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Hybrid0920

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This is called change management and a better introduction of demand routes (like Trans-Cab) in this area would help. I changed Route 12 and Route 2 to cover areas that the 3 previously covered, leaving only one section of Cannon without service. And it happens to be the section when King is about a block away. I know this only provides "westbound" service, but customers could easily have a Trans-Cab service for the eastbound trips.

I am not going to get into an argument over this as it is obvious that you want the last word in any criticisms that are posted.

The Trans-Cab solution would not be possible. As per the latest collective agreement between the management and the Union, Trans-Cab can only be implemented in areas where no previous transit service existed. In this case, obviously current service exists and thus, the Union would ABSOLUTELY NOT allow this to happen.

This is why I did not want to comment in the first place. There are many issues involved in running a transit system that the average person/rider/wannabe planner does not know about.

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You are still going to think that I like to get the last word, which is a shame because I am just trying to explain the reasons I made route suggestions the way I did. All I am trying to do here was have a discussion about changing the routes in the HSR and how they should be changed to better reflect demand. If you don't want to read my replies, then please don't.

And yet, you choose to respond anyways.

Despite all of the people you "claim to know", it still doesn't mean a crock of shit. Let it go.

Dan

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The Governors Road tail will now have service 7 days a week.

This is good news. I wish the signage would differentiate the 52s a little more clearly. It's tough for some people to tell which Dundas bus is coming. Maybe bring back the old 54 Governors name/number. Then again, most University Plaza trips would be eliminated (extended) with this improvement, so maybe 5B could be the designation for Pirie, not unlike how the 5C works.

On the issue of signage, has anyone noticed how people like to ignore the side sign? It's like they're trying not to read it, it might be lying. How often will a bus roll up, and the person standing directly in font of that side sign will walk around to the front and strain their eyes trying to read the "honest" sign, looking straight up?

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The lack of the HSR taking the location of high schools into account is definitely one large issue they have with the current route structure. Its really a simple fix if they actually took an honest effort to fix the problem.

The political issues with the HSR will never fully be resolved, as long as that bafoon Bratina is around. He's almost as confused as Rob Ford when it comes to transit. I can even make the argument that he's more confused then Ford.

None of the political issues with HSR are because of Bratina, they were there long before he even was doing CHML.

The HSR & any transit system in fact, have to deal with various forms of nimby'ism, its just a fact, Too many people are addicted to the ease of using a private vehicle, & they refuse even the slightest idea that they should rely on transit, in most cities transit is regarded as only for the poor & disabled & seniors..

We see this time and time again, no matter who is politically in power, this will be the case..

Try living in a city, where most streets in some areas, dont even have sidewalks, & these are very busy roads too..

I am not going to get into an argument over this as it is obvious that you want the last word in any criticisms that are posted.

The Trans-Cab solution would not be possible. As per the latest collective agreement between the management and the Union, Trans-Cab can only be implemented in areas where no previous transit service existed. In this case, obviously current service exists and thus, the Union would ABSOLUTELY NOT allow this to happen.

This is why I did not want to comment in the first place. There are many issues involved in running a transit system that the average person/rider/wannabe planner does not know about.

I completely agree with you, on all your points, but also wanted to add a couple..

Trans-Cab, is seriously unreliable, & in most cases cannot be used by a person using a wheelchair or scooter, I was living in an area, for a while (stoney creek) that was only accessible to HSR, by means of a trans-cab, I also have several friends that work in some places in this area, I myself have had to wait upto 2 hours for one to finally show up, only to discover that its non-accessible, or the driver wont take my friend's guide dog, & drives off.. leaving us stranded.. also 90% of the time, the trans-cab, cannot be accommodated for a person using a mobility device, ( I know this still happens, as a few close friends & 2 family members work in the cab business in Hamilton)

Regarding the 52 & 52A, great news, its LONG overdue, I lived in Dundas for a while, & the hassle of getting anywhere was so frustrating that it was the deciding factor for me to move out of Dundas, even though I had a great accessible, rent geared to income, apartment.. I hated it, espicially at night, trying to get home from the east end, where the blind bowling league bowled (skyway lanes), it was a 2 hour nightmare usually, getting home, as the 11 just was not reliable enough at the time, (we finished at 9:30pm usually) several of my blind friends lived in the same building as me, so usually, we'd get fed up & attempt to walk in from the old cnib stop, that was ended when my one friend got seriously hurt when he got hit by a car trying to cross governors..

