Air conditioning problems for the TTC vehicles (buses, subways)

[raptorjays]

http://www.ttc.ca/Customer_Service/Line_2_subway_cars.jsp

TTC posted about this issue on the website..

Man.. 25% of the subway cars? That's just too many

[raptorjays]

On 6/29/2016 at 10:04 PM, Xtrazsteve said:

5052 was an oven in the 5th position of the train. The guard was opening doors on the last car.

Hint, if you see the guard not in their regular location, the AC might be broken in that car. For me, instead of whining and trying to survive the oven, I just ran to the next car at the next station. Problem solved!

Today, I was on the car 5218, and it was in the 5th position of the train.

There were NO A/C and the car was boiling, and the guard was opening doors inside that hot car. (Which is a bit surprising)

I eventually moved to the last car. It had A/C, but not as strong as usual.

[H4 5600]

Today I was at Kipling, and I saw the first train leaving had SCS, working AC, and a bad operator, but the second train had no SCS and no AC, and a good operator. I chose the second train, man it was hot.

[16 McCowan]

Was on car #5043 on Line 2 and its like a sauna inside. Moved to #5042 where its too cozy and cool. 

[raptorjays]

https://stevemunro.ca/2016/07/07/air-conditioning-as-an-optional-extra/

Steve Munro is also criticizing this issue on his personal blog. He said that the problem is the worst in his memory.

He also suggested to put few spare TR trains during rush hour.. (Which I think is not going to happen)

and the most important part is that

The TTC makes a big point of publicizing its Customer Satisfaction stats and trumpeting how strong they are (although we only have numbers to 2016Q1). Hand-wringing over lost ridership is their new passtime, and yet some issues, including failing AC units, are not even mentioned in the staff report on this subject.

It is simply not credible that the TTC is unable, with some juggling of its fleet, to field enough trains where all six cars have AC on the BD line while they get the rest back in proper shape.

All that is needed is the will to organize service around rider comfort.

I agree with his statement. I really think that TTC also need to think about their riders as well.

Subway cars without A/C in this weather can cause health and safety issues.

I'm keep mentioning that TTC is a form of 'service'. In the most service related industries, customers are always the first priority. Therefore, TTC better focus on reliable service and rider comfort. I think the AC issue is one of the reasons why the TTC is losing riders.

[leylandvictory2]

at least one rt car doesn't have a/c unfortunately, I forgot which one it is.  

Sure you can put TR on Line 2.  However, the BD operators haven't train on the TR yet.  I doubt the a/c is the issue of losing customers.  I have seen people board from the back of the buses without permission.  Lots of people just put in 3 bucks and some will tell me bs stories as why they can't afford the fare.  

[raptorjays]

1 hour ago, leylandvictory2 said:

at least one rt car doesn't have a/c unfortunately, I forgot which one it is.  

Sure you can put TR on Line 2.  However, the BD operators haven't train on the TR yet.  I doubt the a/c is the issue of losing customers.  I have seen people board from the back of the buses without permission.  Lots of people just put in 3 bucks and some will tell me bs stories as why they can't afford the fare.  

So if you're right, that means Mr. Munro is wrong?

He said on his blog post that " And, yes, before someone kvetches, I know that the BD operators would have to be trained to drive the TRs, but many probably know already, and not every crew needs this."

He says most of the BD operators know how to do it.. 

On 6/25/2016 at 7:12 AM, Neil said:

here's the list if you're interested of broken a/c units:

5000, 02, 03,11, 14, 20, 21, 23, 25, 26, 33, 34, 38, 39, 43, 52, 57, 58, 60, 67, 71, 78, 79, 80, 87, 97

5102, 05, 07, 10, 11, 13, 24, 39, 42, 46, 48, 51, 67, 73, 75, 77, 82, 83, 86, 99

5202, 10, 11, 12, 16, 18, 40, 42, 44, 45, 46, 49, 54, 59, 61, 65, 68, 292

5307,13, 15, 21, 22, 25, 45, 54, 61, 62, 68, 69

 

Also, I'm finding more units without A/C other than that..

Today, I was on 5016 and it didn't have A/C.. so I moved to 5017 (which was cool)

[T3G]

1 hour ago, raptorjays said:

So if you're right, that means Mr. Munro is wrong?

He said on his blog post that " And, yes, before someone kvetches, I know that the BD operators would have to be trained to drive the TRs, but many probably know already, and not every crew needs this."

He says most of the BD operators know how to do it.. 

Driver schooling isn't the only issue. Apparently, there's some clearance issues around the Greenwood yard portals that would prevent them from running out of that yard. Heaven only knows what they'll do when the time comes for the T1s to be replaced.

[raptorjays]

On Sunday (yesterday), I was riding the subway from Ossington to Islington, and the first car I got on didn't have A/C..

I do understand that they cannot put them out of service because they need a lot of subway cars during rush hours..

However, I don't understand why they put those hot cars even on the weekend?

Mr. Steve Munro is also thinking it is ridiculous in one of the comment on his post.

"Even more ridiculous is that a hot car is in service on Sunday when they need about half of the peak fleet."

I just cannot understand why the TTC is let the riders suffer from the hot car..

