faw Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 I am a new member to this forum so please allow me to introduce myself. My name is Paul and I am working with a U of T student Eric to create a map of all current and abandoned class 1 railways, interurbans and streetcar lines in the southern Ontario region. Our map is in a digital format using .kml/.kmz file system and can be used with any programme that runs this type of file such as ARC Globe or Google Earth. We are using Google Earth for the backdrop to our map. Both of the aformentioned programmes are free to use as is our map. Anyone can download the map file at the following site: http://individual.utoronto.ca/sorailmap/ All the neccessary information on how to use the map file is on the website. Anyone who has an issue with running the file can contact us here or through our website. My purpose for joining this forum is to spread the word about our map and to get input/critizism regarding the information contained in the map itself. We believe that this is the first time a comprehensive map of all southern Ontario rail systems has been assembled. Our goal is to provide rail enthusiasts and historians a one stop place to find the locations and routes of their favorite rail lines. We are also including station locations, current ownership and usage and general histories of each of the lines. We also wish to solicit from the good members here at this forum any information that may improve or correct the the work we are doing. Information such as maps of track layouts, station names and locations, roundhouses and turntables, workshops, sidings, spurs, yards etcetera is needed. Anyone who provides us with good information will be credited on our website for their help. We can go into great detail and I urge anyone who uses the map to look closely at the TTC system, the Niagara St. Catharines and Toronto system, downtown Lindsay CNR, the Ottawa streetcar system and the Brantford street railway to see how much detail we can achieve. We try to update our work regularly as time and information permits. Specifically, we need information or maps for streetcar lines in Windsor, London, Kingston, Peterborough, Belleville, Chatham, St. Thomas, Sarnia, and Sudbury. Information such as double trackage, intersection layouts, passing tracks, loops and connections to interurban and class 1 railways is especially needed for all systems. We hope you will enjoy and use our map and that you might find the time to contribute your knowledge to our project. Paul, Co-author, Southern Ontario Railway map project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aztek985 Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Hey welcome to CPTDB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted January 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Hey welcome to CPTDB! thank you kyle w! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallspy Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Paul, You and Eric may want to get in touch with a user here - his handle is Orion7029 - who has been working on a similar project over the past several months. Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted January 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Paul,You and Eric may want to get in touch with a user here - his handle is Orion7029 - who has been working on a similar project over the past several months. Dan thank you dan, i did a search, but could not locate him. any suggestions? paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRT_BMT_IND Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Any reason the Toronto subway is not included? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted January 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 Any reason the Toronto subway is not included? the ttc is already down and on the map. please download the file and observe our work. if you are a ttc fan or historian or you know of someone that is please get them in touch with us, we need some help with where double trackage existed on the abandoned lines (harbord street, weston, rogers road, etcetera. thank you for your interest. paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallspy Posted January 23, 2009 Report Share Posted January 23, 2009 thank you dan, i did a search, but could not locate him. any suggestions?paul My apologies - his handle has a space in it, making it "Orion 7029". http://www.cptdb.ca/index.php?showuser=82 Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollsign29 Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 My apologies - his handle has a space in it, making it "Orion 7029".http://www.cptdb.ca/index.php?showuser=82 Dan That's my name. I've been doing a similar project and have slowed a bit in its work, as I try to do entire lines once I have the resources for it (like high-resolution imagery). Thus far I've done a lot of lines in southern and eastern ontario, and would like to get finished on some other key lines (like Booth's Ottawa, Arnprior & Parry Sound btwn Whitney and Madawaska, and the Algoma Eastern btwn Sudbury and Little Current). I have the availability of every topo map in Canada in high-res, but it's aligning this to the imagery in Google Earth which is the pain. A great resource that I've been using is a lot of history books, but in particular the "Steam" series of CNR history books by Ian Wilson, as there are a lot of track maps that allow for additional detail to be made to the route alignments. I intend on doing some additional work in the next few weeks, but at some point I can provide what I've done so far. Unlike the whole "abandoned railways" and "active railways" I've been trying to do mine just as "railways as they were built (regardless of whether they're abandoned or not) which allows for more interesting amd easier to draw routes. It also allows me to do some research for once too! Attached is an overview of everything (including some work I did on Cape Breton Island, loaded with former mining railways in/around Glace Bay), as well as a blow-up of Tillsonburg (you were looking at details of the old alignment). