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King County Metro - Seattle, Washington

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32 minutes ago, busdude.com said:

My guess is the "Brt Ready" vehicles are going to be configured with the correct specifications for Rapid Ride, but delivered in standard Metro livery. And if/when they expand metro simply runs them through the paint shop, change them into the correct livery for that service and away they go.

Ryerson used to have the oldest fleet for years, as towards the end of the MAN diesel era at Metro, they all ran out of RB.

The expansion of RapidRide isn't a matter of if, but when. These "BRT Ready" coaches could be used on the H Line (G will use trolleybuses) that should come online in 2019, or the Fremont Line (the replacement for the 40) that should come online in 2023, or the six other RapidRide routes that will come online in suburban King County before 2025. (Look 3 door buses on suburban routes!) 

Ryerson had an older fleet until recently too. Until the 8000 series coaches started coming online, the fleet consisted of the bulk of the D60HF coaches, the oddball D60LF coaches and a mix of the D40LF and Orion VII coaches.

 

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4 hours ago, busdude.com said:

My guess is the "Brt Ready" vehicles are going to be configured with the correct specifications for Rapid Ride, but delivered in standard Metro livery. And if/when they expand metro simply runs them through the paint shop, change them into the correct livery for that service and away they go.

Ryerson used to have the oldest fleet for years, as towards the end of the MAN diesel era at Metro, they all ran out of RB.

I recall seeing a few odd Breda buses towards their dying days even though Ryerson did not operate trolleys or tunnel coaches.

 

Does this latest order news speak doom for the 3600s and the 2800s? It's interesting to hear the end of the diesel only New Flyers while the D60s (and to a lesser extent) Gillig Phantoms are still kicking. 

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3 hours ago, anonymous guy said:

Does this latest order news speak doom for the 3600s and the 2800s? It's interesting to hear the end of the diesel only New Flyers while the D60s (and to a lesser extent) Gillig Phantoms are still kicking. 

At this point (and subject to change) when these new coaches are delivered by September 2018...

1100s - All retired

2300s - All retired

2600s - 80 retired 

2800s - All retired

3200s - All retired

3600s - 11 retired

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6 hours ago, rickycourtney said:

At this point (and subject to change) when these new coaches are delivered by September 2018...

1100s - All retired

2300s - All retired

2600s - 80 retired 

2800s - All retired

3200s - All retired

3600s - 11 retired

are 11 of 3600s retiring from North first or Ryerson? what's gonna happen with 60 of 7200s and 14 of 3700s?

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6 hours ago, anonymous guy said:

I recall seeing a few odd Breda buses towards their dying days even though Ryerson did not operate trolleys or tunnel coaches.

RB never operated the breda's in service as far as I know, but a good number were stored there awaiting conversion

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On 2017-02-22 at 8:17 PM, rickycourtney said:

SDOT has published a pretty comprehensive update on its RapidRide expansion program. 

One of the interesting tidbits is that some of the lines have been officialy named:

Madison BRT (the replacement for parts of routes 11 & 12) will be called the RapidRide G Line.

Delridge BRT (the replacement for route 120) will be called the RapidRide H Line.

http://www.seattle.gov/Transportation/docs/RREP_Plan_DRAFT_022217u.pdf

That is good to hear that the two more RapidRide now has name and letters. Will the RapidRide G buses have five doors compared to the normal two or three doors?  

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25 minutes ago, Blue Bus Fan said:

Will the RapidRide G buses have five doors compared to the normal two or three doors?  

5 doors.

King County budget approved the purchase of 13 New Flyer Xcelsior XT60 coaches for the G Line. 

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2 minutes ago, rickycourtney said:

5 doors.

King County budget approved the purchase of 13 New Flyer Xcelsior XT60 coaches for the G Line. 

5 doors as in doors on both sides?

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29 minutes ago, rickycourtney said:

5 doors.

King County budget approved the purchase of 13 New Flyer Xcelsior XT60 coaches for the G Line. 

That is good. Do have any ideas on the numbers of the XT60 for the G Line? Will the other Seattle funded RapidRide routes funded in the city be five door buses?

25 minutes ago, OR Transit Fan said:

5 doors as in doors on both sides?

3 doors on normal side for doors and two doors on the drivers side.

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21 hours ago, caseyrs77 said:

The information coming out about future deliveries, comes from a Metro Fleet Projection spreadsheet which is always subject to change and is preliminary. The listing for 8300's doesn't actually say Rapid Ride, but says XDE60 3 door "BRT ready". That's leads me to believe it's Rapid Ride, and would make sense, given that the G and H lines will come online in the next couple years. Also, I think it's very possible, given the fact this spreadsheet is preliminary, that it could say 8300's, but should've said 6300's.

