King County Metro - Seattle, Washington

[roamer]

2 hours ago, pnwelevator said:

Here's an article courtesy of the Seattle Times from 1970 that gives the list of all the Blue Streak Routes, yes indeed there was a 16 Meridian Blue Streak, and trust me, just from riding 724 a few times, it's a blast.  

Thank you!   that's what I was looking for.  The Blue Streak service didn't last that long.  Once Metro took over, it was only a few years before they changed the structure of their express service.  

It seemed that there was a short time that Metro called their express service "Flyer"  ...or at least on the eastside into town.  I remember the annoucement that we were to refer to the stops along 520 as "flyer stops"  e.g. especially Montlake and Evergreen.  To this day, I personally still call it "the Montlake Flyer Stop." I also remember the Flyer dash signs we had.  

I seem to remember carrying Flyer dash signs on  the 252 route for some reason even though it wasn't really an express route.  The 252 was what morphed into the 271.  The 252 went from the University District to Eastgate  

[Atomic Taco]

22 minutes ago, roamer said:

It seemed that there was a short time that Metro called their express service "Flyer"

Apparently Metro has a very loose definition of "express".  Route 358 had more stops than the E Line that replaced it and yet somehow retained its Express moniker.  A Metro customer service rep told me that it was because the route didn't make many stops along Aurora between Woodland Park and Denny Way.  Well route 150 doesn't make any stops between Interurban and Spokane, so shouldn't that one be an express too? 

[northwesterner]

8 hours ago, Atomic Taco said:

Apparently Metro has a very loose definition of "express".  Route 358 had more stops than the E Line that replaced it and yet somehow retained its Express moniker.  A Metro customer service rep told me that it was because the route didn't make many stops along Aurora between Woodland Park and Denny Way.  Well route 150 doesn't make any stops between Interurban and Spokane, so shouldn't that one be an express too? 

Yes, but that made sense because there were local stops on the same street that the 358 did not serve. The 150 gets on I-5 for the aforementioned stretch.

[Metro6774]

Spotted 8169 on the 255 this evening (rare, of course, to see an XDE60 on this route, since it's a tunnel route).

I believe that this is its first day at East Base.

I thought that the 8100's couldn't be used in the tunnel, but I've seen 8153 and 8162 also used on the 255 in the past week.

Why are there still 8100's being assigned to that route? I assume that they stay on and cannot shut off when the doors open in the tunnel (no hush mode). That reminds me, by the way, when 8012 was testing in the tunnel as well.

[northwesterner]

9 hours ago, roamer said:

It seemed that there was a short time that Metro called their express service "Flyer"  ...or at least on the eastside into town.  I remember the annoucement that we were to refer to the stops along 520 as "flyer stops"  e.g. especially Montlake and Evergreen.  To this day, I personally still call it "the Montlake Flyer Stop." I also remember the Flyer dash signs we had.  

I seem to remember carrying Flyer dash signs on  the 252 route for some reason even though it wasn't really an express route.  The 252 was what morphed into the 271.  The 252 went from the University District to Eastgate  

"Flyer" was present in the roll signs as delivered on the 1976 AMGs. I also know it was available on many of the single roller suburban coaches - there are pictures out there with them signed "Flyer" and a dashcard indicating route and destination.

When Metro did their signage study in 1977 before the rollout of the new signs in 1978, it was considered redundant and eliminated.

[northwesterner]

23 hours ago, roamer said:

anecdote:   I knew at the time that the 700s were purchased specifically for Blue Streak service but still held out hope that we'd get them on the Latona line, lol.  My girlfriend back then lived on the Meridian line and that route (called "Green Lake" by Seattle Transit) actually had 700s assigned.   Was there a 16 Blue Streak?  That's foggy for some reason ...seems as if there was but I can't picture the route that it took when it was doing a Blue Streak.  Anybody have a list of the original and expanded Blue Streak lines?

After the 1963 trolley system restructure, many of the dieselized routes were pushed north past the old city limits of 85th Street. The 6 and 16, when they were trolleycoaches operated a loop around Green Lake, one in each direction before continuing inbound back to downtown.

Presumably the 6 continued out Aurora to some terminal (maybe to 145th?) and the 16 also went north, perhaps to Northgate Mall. I don't know.

Anyways - do we think the 16 Blue Streak was similar to Metro's 16 Express, operating via I-5 to the NE 65th Street exit?

[Atomic Taco]

51 minutes ago, northwesterner said:

the 16 also went north, perhaps to Northgate Mall. I don't know.

https://seattletransitblog.com/2011/07/04/improving-route-16/#attachment_26038

Scroll down to the "NE Northgate Way" header

[northwesterner]

20 minutes ago, Atomic Taco said:

https://seattletransitblog.com/2011/07/04/improving-route-16/#attachment_26038

Scroll down to the "NE Northgate Way" header

Hmmm...