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted January 24, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 That's my name.I've been doing a similar project and have slowed a bit in its work, as I try to do entire lines once I have the resources for it (like high-resolution imagery). Thus far I've done a lot of lines in southern and eastern ontario, and would like to get finished on some other key lines (like Booth's Ottawa, Arnprior & Parry Sound btwn Whitney and Madawaska, and the Algoma Eastern btwn Sudbury and Little Current). I have the availability of every topo map in Canada in high-res, but it's aligning this to the imagery in Google Earth which is the pain. A great resource that I've been using is a lot of history books, but in particular the "Steam" series of CNR history books by Ian Wilson, as there are a lot of track maps that allow for additional detail to be made to the route alignments. I intend on doing some additional work in the next few weeks, but at some point I can provide what I've done so far. Unlike the whole "abandoned railways" and "active railways" I've been trying to do mine just as "railways as they were built (regardless of whether they're abandoned or not) which allows for more interesting amd easier to draw routes. It also allows me to do some research for once too! Attached is an overview of everything (including some work I did on Cape Breton Island, loaded with former mining railways in/around Glace Bay), as well as a blow-up of Tillsonburg (you were looking at details of the old alignment). thanks for getting in touch dan. it would seem we are on similiar tracks(pun intended). yes i understand your plight regarding low resolution photos. i am chomping at the bit to get st.thomas down, and have some great maps to work with but the alignment issue is there until the images clear up. eric and i have been working this for almost a year now and today i travel to peterborough and belleville to find maps of their street car systems. i would love to see the cn archives but i understand they chage large for access. please view our work and share your thoughts. there will be a big update soon and would love your critizism before it goes up on our site. i can send you my files of our latest work if you like. let me know. paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollsign29 Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 thanks for getting in touch dan Actually, by "That's my name" I mean "Orion 7029". My name is Josh btw, Dan is just a good friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rollsign29 Posted January 24, 2009 Report Share Posted January 24, 2009 there will be a big update soon and would love your critizism before it goes up on our site. i can send you my files of our latest work if you like. let me know. Please do. I'll send you a PM with my email address. I know there are some things I noticed before that need to be addressed at some point with your alignments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted January 28, 2009 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2009 hi everyone. i spent the day saturday travelling to the libraries in peterborough and belleville and managed to get maps of both their streetcar systems. interestingly in peterborough the remains of a streetcar loop still exist and i snapped a few shots of it. also right beside the library on charlotte street, the pavement has a corduroy surface where the old ties are pushing through. this system saw its last run in 1927. also through another board i belong to i now have a lead on the london streetcar and a system map for the sandwich, windsor and amhurstburg and the windsor, essex and lakeshore interurban. the windsor maps are apparently originals from when the hydro owned them. i can't wait to see those. it is a great deal of fun researching this topic and so far the libraries have bent over backwards to help. that leaves just Kingston, Chatham, St. Thomas, Sarnia, and Sudbury. faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 hello everyone. another weekend that has brought some fantastic results. i toured out to the london public library on the blustery snowy 401 and found the book "from dobbin to diesel, the story of public transit in london ontario" and got some great maps. i have already laid down that system on the map and it too will be included on the next update. unfortunately, the map i got did not include information on double trackage, passing tracks, loops and intersection details, these will have to be researched further at a later date. on my return i stopped at the ingersoll and woodstock public libraries to find a good alignment for the woodstock, thames valley and ingersoll railway. athough i did not fid a clear map, the recorded oral history proved to be enough to make the necessary alterations to the line on the map. i did not find any information regarding passing tracks, but there was likely one at beachville, where the company had a summer park. the line only had two cars, and the second car being an open design was only used in summer. the line was a single track without wye's or loops. when the driver reached either end of the line he would simply transfer the controls from one end to the other, flip the seatbacks on his way and move the power pole on the roof to trail in the opposite direction and he was off the other way. all in all another successful trip on an otherwise dreary saturday. my thanks to the staff at all three libraries that once again bent over backwards to help me. faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC BOY Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Hello, I have a great book that is called "Riding the radials" Its about Toronto radial lines. Here are some of the books that halton county radial railway (HCRR) has in there gift shop, alot of them have to do with Radial lines too. I even seen "riding the radials" in there gift shop too. You could visit HCRR when it opens in May http://www.hcry.org/pdfs/HCRR_OnlineStoreS...orm_Sep0808.pdf Rd "riding the radials" book shows maps, were double tracks are etc. I also made a Rogers route on Google maps. I can't get a proper link for it, but in google maps type in "rogers rd streetcar route" and click on "line 14" and you should find it. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 1, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Hello,I have a great book that is called "Riding the radials" Its about Toronto radial lines. Here are some of the books that halton county radial railway (HCRR) has in there gift shop, alot of them have to do with Radial lines too. I even seen "riding the radials" in there gift shop too. You could visit HCRR when it opens in May http://www.hcry.org/pdfs/HCRR_OnlineStoreS...orm_Sep0808.pdf Rd "riding the radials" book shows maps, were double tracks are etc. I also made a Rogers route on Google maps. I can't get a proper link for it, but in google maps type in "rogers rd streetcar route" and click on "line 14" and you should find it. Hope this helps. thanks for the heads up ttc boy. i love going to the hcrr, it is a great place. i believe my partner eric has that book, as he is responsible for the tsr guelph line. i will check with him. i did the route for the tsr woodbridge line and that was no easy task finding the needed information. i unfortunately could not find your suggestion for google maps and the rogers road line. it is marked as a single line on our map currently, were you able to find a map showing it as double tracks? faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC BOY Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 thanks for the heads up ttc boy. i love going to the hcrr, it is a great place. i believe my partner eric has that