Regarding the 3 Cannon, that route is also used by disabled people who live on/near Sanford & Cannon, as they feel safer to use it instead of wheeling in from main or barton street, its also a vital link for those living between Sherman & Kenilworth, as well as the community at Reid/Dunsmere (a lot of low-income families with kids).

I've lived on many routes in my life in hamilton, 11, 57 (dead) , 5E, 5- 5A, 6, 7, 34, 52-52A, 4, 23/24, 1/1A, 3, 55, 8.

by far the worst 2 I have lived on, were the 34 & 11..

Mount Albion road is where most of my childhood was spent, as well as the industrial area northeast of Grey's /Barton, both had poor service, as for M.A, it was a very densely populated area of low income families, that lived in the area I did, its still there, as is the schools & poor HSR service during evenings, weekends & holidays.... but as some would tell you, the demand is just not there..

Seashore, I have a question for you... What are the minimum loading standards now at HSR?? I lost the old report from 2009, that a friend had gotten for me, is there a newer one?

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They are now giving the 0900's the new interior lighting, similar to what the 08's got. I am currently on 0909, and it has the new interior lighting. I believe 0902 does, as well.

Yeah, 0913 has it as well. It'll probably make it out to all of the '09s during the next 2 weeks.

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Yeah, 0913 has it as well. It'll probably make it out to all of the '09s during the next 2 weeks.

Is there a reason why they are replacing the aisle lights in the buses? Did the older lights have a high failure rate, or is there another reason? Any idea if it's just going to be the 08's and 09's?

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I haven't heard of anything happening with the 52A. Anyone?

No, nothing is happening to the 52A. As for HSR loading standards, they have not changed in years. It is always 150% of seated capacity during peak hours and seated loads during off peak hours. There are always exceptions to this rule though (King and Barton mid days for example).

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No, nothing is happening to the 52A. As for HSR loading standards, they have not changed in years. It is always 150% of seated capacity during peak hours and seated loads during off peak hours. There are always exceptions to this rule though (King and Barton mid days for example).

TY Seashore...

Was thinking 140% but 150% sounds ok, but with all the strollers/walkers/big scooters, its awfully hard to even get 90% on some routes, without the bus being so packed it has to bypass.. My mum lives at Emerald & king, shes a senior & she has a walker, there are many times shes spent 20-30 minutes waiting for a King bus..

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Was thinking 140% but 150% sounds ok, but with all the strollers/walkers/big scooters, its awfully hard to even get 90% on some routes, without the bus being so packed it has to bypass.. My mum lives at Emerald & king, shes a senior & she has a walker, there are many times shes spent 20-30 minutes waiting for a King bus..

That is true. In reality, the King and Barton load factors should be 130 or 140% due to the above average number of walkers, scooters, etc. However, that would also mean more buses and that is always a hard sell with the politicians in this city.

The earlier comment about Mayor Brattina is not true. He has actually been a pretty good supporter of transit.

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--snip-- In reality, the King and Barton load factors should be 130 or 140% due to the above average number of walkers, scooters, etc. However, that would also mean more buses and that is always a hard sell with the politicians in this city.

In my limited use of the 1A King service during the day, there does seem to be a lot of walkers and baby buggies.

If/when the Eastgate-MAC streetcar line goes into service, there will still be a need for the 1/1A because, it seems to me, that the walkers, etc. do not board or get off at major intersections.

07-val-mt.jpg

Thinking of the new line, I wonder if it will look similar to Valenciennes in northern France where a 4 lane road became a streetcar line with 1 lane for parking and a single lane for driving. Somehow I cannot imagine the Main Street speedway being transformed to this.

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I don't want to be rude nor harsh, but I think in that situation, given that it was a city in which you might not have been farmilar with, people whom were more farmilar with the City of Hamilton as well as the HSR (including the head schedule technologist) was putting forth the $ side of operating transit and so on. I didn't see that as not playing nice - rather putting out the difficulties in managing a system wtih x number of buses, etc. I really hope you didn't see it that way but was just frustrated in how your suggestions weren't viewed the same way as yours. Mind you, if I was to suggest similar suggestions for London or Windsor and I didn't have any farmilarity with it, I'd probably get the same treatment to understand by taking some buses away in one area then to put others in another area would have certain residents pissed or happy, etc. Let's all patch this up and move forward, shall we?

I do have two suggestions when it comes to HSR. Granted I haven't ridden that system as much as Burlington, but there are two routes in which I think could use some touching up. The 1-King and 5-Delaware but, with subtle modifications.