 

 

8100's and 8200's will replace 2300's, 2800's and begin to replace 2600's. As 8300's (likely 6300's) come in, and Rapid Ride lines replace existing routes, that'll replace more 2600's. 

That being said, they don't have to go to a base and directly replace an old bus. South, East get 8100's. Replace 2300's (South). And as those come in to East, enough 68/6900's with rotate to North, to replace 2300's. (North always get oldest equipment. Please don't ask why.... it just happens and I don't have a reason)  Ryerson, Central will get 8200's, which will replace 2300, 2800's (Ryerson) and begin to replace 2600's (Central)

Well if you don't have a reason, who knows the reason that 8100s will go to East and South. It honesty would make sense if some 8100s go to North to replace 2300s and get some old of 6900s to North. is it due to because North route mostly uses peak services and doesn't use weekend service as much? is that the reason that you said that 8100s would mainly goes to East and South?

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11 minutes ago, clark2015 said:

Well if you don't have a reason, who knows the reason that 8100s will go to East and South. It honesty would make sense if some 8100s go to North to replace 2300s and get some old of 6900s to North. is it due to because North route mostly uses peak services and doesn't use weekend service as much? is that the reason that you said that 8100s would mainly goes to East and South?

Who knows? The person at metro coordinating this.

It would make the most sense if you would stop bring this up and just accept it. 

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If 100 Gilligs 7300s comes to Bellevue next year, then what's going to happen with 60 of 7200s and 14 of 3700s in Bellevue and will they be moved somewhere, or mainly stay in Bellevue?

1 minute ago, aznichiro115 said:

Who knows? The person at metro coordinating this.

It would make the most sense if you would stop bring this up and just accept it. 

Well I'm just explaining my reason why should be this way, but after all them that's it. I can't control the metro to do what they want. I can share anything but out of my control to know.

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1 minute ago, clark2015 said:

If 100 Gilligs 7300s comes to Bellevue next year, then what's going to happen with 60 of 7200s and 14 of 3700s in Bellevue and will they be moved somewhere, or mainly stay in Bellevue?

They will go where ever you tell metro to send them......

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27 minutes ago, aznichiro115 said:

They will go where ever you tell metro to send them......

Ok. But the question is if 11 of 3600s gets retired next year, are they gonna retire the one from North first or Ryerson? 

The thing is can they put 9 to 11 of 7200s to wherever North or Ryerson to replace 3600s?

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23 hours ago, caseyrs77 said:

The information coming out about future deliveries, comes from a Metro Fleet Projection spreadsheet which is always subject to change and is preliminary. The listing for 8300's doesn't actually say Rapid Ride, but says XDE60 3 door "BRT ready". That's leads me to believe it's Rapid Ride, and would make sense, given that the G and H lines will come online in the next couple years. Also, I think it's very possible, given the fact this spreadsheet is preliminary, that it could say 8300's, but should've said 6300's.

 

 

8100's and 8200's will replace 2300's, 2800's and begin to replace 2600's. As 8300's (likely 6300's) come in, and Rapid Ride lines replace existing routes, that'll replace more 2600's. 

That being said, they don't have to go to a base and directly replace an old bus. South, East get 8100's. Replace 2300's (South). And as those come in to East, enough 68/6900's with rotate to North, to replace 2300's. (North always get oldest equipment. Please don't ask why.... it just happens and I don't have a reason)  Ryerson, Central will get 8200's, which will replace 2300, 2800's (Ryerson) and begin to replace 2600's (Central)

And don't be surprised to see rotations in the 2600 fleet as higher mileage/major failure units are rotated out and other 2600s are rotated around to fill the gaps from bases that get new equipment. Same goes for the 3600s, etc. It will be interesting to see what happens with the XT40/XT60 fleet in the coming years as lines are upgraded to Rapid Ride standards, with new equipment. Will the Rainier and Ballard lines get new trolley coaches or will they simply repaint the XT60s since they are already 3 door coaches? I guess Madison is a motor route so that conversion will have little impact except for expanding the fleet.

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51 minutes ago, busdude.com said:

I guess Madison is a motor route so that conversion will have little impact except for expanding the fleet.

Madison will be trolleys.  See page 18.

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6 hours ago, clark2015 said:

Ok. But the question is if 11 of 3600s gets retired next year, are they gonna retire the one from North first or Ryerson? 

The thing is can they put 9 to 11 of 7200s to wherever North or Ryerson to replace 3600s?