book, as he is responsible for the tsr guelph line. i will check with him. i did the route for the tsr woodbridge line and that was no easy task finding the needed information. i unfortunately could not find your suggestion for google maps and the rogers road line. it is marked as a single line on our map currently, were you able to find a map showing it as double tracks?faw well i have seen the video "pcc in toronto" and it has the rogers route in it, it shows double tracks. My dad use to live very close to the route, when it was in operation, and he said it was double track. I can't seem to get a working link but also try typing "rogers rd route streetcar" and somewere on the side of the page, it should show "line 14" click that and it should open the route. It should work, everytime i do it, it works. The lines are not exact were the tracks would be (in the middle of the street) but it basicly shows the route, and also were the single track starts and ends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 well i have seen the video "pcc in toronto" and it has the rogers route in it, it shows double tracks. My dad use to live very close to the route, when it was in operation, and he said it was double track. I can't seem to get a working link but also try typing "rogers rd route streetcar" and somewere on the side of the page, it should show "line 14" click that and it should open the route. It should work, everytime i do it, it works. The lines are not exact were the tracks would be (in the middle of the street) but it basicly shows the route, and also were the single track starts and ends. thanks ttc boy. any chance your dad would remember the oakland-vaughn-eglington route? faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC BOY Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 thanks ttc boy. any chance your dad would remember the oakland-vaughn-eglington route?faw Nope, he was too young at the time. sorry... did you find the rogers route? In google maps type in "rogers rd streetcar route" you will see points, click on oakwood or bicknell loop, and click "rogers rd route" then you should find it! Transit toronto web site has alot of info. http://transit.toronto.on.ca/streetcar/4119.shtml Here is the link for oakwood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 2, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Nope, he was too young at the time. sorry...did you find the rogers route? In google maps type in "rogers rd streetcar route" you will see points, click on oakwood or bicknell loop, and click "rogers rd route" then you should find it! Transit toronto web site has alot of info. http://transit.toronto.on.ca/streetcar/4119.shtml Here is the link for oakwood. yes i did thank-you. that line is complete. i have been to the transit toronto website, they do have and i used their maps. unfortunately the routes i need information on that are shown in a 1930 system map are drawn as single lines without details. the search continues.... faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC BOY Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 yes i did thank-you. that line is complete. i have been to the transit toronto website, they do have and i used their maps. unfortunately the routes i need information on that are shown in a 1930 system map are drawn as single lines without details. the search continues....faw What other routes are you looking for? I will try to find what i can on the routes you still need info on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallspy Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Faw, Now that I am thinking about it, I have in my possession a track map of the T&Y Metropolitan Division from Farnham Ave. to Sutton. Is this something that could help you? Dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC BOY Posted February 3, 2009 Report Share Posted February 3, 2009 I also found this website today, and found this video! http://www.sundayriverproductions.com/detail.aspx?id=47 I just found it now, and its not out yet, but i suggest to take a look at it when it does come out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 5, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2009 Faw,Now that I am thinking about it, I have in my possession a track map of the T&Y Metropolitan Division from Farnham Ave. to Sutton. Is this something that could help you? Dan yes, if it is digital, please send me a private message and i will forward my email to you. thank you faw I also found this website today, and found this video!http://www.sundayriverproductions.com/detail.aspx?id=47 I just found it now, and its not out yet, but i suggest to take a look at it when it does come out! thank you ttc boy, that looks like it will be worth a look. keep up the good hunting. What other routes are you looking for? I will try to find what i can on the routes you still need info on i need double trackage and intersection details on the line that ran on vaughan road from st.clair to oakwood, Avenue road from St. clair to Davenport to Bay Street at College, Dupont street from Christie to Davenport road to Avenue road, Hallam avenue, Harbord street, Lappin avenue, Ossington avenue, Royce avenue loop, Dovercourt road, Davenport to College, Lansdowne avenue, keele street at dundas to st. clair and all of weston road, sherbourn street from front to bloor, and some others i will follow up on later. thank you faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faw Posted February 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 10, 2009 Hello everyone. There has been an update posted to our website. http://individual.utoronto.ca/sorailmap/ In this update you will find the Peterboro, Belleville, London, Welland and Kitchener-Waterloo street railways have been added. Also corrected is the route of the Woodstock Ingersoll and Thames Valley railway. Needed on this line is information regarding passing tracks along the route. Around the Brantford area is is the former Toronto Hamilton Buffalo Yard in downtown, a long abandonded connection between the old Buffalo Brantford and Goderich railway and the Grand Trunk on the northeast side of town and a bypass that runs the route of the 403 across the north side of town. This bypass was a make work project done in the depression of the 1930's. Another interesting addition is the route of the CN mainline east of Cornwall where the line was abandoned in favor of higher ground due to flooding created by the opening of the St. Lawarence Seaway in 1958. Many other smaller adjustments and additions have been made all over the province in in our attempt to provide as accurate a map as is possible. As always, anyone with a thought, help or idea for the map is welcome to contact us here or on our website. Thankyou for supporting the Southern Ontario Railway Map Project. Faw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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