRESS, it would make some sense, like the 47 Transcona-Pembina, or the 16 Selkirk-Osborne, 20 Academy-Watt, etc.

The difference is the 10, 11, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 and new 47 travel straight through downtown while the 24 does not. No other mainline route that doesn’t run straight through downtown and doesn’t access downtown via the street it’s named for has a different name when headed inbound (i.e. inbound 43s aren’t signed “43 PROVENCHER”).

[Wpgtransit11-25]

5 hours ago, SirAndrew710 said:

The difference is the 10, 11, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 and new 47 travel straight through downtown while the 24 does not. No other mainline route that doesn’t run straight through downtown and doesn’t access downtown via the street it’s named for has a different name when headed inbound (i.e. inbound 43s aren’t signed “43 PROVENCHER”).

I agree 

[Isaac Williams]

There's the 23 Broadway-William, 26 Logan-Berry, 29 Sherbrook-Stafford, 676 Bridgwater-River Road. I'm not sure how the 23 is signed, but I know the 29 is signed "STAFFORD" when going to Beaumont, and "SHERBROOK" when going to Logan, and the 676 is signed "BRIDGWATER" when going to Center Street, and "RIVER ROAD" when going to St. Vital. The 29 and 676 don't pass through downtown. So there you go.

[SirAndrew710]

35 minutes ago, Isaac Williams said:

There's the 23 Broadway-William, 26 Logan-Berry, 29 Sherbrook-Stafford, 676 Bridgwater-River Road. I'm not sure how the 23 is signed, but I know the 29 is signed "STAFFORD" when going to Beaumont, and "SHERBROOK" when going to Logan, and the 676 is signed "BRIDGWATER" when going to Center Street, and "RIVER ROAD" when going to St. Vital. The 29 and 676 don't pass through downtown. So there you go.

The 26 is signed “LOGAN BERRY” (love that name) in both directions, but you’re right, those others do seem to go against long-established naming traditions. My guess is their logic is that Portage Ave is to the 23 and 29 what downtown is to those other routes that I mentioned earlier, with the BLUE line and 676 having a similar relationship (I would consider the 29 to be a feeder route - doesn’t enter downtown and my experience with that route is that most take it to either Portage or Grant), but I don’t know for sure.

[SirAndrew710]

The 2020 route map has been uploaded and I’ve already spotted a few errors. The 635 is in red instead of green, there’s still red along South Donald despite no routes using that corridor, there’s green along University Crescent despite no feeders accessing the U of M that way and there are a few errors in the area of the Fort Garry Industrial Park (for instance, the 694 doesn’t run in both directions on Clarence). https://winnipegtransit.com/assets/2655/2020_Route_Map_4.pdf

[Isaac Williams]

3 hours ago, SirAndrew710 said:

The 2020 route map has been uploaded and I’ve already spotted a few errors. The 635 is in red instead of green, there’s still red along South Donald despite no routes using that corridor, there’s green along University Crescent despite no feeders accessing the U of M that way and there are a few errors in the area of the Fort Garry Industrial Park (for instance, the 694 doesn’t run in both directions on Clarence). https://winnipegtransit.com/assets/2655/2020_Route_Map_4.pdf

Also the 29 is red, despite no longer having a downtown branch. Yeah, Sherbrook/Maryland are on the Downtown map, but that's a bit of a stretch IMO. It certainly doesn't enter the exchange district. Also, the 47 is listed with no name (Should be "Transcona-Pembina"), and the 29 is listed as just "Sherbrook", instead of "Sherbrook-Stafford". The 78 is also still listed as "Crosstown West".

[armorand]

12 hours ago, Isaac Williams said:

Also the 29 is red, despite no longer having a downtown branch. Yeah, Sherbrook/Maryland are on the Downtown map, but that's a bit of a stretch IMO. It certainly doesn't enter the exchange district. Also, the 47 is listed with no name (Should be "Transcona-Pembina"), and the 29 is listed as just "Sherbrook", instead of "Sherbrook-Stafford". The 78 is also still listed as "Crosstown West".

Ever since the 2000s, WT hasn't been keeping the maps up-to-date at all. Its really not that hard... is it? 

[DavidW]

10 hours ago, armorand said:

Ever since the 2000s, WT hasn't been keeping the maps up-to-date at all. Its really not that hard... is it? 

When Winnipeg Transit abandoned printing system maps they largely gave up trying to keep the [pdf] map up-to-date or accurate. There just doesn't seem to be any priority left for the map.

I was told, point blank, that "most people can't read a map" by one senior transit administrator. There is a kind of two dimensional dyslexia which some people have. When they look at a complex graphic such as a map they only see an indecipherable jumble of lines and shapes. I don't know how common it is but I've always surmised that the people making decisions about a Winnipeg Transit map believed their perceptions and experiences were "typical" rather than unusual.

[Isaac Williams]

55 minutes ago, DavidW said:

I was told, point blank, that "most people can't read a map" by one senior transit administrator. There is a kind of two dimensional dyslexia which some people have. When they look at a complex graphic such as a map they only see an indecipherable jumble of lines and shapes.

Was that person also a comedian? I don't doubt it exists, but it's certainly not common at all. I've never encountered a person who couldn't read something as simple a map.