Clark.... this is the last time I'm going to address your post. I understand from a previous post, that you finally see that fleet movements are "out of your control" and you're just sharing what you think they should be. Ok. Stop wasting your time. Whatever happens, will happen. Metro will ensure that some kind of a bus will operate the trip you're waiting for. 

As for reasons of why new coaches are going to a specific base, or why other coaches are being moved around to replace older coaches.... we don't know. There is a spreadsheet that we see the PROJECTED number of each fleet type to each base. (again, always subject to change, and believe me, these do often change) We don't have reasons, or explanations available, just a spreadsheet to look at, so please stop asking for reasons. 

Ok, to answer your question above, the projections show the first 11 3600's retiring out of Ryerson. As the 100 7300's go to Bellevue, Bellevue will keep their 3700's but all 7200's will end up at South. South will send some 7000's to Ryerson, and those will take care of approx. 11 3600's. The whole fleet will retire, these will just be the first. Again, these are just projections. 

I hope that answers all of you questions Clark. I'm not touching on the issue of the 8100/8200's again, because we don't know the reasons behind it. Please just leave it that this. We don't know all the answers. Metro does what it wants, because they can. I'm sorry if it's not what you agree with or want, but it is what it is. 

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9 hours ago, busdude.com said:

It will be interesting to see what happens with the XT40/XT60 fleet in the coming years as lines are upgraded to Rapid Ride standards, with new equipment. Will the Rainier and Ballard lines get new trolley coaches or will they simply repaint the XT60s since they are already 3 door coaches? I guess Madison is a motor route so that conversion will have little impact except for expanding the fleet.

The answer to that question is dependent on one thing... will the lines have center running transit lanes and center island bus stations?

If they do... Metro will need to buy additional XT60 coaches with 5 doors. If they don't... Metro could simply repaint the existing XT60 coaches, assuming they don't need more coaches to operate the service.

Of the seven new RapidRide lines, five will use trolleybuses... G Line, Rainier, Roosevelt, Market, and 23rd.

We know the the G Line will need new XT60 coaches and based on the initial plans, the Rainier line will need them too, since it will use center running transit lanes along Jackson that will be shared with the streetcar.  

The current plans don't have the Roosevelt line using center running transit lanes and the 23rd line doesn't appear to have much in the way of transit lanes at all. The Market line is the only one that could go either way.

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1 hour ago, MAX BRT said:

Transit Ridership Falling Everywhere — But Not in Cities With Redesigned Bus Networks

(Seattle bucks the trend)

http://usa.streetsblog.org/2017/02/24/transit-ridership-falling-everywhere-but-not-in-cities-with-redesigned-bus-networks/

The interesting thing to note... King County Metro ridership is flat (121.5 million in 2016 versus 121.8 million in 2015), while Sound Transit ridership is way up (42.7 million in 2016 versus 34.7 million in 2015).

That shows passengers are shifting from Metro bus services, to faster and more reliable Sound Transit light rail services... which was the point of the restructure.

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1 hour ago, MAX BRT said:

Transit Ridership Falling Everywhere — But Not in Cities With Redesigned Bus Networks

(Seattle bucks the trend)

http://usa.streetsblog.org/2017/02/24/transit-ridership-falling-everywhere-but-not-in-cities-with-redesigned-bus-networks/

May I point everyone's attention to the comment on there by "Jason." It is worth a read, especially in regards to the classic coverage vs. frequency scenario. He also slags Jarrett Walker's Houston system redesign ... it's a success, but not by the amount that was forecasted.

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Out of curiosity, are the the 2800s considered higher mileage coaches? The 30 units are being marked for retirement while there will still be 3600s and 2600s roaming the streets. 

Or is it just a case of them being the oddball smaller numbered fleet of coaches?

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8 minutes ago, anonymous guy said:

Out of curiosity, are the the 2800s considered higher mileage coaches? The 30 units are being marked for retirement while there will still be 3600s and 2600s roaming the streets. 

Or is it just a case of them being the oddball smaller numbered fleet of coaches?

Probably both. They're an oddball fleet but they also operated as an isolated fleet at Ryerson Base for a decade - assigned to fill day base runs on the 120 and 48  seven days a week with very little tripper service.

 

I wouldn't be shocked if the fleet as a whole was substantially higher mileage than the 2600s.

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4 hours ago, MAX BRT said:

Transit Ridership Falling Everywhere — But Not in Cities With Redesigned Bus Networks

(Seattle bucks the trend)

http://usa.streetsblog.org/2017/02/24/transit-ridership-falling-everywhere-but-not-in-cities-with-redesigned-bus-networks/

This article has it exactly backwards:

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