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30 footers to replace the Orion I's I would assume. Wonder how hybrids they will do on the very steep Route 39 Coit. Should be interesting to see how hybrids operate overall in a hilly city like San Francisco, with respect to fuel savings, brakes, battery life and such.

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  • 2 years later...

I'm heading down to San Francisco a week wednesday. I was there back in 2000 with family for two weeks and absolutely enjoyed my visit. I'll be down for a week this time.

Anyone here from SF Area? Any suggestions on where to find different buses on different routes? Can't really remember everything after 9 years... :D

Curious to know if they are still testing that Next Generation Orion VII.

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Jan, for MUNI, the Orions are out in force, just not the NG versions. Good place to see em downtown is around Market & Powell on the 71L. Balboa Park is another place where the propagate. Skoda trolley buses are in, and the flyer 800's are out. Looking for E60HF's? Try the 14/14L. The Skoda Artics are mostly on the 49. Sorry to say that the Orion I's are retired, replaced by 30 ft VII's. D40HF's are gone aswell from the fleet. Suggest that you pay a visit to the Transbay Terminal, as it'll be the last time you'll see the old one, before its torn down later this year. AC Transit is Van-Hool land as you've probably noticed. In the past 2-3 years, i dont think ive seen an AC route without a Van-Hool bus on it, minus some of the commuter Transbay routes. They also have a decent fleet of NABI 40LFW's, and a few Gillig holdouts. Golden Gate Transit still has their RTS' humming around, along with some Orion V suburban's, and some newer MCI D4500's. SamTrans has NABI artics, but thats the only other model than theyre HUGE fleet of Gillig Phantom's and LF's. Up until recently, VTA had a good mix of buses, Flxibles (dont know if they still operate or not), Phantoms & LF's from Gillig, and NF D60LF's, for their rapid and high density service. Right now, thats all i can think of off the top of my head. Ill let Hoons give you the rest of the info.

Nick :-)

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Up until recently, VTA had a good mix of buses, Flxibles (dont know if they still operate or not), Phantoms & LF's from Gillig, and NF D60LF's, for their rapid and high density service.

I didn't see any VTA Flxibles in service two months ago, just the ubiquitous Gilligs and the occasional D60LFs.

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Jan, for MUNI, the Orions are out in force, just not the NG versions. Good place to see em downtown is around Market & Powell on the 71L. Balboa Park is another place where the propagate. Skoda trolley buses are in, and the flyer 800's are out. Looking for E60HF's? Try the 14/14L. The Skoda Artics are mostly on the 49. Sorry to say that the Orion I's are retired, replaced by 30 ft VII's. D40HF's are gone aswell from the fleet. Suggest that you pay a visit to the Transbay Terminal, as it'll be the last time you'll see the old one, before its torn down later this year. AC Transit is Van-Hool land as you've probably noticed. In the past 2-3 years, i dont think ive seen an AC route without a Van-Hool bus on it, minus some of the commuter Transbay routes. They also have a decent fleet of NABI 40LFW's, and a few Gillig holdouts. Golden Gate Transit still has their RTS' humming around, along with some Orion V suburban's, and some newer MCI D4500's. SamTrans has NABI artics, but thats the only other model than theyre HUGE fleet of Gillig Phantom's and LF's. Up until recently, VTA had a good mix of buses, Flxibles (dont know if they still operate or not), Phantoms & LF's from Gillig, and NF D60LF's, for their rapid and high density service. Right now, thats all i can think of off the top of my head. Ill let Hoons give you the rest of the info.

Nick :-)

Thanks!

Do they have more than one Orion VII NG Hybrid Running?

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Ill let Hoons give you the rest of the info.

Before anyone gets confused as to who that is, that's my username on a different site (Airliners) :P

Anyways, Here's where you can find the following buses (bolded routes are where they are most common):

40ft Orion VII: 9, 10, 16, 17, 18, 23, 27, 29, 44, 52, 53, 71

30ft Orion VII: 18, 35, 36, 37, 39 (Always 30ft VIIs)

Skoda ETI 40ft: 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 14, 20, 21, 22, 24, 30, 31, 33, 41, 45, 49

Skoda ETI 60ft: 7, 14, 30, 49

E60: 7, 14, 30, 49

AN460: 9, 9X, 9AX, 9BX, 38, 38L, 71

AN440: 2, 9, 10, 12, 17, 18, 19, 23, 26, 27, 28, 29, 38X, 43, 44, 46, 47, 48, 52, 53, 54, 66, 71, 88

NABI 416: 10, 19, 28, 47

If you want to ride on a 40ft VII without straying too far from Downtown/Union Square, try the 27 BRYANT. I've only seen VIIs on that route.

