VIA Rail Canada

[Shaun]

I was told that Via's new rolling stock has 1 Locomotive with the other end being a cab car.  I wonder if they will allow baggage to be stored on the cab car much like the "Cabbage" F40's. 

[Charlie]

2 hours ago, Shaun said:

I was told that Via's new rolling stock has 1 Locomotive with the other end being a cab car.  I wonder if they will allow baggage to be stored on the cab car much like the "Cabbage" F40's. 

Judging by photos that Via Rail/Siemens have released with the design of the new trains, no, it will probably just be a cab car. 

Taken from here: https://m.viarail.ca/en/about-via-rail/fleet-renewal

 

[Allandale25]

Posted on Canadian Railway Observations (CRO) : http://bit.ly/2Nid0PI 

Text below.

Siemens Canada, the company that was selected by VIA Rail to manufacture the new trains to operate on the Quebec City-Windsor Corridor, is looking for interested suppliers. For this process, two Siemens' procurement offices have been set up in Montreal, Quebec and Oakville, Ontario. Siemens aims to provide Canadian content of up to 20% in supplies and services. Siemens is looking for suppliers in the following fields of expertise:

Electrical supplies; Mechanical supplies; and

Services related to the technical service and spare parts supply agreement. Just like VIA Rail, Siemens is committed to a fair and transparent sourcing process. Selection of suppliers will be based on the total cost of ownership, quality and delivery schedule.

To become a shortlisted Siemens supplier, interested parties can fill out the Supplier Application Form. on their website The application deadline is March 11th, 2019 at 11:59 EST. Interested parties who are unable to meet this deadline, can submit a request for extension to Siemens Canada via email that will be assessed on a case-by-case basis. Further information is available at www.siemens.ca

Siemens will evaluate all applicants and will invite shortlisted suppliers to attend a Siemens Canada Supplier Day event to further discuss the background of this project, schedule, timeline, and further opportunities mid and long term. Qualified applicants will also be considered for other Siemens projects where relevant.

As VIA Rail currently operates some of the oldest trains in North America, some dating back to the 1950s, and most of the cars currently in service are nearing the end of their life. VIA Rail will retire a portion of its current fleet starting 2019, as such, on-time delivery was a key criterion to maintain the current level of services and jobs in the Quebec City-Windsor Corridor.

On December 12, 2018, VIA Rail announced that Siemens Canada was awarded a $989 million contract to build the 32 trainsets that will replace VIA Rail's fleet that operates in the Quebec City-Windsor Corridor. Siemens Canada was selected following a fair, open, rigorous and transparent bidding process under the oversight of an independent fairness monitor and VIA Rail's Board of Directors. On-time delivery, quality of product and price were the criteria on which all the proponents were evaluated.

Starting in 2022, millions of VIA Rail passengers travelling in Canada's busiest Corridor will enjoy a new era of brand-new trains, with more comfortable seats, offering more spaces for people with reduced mobility and equipped with the latest technology to be more fuel-efficient and reduce the carbon footprint of travel.

The new VIA Rail Corridor fleet will be equipped with some of the following key features:

Improved comfort for travelers: LED lighting, USB ports, wide seats, quiet-zones, new interior design elements, bike storage, flexible luggage space.

Enhanced universal accessibility features designed to exceed accessibility standards: multiple spaces for wheelchairs and other mobility devices on the trains, braille seat numbering, companion seating, at-seat emergency call buttons, larger fully accessible washrooms, integrated mobility device lift on each trainset.

Enhanced safety features exceeding the latest safety standards.

Improved locomotive engines meeting EPA - Tier 4 emission standards.

Bi-directional operation will lower operating cost while yielding more passenger capacity.

Over its 30-year expected life, the new fleet will be maintained in Canada by qualified VIA Rail employees at VIA Rail's Montreal and Toronto Maintenance Centers. Maintenance activities will be supported by a 15-year Technical Services and Spares Supply Agreement (TSSSA) valued at $23,7 million per year.

VIA Rail's Modernization

The Quebec City – Windsor corridor fleet replacement is part of VIA Rail's transformation plan for Canadian passenger rail service. This plan also includes renovating a part of the rolling stock that operates on VIA Rail's long-distance routes. Accordingly, the following work was announced earlier in 2018 at several locations:

17 accessible cars – Bombardier Transportation – La Pocatière

25 economy cars – Cad Railway Industries – Montréal

4 dining cars – Rail GD – Gaspésie

Up to 33 economy and business cars – VIA Rail's Montréal Maintenance Centre

This renovation work represents an investment of approximately $154 million, undertaken by 300 workers in Quebec.