They are not smart enough to operate public transit in the city.. I doubt even 6 year old kids can operate better than current operations.

I know it is kinda late, but they need to come up with better solution.. like putting few TRs (like 2 or 3) during rush hours.. or remove hot cars AT LEAST on the weekends.

 

[raptorjays]

http://www.citynews.ca/2016/07/12/qa-ttcs-brad-ross-talks-sweltering-subway-cars/

Glad that this issue is finally on the news. I was one of many people sent the email about this issue on the news channel..

TTC is just too stupid on managing and maintaining their fleets.. I know they don't have enough trains for rush hours, but I don't want hot cars to run during the weekend when only half of the fleets are needed (Steve Munro said same thing)

This situation is very shameful and disgraceful as well.. They are part of service industry and I can easily give them F grade on the service

[nfitz]

TTC put the information on the front of their website about 3 weeks ago.  And the media reported on it then - see http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ttc-hot-subway-cars-air-conditioning-1.3655494

Not sure why CITY is so slow to the game ... but I guess that's what happens when you keep laying off your staff.

[Ed T.]

9151 on Keele with no A/C.

I notice that the roof hatch on these buses no longer says "push up for ventilation". I was tempted to pop it up anyway. Not sure if the operator would notice, being a bus and a half away.

[raptorjays]

2 hours ago, nfitz said:

TTC put the information on the front of their website about 3 weeks ago.  And the media reported on it then - see http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ttc-hot-subway-cars-air-conditioning-1.3655494

Not sure why CITY is so slow to the game ... but I guess that's what happens when you keep laying off your staff.

but yesterday was one of the first news shown on the television

[nfitz]

5 minutes ago, raptorjays said:

but yesterday was one of the first news shown on the television

Sure?  I seldom ever watch TV news, but I thought I saw something mentioned on CFTO a couple of weeks ago.

[dayone]

Hot T1 cars were one of the top stories yesterday on CTV news. They showed the cars being repaired at Greenwood yard and talked to technicians. If you didn't catch it, watch it on CTV Toronto's website.

[Bus_Medic]

4 hours ago, Ed T. said:

9151 on Keele with no A/C.

I notice that the roof hatch on these buses no longer says "push up for ventilation". I was tempted to pop it up anyway. Not sure if the operator would notice, being a bus and a half away.

#1 and #3 hatches are motorized, it's not great for the mechanism if you try to open it manually.

 

but hey, more job security for me. ?

[Ed T.]

15 minutes ago, Bus_Medic said:

#1 and #3 hatches are motorized, it's not great for the mechanism if you try to open it manually.

 

but hey, more job security for me. ?

That's only on the Novas? Hmm, would have to request op to open them. I can't imagine 9151 being out in (official) 35º heat, though, without A/C.

[Bus_Medic]

Don't worry about it.

[raptorjays]

On Saturday, June 25, 2016 at 7:12 AM, Neil said:

here's the list if you're interested of broken a/c units:

5000, 02, 03,11, 14, 20, 21, 23, 25, 26, 33, 34, 38, 39, 43, 52, 57, 58, 60, 67, 71, 78, 79, 80, 87, 97

5102, 05, 07, 10, 11, 13, 24, 39, 42, 46, 48, 51, 67, 73, 75, 77, 82, 83, 86, 99

5202, 10, 11, 12, 16, 18, 40, 42, 44, 45, 46, 49, 54, 59, 61, 65, 68, 292

5307,13, 15, 21, 22, 25, 45, 54, 61, 62, 68, 69

 

Add 5335 to the list

[leylandvictory2]

you should submit the list to TTc customer service. 

[raptorjays]

Although they are taking actions for this problem.. I don't know if they can take cars without AC out at least on the weekend. Are they short on fleets even on the weekend?

[leylandvictory2]

It probably takes longer than just one weekend to fix hence 25 percent of the fleet is experiencing  problem.

[eja2k]

3 hours ago, raptorjays said:

Although they are taking actions for this problem.. I don't know if they can take cars without AC out at least on the weekend. Are they short on fleets even on the weekend?

Part of the problem is the fact that the cars are in married pairs... the amount of shuffling that would be required to make an all air conditioned set of trains for the weekend, then break them apart for a 'every lead and trailing car has A/C' train for the week day would likely be logistically and cost prohibitive.  

[Ed T.]

14 hours ago, eja2k said:

Part of the problem is the fact that the cars are in married pairs... the amount of shuffling that would be required to make an all air conditioned set of trains for the weekend, then break them apart for a 'every lead and trailing car has A/C' train for the week day would likely be logistically and cost prohibitive.  

Well, if randomly 25% of the cars have non-working A/C, then there's a 75% chance that A/C will be working. However, with married pairs, it's .75*.75 = .56, or 56%. Which means that 44% of married pairs will have one or both cars with non-functional A/C.

[6254]

The actual % may be lower as the units with A/C problems are likely sidelined during the summer months. If 90 cars (roughly 360*25%) do not have A/C running, the summer service reduction, for example, cuts 3 trains or 18 cars; then only 72 cars are required to stay in service in rush hours. Therefore the actual % cars with non-working A/C that are in service should be lower, maybe 20%.