I asked a friend tonight, he believes most of the extended routes in the post 1963 system were pushed as far north as they could go (for instance, Blue Ridge on the 15), which for the 16 would have been 145th Street. It may have operated north on Meridian to a terminal around 145th Street. I'd assume a truncation back to Northgate Mall (and the Totem Pole layover) would have occurred post-Metro, when service on Meridian north of Northgate would have been merged into the 317, serving North King County. 

[busdude.com]

2 hours ago, northwesterner said:

"Flyer" was present in the roll signs as delivered on the 1976 AMGs. I also know it was available on many of the single roller suburban coaches - there are pictures out there with them signed "Flyer" and a dashcard indicating route and destination.

When Metro did their signage study in 1977 before the rollout of the new signs in 1978, it was considered redundant and eliminated.

Yet the Flyer stop name lived on, when I first heard it was the generic name for a stop built on the ramps at a freeway interchange, such as Star Lake or K-D Road. I still use it to this day.

[dancingfatpotato]

Is there a way to check the assignments for a Particular coach for the day? Say like an website or something? 

[roamer]

13 hours ago, northwesterner said:

After the 1963 trolley system restructure, many of the dieselized routes were pushed north past the old city limits of 85th Street. The 6 and 16, when they were trolleycoaches operated a loop around Green Lake, one in each direction before continuing inbound back to downtown.

Presumably the 6 continued out Aurora to some terminal (maybe to 145th?) and the 16 also went north, perhaps to Northgate Mall. I don't know.

Anyways - do we think the 16 Blue Streak was similar to Metro's 16 Express, operating via I-5 to the NE 65th Street exit?

Yes, that's the way I remember the Green Lake trolley route as a kid growing up  ...and would describe precisely why the Seattle Transit System's moniker of calling it "Green Lake."  When I started working for Metro, the 6 and 16 still were referred to as "Green Lake" even though, as you described, they were no longer tied together physically (only tied together for purposes of run cuts) and by that time, yes, the 6 already, I believe, had been extended to 205th and the 16 to Northgate.  

I'm not sure where the 6 turned back between the time from 1963 to when Metro took over.  Logically, as you point out, 145th would have been the logical place but I can't seem to remember where the terminal was around that location.  The 16 did go to Northgate, however, once dieselization occurred as mentioned but for some reason, I just don't remember it ever going past Northgate although there may be some foggy recollection that it may have followed a 317-type routing going north for a short time but for some reason, I've always pictured it terminating at Northgate.  

When Metro took over, the 406(?) essentially duplicated much of what the route the 6 covered as it ran directly up Aurora making the same stops as the 6 to the county line and then continued up highway 99 through Snohomish county making all stops and Evergreen Way through Everett terminating at the Everett Greyhound Station.  We didn't make any stops once crossing into Everett with the exception of the terminal at Greyhound as, of course, Everett Transit precluded Metro from doing that.  

That route actually was run out of East Base when the base first opened as well as all the Snohomish county routes were at that time.  In fact, when Dearborn closed and East opened, most of the Dearborn routes were run out of East Base including the south end routes until South Base opened a year and a half or so after.  I remember the 150 was one of the staples those of us on the board at East had to work along with that 406(?) and an array of peak-only routes both going into Snohomish county and south to Auburn, Kent, Dash Point, etc.  The exception was the 174 that was temporarily run out of Atlantic during that time from what I can remember.

Once South Base opened and North Seattle Station re-opened as Mercer Base, East Base could then finally be utilized for extensive east side route expansion.

Pertaining to the 16 Blue Streak, I just can't seem to remember the routing.  65th make sense but I just don't have any recollection of that at all for some reason.

What does stick in my mind is remembering riding my first 700 coach in the late 60s and that was on a 7 going through the U-district.  Running up and down the Ave' were primarily 700s as all three northern extensions of the route 7 (15th NE, Lake City, and View Ridge) of course had 700s assigned so the Ave' was saturated with 700s.

The route I remember enjoying when working the board at Atlantic was the Roosevelt line (22-Roosevelt) as it had 700s assigned and nice layovers.  

[roamer]

8150 and 8158 on the B-line this evening.

[Atomic Taco]

12 hours ago, dancingfatpotato said:

Is there a way to check the assignments for a Particular coach for the day? Say like an website or something? 

No, only way is to check its activity on OBA.

[dancingfatpotato]

I've noticed a significant difference in width between the new 8100 and the 6800s

[OR Transit Fan]

2 minutes ago, dancingfatpotato said:

I've noticed a significant difference in width between the new 8100 and the 6800s

The 8000’s and 8100’s are the same width. 102 inches 

[roamer]

fatpotato, not only are the 8000 and 8100 the same width at 102" as OR Transit Fan has mentioned but so are the 6800s.  Taking it further, all Metro's buses are 102" wide with the exception of the 30' Gillig Phantoms which are 96" wide.  