About VIA Rail Canada

As Canada's national rail passenger service, VIA Rail (viarail.ca) and all its employees are mandated to provide safe, efficient and economical passenger transportation service, in both official languages of our country. VIA Rail operates intercity, regional and transcontinental trains linking over 400 communities across Canada, and about 180 more communities through intermodal partnerships, and safely transports nearly 4.8 million passengers annually. The Corporation has been awarded five Safety Awards and three Environment Awards by the Railway Association of Canada since 2007. Visit the "About VIA Rail" section at https://www.viarail.ca/en/about-via-rail.

About Siemens Canada: Since 1912 Siemens Canada has stood for engineering excellence, innovation, quality and reliability. Siemens technology in the fields of electrification, automation and digitalization helps make real what matters to Canadians. From the Atlantic to Pacific oceans, Siemens Canada employees deliver solutions for sustainable energy, smart infrastructure, and the digital enterprise. One of the world's largest producers of energy-efficient, resource-saving technologies, Siemens is a leading supplier of efficient power generation and power transmission solutions and a pioneer in infrastructure solutions as well as automation, drive and software solutions for industry. With its separately managed subsidiary Siemens Healthineers Limited, the company is also a foremost provider of medical imaging equipment – such as computed tomography and magnetic resonance imaging systems – and a leader in laboratory diagnostics as well as clinical IT. Sales for Siemens Canada in fiscal 2018 (ended September 30), were $3 billion CAD. The company has approximately 4,800 employees and 44 locations across Canada, including nine production facilities.www.canadianrailwayobservations.com

[Shaun]

How are they going to retire some of their fleet this year when the new fleet doesn't arrive for another 3 years?

[dowlingm]

On 2/21/2019 at 10:44 PM, Shaun said:

How are they going to retire some of their fleet this year when the new fleet doesn't arrive for another 3 years?

First of the refurb HEP cars coming back on line, presumably.

[Shaun]

So that would leave the non rebuilt LRC cars to be retired this year?

[dowlingm]

4 hours ago, Shaun said:

So that would leave the non rebuilt LRC cars to be retired this year?

Maybe some Rens too.

[Shaun]

But are there enough Budd cars to cover a ren car set? Plus they just spent a whole bunch of money building accessible washrooms for them.  

[dowlingm]

18 hours ago, Shaun said:

But are there enough Budd cars to cover a ren car set? Plus they just spent a whole bunch of money building accessible washrooms for them.  

If Rens are in fact retired, hopefully the ones with the worst corrosion aren't the ones they spent the $ on...

[Shaun]

Are they the least reliable in the fleet? If that is the case why do they use Ren Sets over HEP cars in the winter months. 

[operator13382]

On 1/15/2019 at 10:15 PM, FelixINX said:

Small question: what is the maximum allowed time on duty for a locomotive engineer?

I'm surprised that these trains can't have the same crew. Is there any specific reason?

I know that an exception was accorded for the Montréal-Jonquière with 14(?) hours. For a 6 hour trip (train #51) it should be fine even if it's late.

The running trades switch in Ottawa and Montreal due to familiarization with the subdivisions and staffing agreements about which terminals operate over which subdivisions (or at least that was the case several years back).

Also would have something to do with pairing assignments up so that a crew isn’t left stranded away from home unnecessarily (subject to collective agreements) or deadheading unnecessarily (inefficient use of manpower).

[dowlingm]

I don't get the Canadian content stuff from Siemens. It wasn't in the tender, right? Surely it's better to build these damn things with parts that are already field tested on Brightline etc. rather than troubleshooting dodgy doors or brakes on desperately needed trainsets.

I suppose one possibility is that they are trying to curry favour using part categories where their current vendors are saturated and/or have Canadian plants which can make the same part making this more of a PR thing.

[Shaun]

As long as the parts meet the required performance specification, why would that be a problem? Why would it matter where it is made?

[dowlingm]

The value of these trains to VIA,  given their parlous equipment position, is that they are proven and with an established supply chain delivery dates can be tightly estimated (and replacement parts sourced from a pool common with other North American Siemens SC-44/coach operators). New suppliers are unproven, either as a manufacturer, as a plant, or as a part (or a combination). Risk has to be assessed accordingly. 

As an example off the top of my head, look at how TTC chose to replace their supplier of trolley pole carbons which resulted in reduced lifespan.

[Shaun]

Looks like VIA is not the only railway that has issues with freight railways. 

https://www.wsj.com/articles/amtrak-and-freight-railroad-clash-over-tweets-and-train-delays-11552836755

[tomsbuspage]

Toronto Sun: Passenger rail advocate calls VIA's proposed Ontario-Quebec a 'tourist train' to the 'hinterland'

[Shaun]

The Belleville Subdivision that CP owns is their only route to Montreal.  I dont think they would be willing to give it up anytime soon. 