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I didn't see any VTA Flxibles in service two months ago, just the ubiquitous Gilligs and the occasional D60LFs.

Robert, i was afraid of that. Last time i was down in San Jose was in 2007 or so, and they will still running on the weekends no less too.

Thanks!

Do they have more than one Orion VII NG Hybrid Running?

Like i said Jan, MUNI doesnt have the NG's, just VII hybrids. If you want NG's, head up to UC Davis, or Sacramento, most of the newer buses in those systems are just that. Amtrak Capitol Corridor service is very frequent during the weekdays and weekends. $15-$30 iirc for a ticket.

Nick

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  • 1 month later...
Dozens injured in Muni Metro crash

John Coté,Marisa Lagos, Chronicle Staff Writers

Saturday, July 18, 2009

(07-18) 19:53 PDT SAN FRANCISCO -- Safety inspectors are investigating the cause of a Municipal Railway crash that injured 48 people, four of them severely, when one train rear-ended another at the West Portal Station on Saturday, authorities said.

Witnesses described a chaotic scene following the crash, which Muni spokesman Judson said occurred just before 3 p.m. when an L-Taraval smashed into the back of a K-Ingleside train near the station's boarding platform.

The impact of the crash shattered the front window of the L train and crumpled its steel nose. The shattered windshield, apparently made of safety glass, stayed in place.

Both trains were headed in the outbound direction, but the K train was apparently stopped, authorities said.

The most seriously injured was the driver of the L train, who was conscious when paramedics arrived, said Deputy Fire Chief Pat Gardner. Three riders were also severely injured, authorities said. None of those injuries was life threatening, and all four patients were in stable condition, a nursing supervisor at San Francisco General Hospital said.

Dozens taken to hospitals

Twenty-four people suffered serious injuries and were also taken to local hospitals by ambulance, authorities said. The remaining injuries were minor, and the victims were able to walk to a Muni bus that took them to the hospital.

"This is probably one of the largest we've had" in recent years, Gardner said of the crash, referring to the number of people injured. Federal and state investigators have been notified of the crash, True said. A spokesman for the National Transportation Safety Board said his agency was considering launching a formal probe.

Investigators have interviewed the operator of the L train, True said. It is also standard procedure for train operators in accidents to be tested for drugs and alcohol.

The collision was the latest in a spate of mass transit accidents around the country. Last month, a Metro commuter train slammed into the rear of another subway train near Washington, D.C., killing nine people and injuring scores of others. In May, 49 people were injured when one Boston trolley car crashed into another.

Those accidents, as well as the violent collision of a commuter train with a freight train in September in Los Angeles, which killed 20 people, have prompted federal safety investigators to raise concerns about the nation's aging railcars, tracks and signal systems.

Screaming and yelling

Witnesses to Saturday's Muni crash said several people with head and neck injuries were loaded onto gurneys and taken away by ambulance.

West Portal resident Linda Burke, 58, and her husband, Mike Burke, 59, were walking home after watching "Harry Potter and the Half-Blood Prince" at a nearby theater and were across the street when the crash occurred.

They said the K train appeared to be stopped when the L train slammed into it.

"It sounded like a bomb or an explosion. We looked up and said, 'What the heck was that?' " Linda Burke said. "All this smoke was pouring out of the back of the streetcar" that was hit.

She said there was screaming and yelling; some passengers fell to the floor of the trains. People came running from nearby businesses to help, including one person who handed out napkins to bleeding victims.

The Burkes said the sound of the crash and the resultant damage suggested the L train had been going faster than it usually would have in the station.

"He must have been flying the way the front end caved in," said Mike Burke.

West Portal resident Dan Dudum, 48, was two doors down inside the Philosophers Club, a bar.

"It shook the building - all of a sudden the building went like that," he said, gesturing with his hand from side to side, "and I said, 'Hey, something's not right here.' "

"I didn't know what it was, but it was loud," Dudum said, adding that firefighters arrived seven minutes after the crash.

Muni personnel in yellow fluorescent vests swarmed the scene afterward, investigating the accident alongside more than 10 police officers and 40 firefighters and paramedics who blocked off the area with yellow police tape. Dozens of people stopped near the station - located at the end of the neighborhood's commercial district - to gawk at the crash.