With the 1...would it be feasible in having the 1 King start and end all of its trips from McMaster? Understanding the 1A-King operates there during the day at roughly 12-minute headways, would a 7-day-a-week service with the 1-King be beneficial by with all riders that would be around Mac and area, espeically during the school year?

Secondly, I know that the 5-Delaware route can be viewed as the most difficult route to understand with branches becoming different numbers or letters going the other way. I'm looking at a more simplistic approach.

5-Delaware/Dundas (From Head Street to Jones/King)

It would travel along the current routing in the west end in Dundas and through downtown as it currently does. The only difference I could see here is that it'd head east from downtown through those neighbourhoods east of Gage Avenue but to go through both the Greenhill & Rosedale loops before terminating at Jones & King. Head west through those same two loops (Rosedale & Greenhill). The route number would stay the same and I think the destination sign could at least be more managable with Delaware/Dundas. Not quite certain on the headways but I suppose 15 minutes during the day.

Route 15 - Dundas/Eastgate

This route would serve Pirie/Governors in the west in Dundas and go along as it would currently go to downtown. It would stay on Main Street East to Upper Ottawa or Kenilworth and head along King East to Centennial and Eastgate. Head west the opposite way, with the same consistant route number of 15.

With the 5 and 15 suggestions, what I'm concerned about is how it'd effect the 58 - Stoney Creek Local. Would they change the way people take the 58 to King and Queenston via King East, or could they take the new 15 (or 44) and transfer at King Street East to the modified 5 to Jones and King?

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5-Delaware/Dundas (From Head Street to Jones/King)

It would travel along the current routing in the west end in Dundas and through downtown as it currently does. The only difference I could see here is that it'd head east from downtown through those neighbourhoods east of Gage Avenue but to go through both the Greenhill & Rosedale loops before terminating at Jones & King. Head west through those same two loops (Rosedale & Greenhill). The route number would stay the same and I think the destination sign could at least be more managable with Delaware/Dundas. Not quite certain on the headways but I suppose 15 minutes during the day.

Route 15 - Dundas/Eastgate

This route would serve Pirie/Governors in the west in Dundas and go along as it would currently go to downtown. It would stay on Main Street East to Upper Ottawa or Kenilworth and head along King East to Centennial and Eastgate. Head west the opposite way, with the same consistant route number of 15.

With the 5 and 15 suggestions, what I'm concerned about is how it'd effect the 58 - Stoney Creek Local. Would they change the way people take the 58 to King and Queenston via King East, or could they take the new 15 (or 44) and transfer at King Street East to the modified 5 to Jones and King?

I like your ideas but I have some tweaks to make.

Route 5 Delaware/Dundas

With your new route 15 idea I would get rid of the Jones and KIng loop altogether as it's covered by the rt 58. Can't please everyone, they could transfer at Centennial or Eastgate Square. Have the 5E to Quigley and Greenhill become the regular 5 and keep the Rosedale branch the 5A, keeping them both separated in the east end. But same concept you have to Dundas. The 5C is discontinued, see route 51.

Route 15 Dundas/Eastgate

I'd run it through Maplewood Delaware and Stinson. Everything else is good.

Route 51 West Hamilton

Since the 5C and 51 share identical routing to West Ham loop merge the 2 together and have the new 51A extended to Meadowlands. Of course if this were to happen the 51 would have to run all year.

My 0.02

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Route 51 West Hamilton

Since the 5C and 51 share identical routing to West Ham loop merge the 2 together and have the new 51A extended to Meadowlands. Of course if this were to happen the 51 would have to run all year.

My 0.02

I meant to have suggested to have the 51 be its own route and merging it with the current 5C/5A alignment. It would be a fixed route all year that would serve 3 ridership generating locations. Hamilton GO Centre, McMaster University & Ancaster Meadowlands Terminal.

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With the 1...would it be feasible in having the 1 King start and end all of its trips from McMaster? Understanding the 1A-King operates there during the day at roughly 12-minute headways, would a 7-day-a-week service with the 1-King be beneficial by with all riders that would be around Mac and area, espeically during the school year?

Any idea is a good idea. The whole key is to determining if it is feasible.

Yes it would be a great idea to operate all King trips to/from McMaster. However, with the current schedule, this would require an additional 4 buses during all time periods. That is a pretty large chunk of change and again brings me back to the point of cost. When determining routing options, cost is always the number one factor.