[TTC T6H-5307N 2252]

25 minutes ago, Shaun said:

The Belleville Subdivision that CP owns is their only route to Montreal.  I dont think they would be willing to give it up anytime soon. 

Move all CN all traffic to the CP belleville Sub and use the Kingston sub for high speed trains 

[Urban Sky]

2 hours ago, TTC T6H-5307N 2252 said:

Move all CN all traffic to the CP belleville Sub and use the Kingston sub for high speed trains 

And how do you intend to motivate CN and CP to accept a consolidation of CN’s freight trains (on its double/triple-tracked Kingston Subdivision) onto the single-tracked Belleville Subdivision?

[Shaun]

I feel that VIA would have already looked into this.  

If it's the same price to build more tracks on the Kingston Sub as it is to build a whole new dedicated corridor, doesn't the latter make more sense? 

The current corridor can be used for people travelling in Between Toronto and Ottawa, and the new corridor can be used for customers who would want to travel direct between those sites. 

 

[WMATAC40LF]

1 hour ago, TTC T6H-5307N 2252 said:

Move all CN all traffic to the CP belleville Sub and use the Kingston sub for high speed trains 

Easier said than done. Adding at least two additional tracks to the entire CP route would not be a cheap endeavor. Plus, you'd still have all of the old legacy infrastructure along the CN route (like grade crossings) that would need to be upgraded for true high speed service. And that's just assuming the private freight RRs would be ok with this plan (but realistically, look at how far the Toronto freight bypass proposal has come, for example).

[smallspy]

19 hours ago, tomsbuspage said:

Toronto Sun: Passenger rail advocate calls VIA's proposed Ontario-Quebec a 'tourist train' to the 'hinterland'

Paul Langan needs to shut the fuck up and go away. He hasn't been relevant since the Turbo Train was still around. His "high speed rail or nothing at all" attitude is exactly what is wrong with foamers who happen to have a pedestal that the media listens to.

 

16 hours ago, WMATAC40LF said:

Easier said than done. Adding at least two additional tracks to the entire CP route would not be a cheap endeavor. Plus, you'd still have all of the old legacy infrastructure along the CN route (like grade crossings) that would need to be upgraded for true high speed service. And that's just assuming the private freight RRs would be ok with this plan (but realistically, look at how far the Toronto freight bypass proposal has come, for example).

Why do you need two additional tracks on CP? Why do you need to remove the level crossings? What VIA is looking for is a corridor that allows them to separate their trains from the freights - not a true high speed corridor, at least not yet. Simply providing the separation from freights will allow them to speed up services to a substantial degree.

 

For the record, the idea that CP will sell off the Belleville and Winchester Subs - their mainline from Toronto to Montreal - has been thrown around several times by people smarter than I, and may actually be VIA's endgame. This silly idea to rebuild the Havelock Sub, for which the budget of $4bil isn't likely to come close to covering, is in my mind simply a ploy.

 

Dan

[Doppelkupplung]

Forgive me if this has been asked before, but what sort of speeds is VIA looking for the future stock to be rated for?

[smallspy]

4 hours ago, Doppelkupplung said:

Forgive me if this has been asked before, but what sort of speeds is VIA looking for the future stock to be rated for?

The Siemens locos and cars are capable of 125mph.

 

Dan

[WMATAC40LF]

5 hours ago, smallspy said:

Why do you need two additional tracks on CP? Why do you need to remove the level crossings? What VIA is looking for is a corridor that allows them to separate their trains from the freights - not a true high speed corridor, at least not yet. Simply providing the separation from freights will allow them to speed up services to a substantial degree.

 

For the record, the idea that CP will sell off the Belleville and Winchester Subs - their mainline from Toronto to Montreal - has been thrown around several times by people smarter than I, and may actually be VIA's endgame. This silly idea to rebuild the Havelock Sub, for which the budget of $4bil isn't likely to come close to covering, is in my mind simply a ploy.

 

Dan

If you wanted to divert all of CN's traffic onto the CP Belleville Subdivision (as the poster above suggested), an additional one to two tracks would probably have to be added (depending on the location) to handle the increased freight traffic. And as for the grade crossings, doesn't Transport Canada have a 110 mph speed restriction on lines that aren't fully grade separated? Now I'll grant you 110 is better than the status quo, but the new trains could potentially go 125 without crossings. 

I do agree that the current proposal to rebuild the old Ontario and Quebec route is kind of strange, but VIA seems to think otherwise. The idea of rerouting VIA onto the Belleville sub is interesting (although it would probably mean skipping over Kingston and Brockville on runs to Ottawa). I still think the biggest obstacle to these plans is convincing freight RRs to give up large portions of track.