102" is the maximum width for any vehicle per Federal regulations.  Prior to 1976, 96" was the maximum width but  transit agencies had exemptions so that their buses could be 102" wide.  I recall the instructors telling us that several times when going through training  ...that Metro, at that time, had permits that exempted them from the width restriction and allowed them to use 102" wide buses that exceeded the restrictions on local, state, and federal highways.  In 1976, legislation was passed to allow buses to be 102" wide without special permits.  By 1982 commercial trucks were allowed by law to be 102" wide.  

[anonymous guy]

Was catching up on the Northwest Bus Fans page and it appears poster busdude.com was one of the unfortunate victims of the Seattle to Portland Cascades Amtrak crash that happened in DuPont, WA yesterday. 

 

RIP

[roamer]

 

7 hours ago, anonymous guy said:

Was catching up on the Northwest Bus Fans page and it appears poster busdude.com was one of the unfortunate victims of the Seattle to Portland Cascades Amtrak crash that happened in DuPont, WA yesterday. 

 

RIP

Yes, when I saw that on the news this morning, I was stunned.  It's just devastating news.  Zack was truly a bus and train aficionado.

I have always enjoyed his contributions here on the forum.  I've spent hours examining his huge collection of photos and videos he has generously shared on online venues.  His adventures with his Orion (PT427) always intrigued me.  

Although I never had the pleasure of meeting him in person, I know some of you here on the forum have spent time with him so I hope you'll share your memories of the good times spent. 

It's just heartbreaking news. My thoughts are with Zack's family.  

[roamer]

For those who may not be local to the area, I just posted these links over on the Amtrak thread.   As I mentioned over there, I've been distraught all day over this  ...Zack and I at one time had some banter in PMs and emails and we didn't always see eye-to-eye but I could just feel how passionate he was about buses and trains.  

I'm at a loss as to why this has hit me so hard after learning it was Zack who was one of the victims of this accident.

May Zack and Jim rest in peace.  

Best friends who loved trains killed in catastrophic derailment

Zack Willhoite: Lifelong rail, transit enthusiast killed in train derailment

Pierce Transit employee, rail advocate identified as two Amtrak victims

Rail enthusiasts killed in Amtrak derailment were excited for ride

Duo killed in Amtrak train derailment were longtime rail advocates eager for trip

Close friends who loved trains among those killed in Amtrak train derailment in Washington state

[M. Parsons]

Thanks roamer,

Years ago I was in frequent contact with Zack, even having his famous busdude.com website hosted through the packaged we have barp.ca on for a number years.
Who remember's his GMFishbowl group on eGroups? Boy that was a long time ago now. Hell, I was even a moderator on that.
Over the years we drifted apart (probably because I've never fully embraced this Facebook thing!), but, never the less, this is a devastating loss to both the railfan, transit enthusiast, and transportation advocacy communities.

My condolences to Zack and Jim's friends and family.

[anonymous guy]

I wonder how awestruck these men would have been to know their life stories would known to the world someday: https://www.nytimes.com/2017/12/19/us/amtrak-derailment-victims-washington.html

Unfortunate it couldn't be under better circumstances, but I'm sure they're proud to be known as transit enthusiasts.

[LRT]

I am absolutely blown away about the passing of our fellow member & my union brother (ATU 758 Pierce County Transit) Zack Willhoiteand. I don't believe I've ever communicated with him but we definitely share the same passion.

I send my condolences to Zack & Jim's family & friends

[captaintrolley]

14 minutes ago, LRT said:

I am absolutely blown away about the passing of our fellow member union brother (ATU 758 Pierce County Transit) Zack Willhoite. I don't believe I've ever communicated with him but we definitely share the same passion.

I send my condolences to Zack & Jim's family & friends

I know right.. Like we've all done it, gotten up early with eager anticipation of riding a new vehicle or checking out a new route. I think what makes their death so profound is that it  could have been any one of us. I have never met either, but I had commented on one of Zack's FB posts only a few days ago.

[Chris H]

I didn't know Zack, but I heard of him because of his nickname busdude and his posts of his Orion I. This comes to a complete shock to many of us who enjoy transit.

I hope Pierce Transit or someone will preserve his beloved Orion I and at least dedicate it for Zack.

I send my condolences to Zack & Jim's family & friends.

[pnwelevator]

1 hour ago, Chris H said:

I didn't know Zack, but I heard of him because of his nickname busdude and his posts of his Orion I. This comes to a complete shock to many of us who enjoy transit.

I hope Pierce Transit or someone will preserve his beloved Orion I and at least dedicate it for Zack.

I send my condolences to Zack & Jim's family & friends.

He was a fun guy to be around, great sense of humor, even tho I really only knew him personally for about a year, he was a good friend, my condolences as well out to him & Jim's family.