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Heck I'll be happy if we get the LRT just because the plan calls for a minor modification of the #4 Bayfront that would help me lots. Where it would skip Nash between Barton/Queenston and go to Eastgate. Missed so many connections going into Stoney Creek at night for work. Been a lot better lately though as we seem to have regular drivers on the Bayfront for the past 8 or so months. I believe the night driver I get is named Katherine (Catherine?). She's awesome and one of the most plesant drivers I've encountered. She's helped improved my connections greatly. Also the day driver has been great to for keeping an eye out for our Bee-line coming from Eastgate in the morning. Even if I've missed those...the other drivers have been really kind. A huge improvement over where the Bayfront was just 2-3 years ago.

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That is true. In reality, the King and Barton load factors should be 130 or 140% due to the above average number of walkers, scooters, etc. However, that would also mean more buses and that is always a hard sell with the politicians in this city.

The earlier comment about Mayor Brattina is not true. He has actually been a pretty good supporter of transit.

I didnt Dis Bratina, I've known him for over 22yrs, used to go to school with one of his kids..

Bob has been a big proponent of transit even before he was Mayor, he was one of the ones internally, that convinced the owners of the CHML building, to not tell HSR to move the stop thats in front, as well as the 6 stop on the west side of the building..

All I said is that the political antics regarding HSR, have been happened LONG BEFORE Bob ever got into Politics..

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I like this suggestion of 5/5A as well, but I know from the Translink people I know that it's best to have busy terminals at each end of routes. My new thoughts are to have the 5 go to Eastgate Square, and of course to McMaster. The 5A spur to Rosedale seems to work the best. I am still hesitant to duplicate service on King/Main to Dundas, but I guess it would work. Are there enough people riding from east of the downtown into Dundas to justify it? This was the reason I suggested the truncation of the 52 at the GO Centre. I do like the discontinuation of the 5C in favour of the 51, :-).

But the 15 would go to Eastgate Square, we don't need both the 5 and the 15 going there. The 15 would be the Jones and King replacement whereas the new 5 would be the Quigley/Greenhill loop. And don't kid yourself that 5E is a busy loop, far busier then the Jones/King one. The majority off passengers board West of Centennial.

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I'd like to see more service along mt,albion, rather than more down quigley, or at least more along from greenhill/albright/quigley/king/nash/queenston/eastgate.

The low income areas along mt,albion need a better alternative, than the bloody awful trip it currently takes to get to limeridge mall or ancestor areas or anywhere west of the 11 route, I have friends that live on the 11, its a sack of crap at best, it takes my friend Donna & her 2 kids (one in a wheelchair), 2 hours to get to limeridge..

forget about even travelling anywhere on sundays or at night, its just not safe.

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How does it take 2 hours to get to Limeridge? If you look up your schedules and time things out, it's a simple hop up to valley park to catch the 43 and it shoots you right over to Limeridge. That's really not too bad at all and I've never had a problem with the connection at Valley Park. I do agree that the frequency of the Parkdale route blows, though.

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Ah, ok. I misunderstood your wording for the route. You are correct. I had originally suggested that Quigley be covered with Route 43 down to Eastgate, but I'm wondering if it would be worth it to duplicate service here since the demand is a little higher. So run the 43 and 15 through it?

I'm looking at your 11 and 43 idea and immediately I see an issue with the 11. Given that the original 11 would have to be longer in your plan, currently, there are 3 areas that can back it up and make it way late.

A) CPR rail crossing at Hixon Road;

B: CNR Crossing @ Parkdale;

C) Burlington Canal Lift Bridge.

All three of these circumstances can massively delay the 11 as is. It's best to keep the 11 as is and have it connect with the 43 around Mud Street & area.

There was a suggestion within a report for plans to take the 21 to Heritage Green. Would it be a good idea to take the 11 and connect with it? If there was someone who was wanting to get the 21 and are on the 11 heading around Mud Street/Stone Church, he/she would need to get off the 11 at Winterbury (is that the street)?, walk along Stone Church and into wherever the 21 would loop around to get it. Not saying the walk would be problematic, but it could be a good idea to have a direct connection in there.

Now, in suggesting that, it'd remove the 11 from the loop around Valley Park. Could that area be served by the 43 alone?

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I came across recently retired HSR 9919 last week parked at the Hamilton EMS station at Burlington and Victoria in Hamilton. It looks like the bus is being used as a rescue training vehicle as there are several dummies in and around the bus, including a stretcher.

I snapped a bunch of photos if anyone wants to check them out. See more here.

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954725_385069788279684_1759682495_n.jpg

970185_385069518279711_398193208_n.jpg

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