True said officials have not determined why the trains crashed.

"We will look at everything from mechanical issues to human error," he said, adding that the train's speed will be part of the investigation.

West Portal resident Laurel Paul, who was in the nearby public library when the accident occurred, said she and her son rushed outside after hearing the crash.

"There was a huge crowd gathering outside the station," she said. "I've been riding Muni since the 1970s, and I've never seen a train crumpled in the front with a shattered windshield."

The crash forced Muni to halt service in both directions in the area and prompted authorities to shut down the intersection of West Portal Avenue and Ulloa Street. Claremont Street, a block off West Portal Avenue, was also shut down.

Buses provided service between the West Portal and Castro stations and between West Portal and the western side of the city.

E-mail the writers at jcote@sfchronicle.com and mlagos@sfchronicle.com.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c.../MN3C18RJGG.DTL

This article appeared on page A - 1 of the San Francisco Chronicle

Source: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?.../MN3C18RJGG.DTL

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Must be the L train driver sending text message while driving. <_<

If I'm not mistaken, all trains are run on automatic/computer control in the subway, so even if the operator was texting it was the computer system that messed up.

Dan

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July 21, 2009

Industry News

Driver blacked out in S.F. Muni rail crash

A light rail operator had turned off the automatic train controls right before he lost consciousness, and his train collided with a parked train, according to the president of San Francisco's transit workers union. Dozens were injured, and 47 people, including the operator of the striking light rail vehicle, were taken to San Francisco hospitals. The NTSB is leading an investigation on the accident. For more on the story, click here.

Copyright © 2009 Metro Magazine. All Rigths Reserved.

http://www.metro-magazine.com/News/Story/2...rail-crash.aspx

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Neat, I didn't know their light rail was computer controlled at any point.

In the Metro Tunnel, the LRVs are computer controlled. I remember my last trip to S.F., and at West Portal Station, the operator would push a button, and take his hands off the control. It's something to see.

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  • 10 months later...

No trip to California would be complete without a visit to the most diverse system in the country, namely the San Francisco Municipal Railway System. The seventh largest ridership in the nation, MUNI as the system is famously called operates nearly 1,000 buses, 151 Light Rail Vehicles, 50 or so Historic Streetcars for the famed F-Line and 40 Cable Cars running across three lines.

A Warning to the viewer, in my two days in San Francisco, I had covered so much that this topic will be split into 4 separate posts. Please be patient!!

Focusing first on the bus fleet. MUNI operates a fleet consisting mostly of Neoplan AN-440s & AN-460 articulated buses from 2002 & 2003. Also in this fleet are 45 North American Bus Industries (NABI) 40 foot buses from 1999 & 86 Orion VII Hybrid 30 & 40 foot buses purchased in 2007.

First up in Neoplan AN-460 #6271 operating on Route 38-Geary, one of the heaviest lines in the city. So much so that artics cover this line seven days a week:

WCT3303.jpg

Another seven day a week artic line is Route 71-Noriega which runs from Downtown to near Ocean Beach in the western end of San Francisco:

WCT3306.jpg

Due to a fire that was near the N-Judah light rail line, Buses were used to cover part of the line. Here is Neo #6232 on the Metro Rail Shuttle:

WCT3310.jpg

One must have photo is of the Route 76 layover at Marin Headlands. This Sunday-only line operates 7-9 trips and the only MUNI line to use the Golden Gate Bridge. Here is #8208 at the layover:

WCT3333.jpg

Route 2 serves the upper class Laurel Heights neighborhood on its way back to Downtown. Here is 8360 eclipsing the fashionable homes and businesses in this bustling neighborhood:

WCT3619.jpg

Part of the Orion VII purchase was thirty 30 foot Hybrid numbered in the 8500 series, used for small and medium density lines. Here is 8527 after loading up several passengers in West San Francisco:

WCT3624.jpg

Orion #8455, the second to last of the 8400s seen on the 29-Sunset line. Due to the hills of San Francisco, these hybrids were modified to produce better traction:

WCT3625.jpg

Even after the Orion purchase, MUNI bought second hand Gillig Phantoms from sister agency AC Transit. These buses are painted in the newer scheme but retain their AC Transit fleet numbers:

WCT3642.jpg

San Francisco is also known for its picturesque beauty, which translates even into transit as Neoplan #6201, working the 8x shows the interesting neighborhood skyline of South San Francisco:

WCT3643.jpg

Route 14, a trackless trolley route also has a Limited and Express line. However, due to lack of extra wiring, Neoplan artics are used. Packed to the doors with passengers, Neoplan #6243 races past a bicyclist on the 14 Limited on the lower part of Mission:

WCT3650.jpg

In a photo that shows just how commuting is so diverse, here is Neoplan #8151 leading a pack of cars and bicyclists across Market Street during PM rush:

WCT3660.jpg

MUNI also operates forty-five North American Bus Industries (NABI) 40 footers purchased in 1999. Here is 8007 on the Route 10 layover near Fisherman’s Wharf:

WCT3672.jpg

Neoplan #8349 is taking layover on the northern end of Route 47. To the left of this photo is Kirkland Bus yard and in the background is Coit Tower & the Transamerica Pyramid:

WCT3670.jpg

Here are some videos also taken during the trip on the bus side:

Neoplan AN-460 #6228: Cummins ISM/Allison B500R

Neoplan AN-440 #8208: Cummins ISM/Allison B400R

North American Bus Industries (NABI) #8036: Cummins M11/Allison B400R:

Orion VII 07.501 Hybrid #8426: Cummins ISB/BAE Systems Hybrid Drive:

North American Bus Industries (NABI) #8043 Better Ride Quality:

“Baby” Orion VII 07.503 Hybrid #8501: Includes reversing

Kirkland Bus Yard:

Van Ness Bus Parade:

Cool clip of a Orion VII Baby Hybrid making a three point run in route:

Fare Evasion at its best:

Muni Bus Video:

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One thing I am a little curious about is that MUNI still operates six New Flyer D60s from 1991. I wonder if there are any plans to replace them, or will they leave the fleet without a replacement? ABQ RIDE still has plenty of New Flyer DE60LFR options that MUNI can piggyback on.

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One thing I am a little curious about is that MUNI still operates six New Flyer D60s from 1991. I wonder if there are any plans to replace them, or will they leave the fleet without a replacement? ABQ RIDE still has plenty of New Flyer DE60LFR options that MUNI can piggyback on.

Do you really think MUNI would give a care about options from ABQ Ride? I'm sure they'd spec their own buses and buy more than 6 anyways. Do we need to hear about ABQ Rider options all of the time?

No trip to California would be complete without a visit to the most diverse system in the country, namely the San Francisco Municipal Railway System.

I'd argue MUNI isn't... I feel that Boston is.

Strickly looking at internal combustion buses... and this is a minor point... both run diesels and hybrids, but, MUNI also runs CNG.

They both run trolleybuses, granted, Boston's operation is smaller.

MBTA does have BRT, and of particular noter, trolleybuses (dual moes rather) providing Silver Line service.

They both have rather extensive streetcar systems although I think Boston's is bigger and has more variety of LRV types.

Both cities have PCCs.

The MBTA operates 3 subway lines, including 1 which uses catenary for a portion.

The MBTA also operates commuter trains.

And ferries.

That's not to say you can't find most of that in San Fransisco, but as an example, commuter trains (Cal-Train) aren't operated by MUNI itself, and BART is seperate from MUNI as well.

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You brought up some good points. Ironically I will be visiting Boston next month so i'll test your theory ;)

Next up is another of Municipal’s Railway famous assets are the Trackless Trolley system. MUNI operates 14 lines using 300+ vehicles of forty & sixty foot variety. The fleet consists of 240 Skoda forty-foot buses and 33 sixty-foot buses as well as 60 Flyer E60 trolleybuses.

Skoda #5488 tackles the steep hills of Route 1 near Chinatown:

WCT3331.jpg

Skoda #5514 beaming at night at the Route 3 layover near Market Street:

WCT3357.jpg

Flyer E60 #7028 at the beginning of Route 14 near Transbay Terminal:

WCT3594.jpg

Market Street is home to four Trackless lines (5, 6, 21 & 31). In this shot Skoda #5576 & 5561 take the center lane of Market during AM rush hour:

WCT3606.jpg

Underneath the junction of wires is Skoda artic #7123 on weekday rush hour only Route 41 crossing Van Ness, home to Trackless route 49:

WCT3607.jpg

Route 45 serves Union when Route 41 isn’t in operation using 40 foot Skodas. 5622 is seen on Union crossing another set of wires used for trackless line, Route 22:

WCT3612.jpg

Route 22 serves the Marina & Pacific Heights neighborhood before heading into the heart of San Francisco. Here is Skoda #5458 at the bottom of Steiner, ready to take on the next steep hill:

WCT3613.jpg

Also serving the Pacific Heights neighborhood is Route 24. #5408 is pictured near the end of the line squeezing between delivery trucks & parked cars:

WCT3615.jpg

Highlighted in another post was Laurel Heights. This neighborhood is home to Trackless Route 1 and Skoda #5572, shown with plenty of beautiful background on a clear sunny day:

WCT3620.jpg

Flyer E60 #7059 shows off one of four past and current MUNI schemes as it crosses Market, the midway point of Route 49:

WCT3638.jpg

Another scheme seen on the E60 is the SEPTA styled roofline scheme. #7032 pulls it off well as it travels along Mission on Route 14 to Daly City:

WCT3647.jpg

My favorite place to photograph on Mission is a hill leaning down. Here I captured Skoda #7121 on this incline showing off the grey & red scheme:

WCT3652.jpg

In a very colorful photo E60 #7049 flexes itself around a bend with a beautifully painted church sits in the background:

WCT3653.jpg

Another good locale is this hill that shows the San Francisco skyline. Flyer #7043 makes this shot doable as it operate on the 14:

WCT3654.jpg

This shot of Skoda #7118 shows just how much “stuff” is attached to the roof of a Trackless:

WCT3662.jpg

Videos:

1992 Flyer E60 #7056:

2003 Skoda artic #7132:

A pair of Skoda 40 footers:

Trackless Trolleys inside the Stockton Tunnel:

A pair of 60 footers on Mission:

Trackless Trolley Graffiti:

Trackless Video:

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MUNI also operates a subway-surface styled Light Rail system named the Metro. It is comprised of seven lines, five of which were former streetcar lines that survived modernization. All these lines serve the Market Street Subway, built in 1980 which connects with BART and surface services. The system runs on 71 miles of track through three tunnels, nine subway stations, twenty-four surface stations, and numerous surface stops. The system operates 151 Breda LRVs built between 1997 & 2002 when the last of the Boeing Veritols were retired.

Breda LRV #1414 operating on the infamous N-Judah line is seen approaching the 23rd Avenue stop, where it connects to Route 71-Noriega Line:

WCT3307.jpg

Car #1500 at the stop on 28th Street. Below the Ocean Beach loop can be seen with a car sitting and another approaching the loop:

WCT3308.jpg

Car #1452 is pictured just north of the Sunset tunnel, used exclusively by the N to head through Duboce park before traveling into the Market Street Subway:

WCT3311.jpg

The T-Third Street Line is the newest branch of the Light Rail system. This line is combined with the K-Ingleside line and operated as the K/T until reaching downtown. Here is Car #1505 at the Montgomery Station stop heading towards Sunnydale:

WCT3339.jpg

The J-Church line operates between Downtown & Balboa Park, site of the Geneva rail yard. Here is #1405 at the bottom of Dolores Park along a private right of way:

WCT3347.jpg

Along with the J-Church, the K-Ingleside also terminates at Balboa Park, where both lines connect with BART. Pictured are the layover tracks of both lines, which split just after clearing the yard:

WCT3352.jpg

MUNI Metro also provides service to the famed San Francisco Zoo under the L line. Here is #1516, part of a two car train heading westbound:

WCT3623.jpg

Like the N-Judah line, the L’s tracks are in the center, complete with a combination of islands and marked spots. Car #1526 is pictured north of 25th Avenue stop:

WCT3622.jpg

A MUNI Supervisor checks in with the operator of Car #1475 at the West Portal Station. This stop serves the K & M lines during normal service hours:

WCT3627.jpg

Breda Car #1527 is preparing to exit the Castro Station at the beginning of the Market Street Subway on the M line, the last of three lines that end at or near Balboa Park:

WCT3629.jpg

Municipal Railway’s first venture with modern Light Rail cars started with a fleet of Boeing-Veritol LRV cars built from 1976 to 1979. They were retired finally in 2002. Only two survive including #1264, seen outside the Church Station stop near the entrance of the Market Street Subway:

WCT3633.jpg

Videos:

Breda LRV #1487 on the J-Church Line. Very funny moment at the 5:46 mark:

Trains arriving and leaving Castro Station:

M Line Train at Balboa Park:

West Portal Station:

MUNI Light Rail Video:

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