CLRV4037

Streetcar News

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7 hours ago, nfitz said:

Good think they did perhaps. If Broadview can't handle a Sunday with only 17 cars in service, but mostly Flexities, on a 7-minute headway, what's going to happen in rush hour, when plan to have 24 Flexities in service, plus ALRVs, on a 4-minute headway - or less.

The TTC is going to have to come up with some kind of plan to deal with this. Other than expanding the loops (which their is available land at both stations), either shorter or no layovers, short turning cars before they reach the the stations, or rerouting the 505 so king cars can use both tracks.

Of course the TTC managed to run far more cars through both Broadview and Dundas West in the past, with both Dundas and King sharing single track loops.

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16 minutes ago, IRT_BMT_IND said:

short turning cars before they reach the the stations

Could you realign the #504/#514, to have one route going from Dundas West to Distillery and another route going from Broadview to Dufferin Gates? Would that ease the pressure on the terminals at all?

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2 hours ago, GORDOOM said:

Could you realign the #504/#514, to have one route going from Dundas West to Distillery and another route going from Broadview to Dufferin Gates? Would that ease the pressure on the terminals at all?

No - you'd wouldn't be providing enough service from Broadview to River - where you frequently see people left standing now. I can't speak to the west.

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2 hours ago, nfitz said:

No - you'd wouldn't be providing enough service from Broadview to River - where you frequently see people left standing now. I can't speak to the west.

Roncy is busy too. Lots of shops out there. I don't go there in rush hour through so I'm not sure if people are left behind. The 514 headways won't do. The least busy part of the 504 is between Queensway and Dufferin. 

For (offpeak hours) the 505 it's between Landsdowne and Dundas West Stn. 506 is least busy on Howard Park. Upper Gerrard is quieter bust still has a higher demand than Howard Park I believe.

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20 minutes ago, Xtrazsteve said:

For the 505 it's between Landsdowne and Dundas West Stn. 506 is least busy on Howard Park. Upper Gerrard is quieter bust still has a higher demand than Howard Park I believe.

Well, I boarded 506 on Upper Gerrard about 8:10 AM this morning, and looking at the gaps before and after, it was perhaps 1 minute late. And was standing room only by Woodbine (this must be pretty close to ultimate peak). If that helps put 506 in perspective. Needless to say, people were being left behind by about Jones.

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22 minutes ago, nfitz said:

Well, I boarded 506 on Upper Gerrard about 8:10 AM this morning, and looking at the gaps before and after, it was perhaps 1 minute late. And was standing room only by Woodbine (this must be pretty close to ultimate peak). If that helps put 506 in perspective. Needless to say, people were being left behind by about Jones.

I was mostly mentioning offpeak hours, but it's true for all times too. The 506 is connected to the subway in the east. Upper Gerrard does have a larger demand than Howard Park. Most of the demand comes east of Lansdowne on the 504, 505 and 506. Lower Gerrard would have a higher demand if it wasn't so packed. TTC looks at their loading but I don't think they properly calculated those missed trips by people avoiding the streetcars all together cause it's near impossible to board.

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1 hour ago, Xtrazsteve said:

I was mostly mentioning offpeak hours, but it's true for all times too. The 506 is connected to the subway in the east. Upper Gerrard does have a larger demand than Howard Park. 

There's always people getting on the 506 at Main - but most are off by Coxwell - except when the subway is down ... and then it's standing room only at Main! So I end walking down to Kingston Road.

I don't think the subway particularly adds to the AM peak loading on 506 (which is probably about Logan, with all the kids who get off at Degrassi, and people changing cars at Broadview.But I don't disagree about Howard Park.

1 hour ago, Xtrazsteve said:

Lower Gerrard would have a higher demand if it wasn't so packed. TTC looks at their loading but I don't think they properly calculated those missed trips by people avoiding the streetcars all together cause it's near impossible to board.

I think that's true of many lines. I've always thought it was true of Spadina.  And I think it's true of the Yonge subway as well.  It will be interesting to see what happens to ridership as the new cars are added, and more capacity is available. Does growth accelerate?

You'd think we'd just about be able to see if there was any trend on Spadina now, if the ridership data was more frequent and granular. Oh well, I guess Presto brings that.

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53 minutes ago, nfitz said:

There's always people getting on the 506 at Main - but most are off by Coxwell - except when the subway is down ... and then it's standing room only at Main! So I end walking down to Kingston Road.

I don't think the subway particularly adds to the AM peak loading on 506 (which is probably about Logan, with all the kids who get off at Degrassi, and people changing cars at Broadview.But I don't disagree about Howard Park.

I agree. Hardly anyone would want to spend extra time riding the streetcar from the subway, especially if they have a seat from Kennedy. Most of the demand comes locally where it doesn't make sense to take the bus north to the subway and back down on Yonge or University.

The only major subway to streetcar destinations are Queens Quay via 509/510, Spadina via 510, Bathurst via 511, Roncesvalles via 504, Broadview via 504/505 and St Clair via 512. I would say most people will avoid transferring from the subway to a streetcar if the have to spend more than 20 minutes on them.

1 hour ago, nfitz said:

You'd think we'd just about be able to see if there was any trend on Spadina now, if the ridership data was more frequent and granular. Oh well, I guess Presto brings that.

Or found out how much less they are making cause transfers are accepted within two hours. Althrough we have discussed that walking off a streetcar and into Broadview station will result in another charge, I believe if one would have walked to a bus stop on Broadview and took the bus into the station, it should count as a valid transfer. One can do whatever quick shopping on Danforth and still get back in within a timeframe. Bus transfers are not location based as many times boarding location still appear as "0" or at a garage. They don't have valid transfer points setup yet. Maybe the VISION system can fix this.

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18 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

The 506 is connected to the subway in the east. Upper Gerrard does have a larger demand than Howard Park.

Upper Gerrard is considerably longer than the Howard Park section. But it's true, if there are people left on the Carlton car when it turns onto Howard Park, they mostly get off at Roncesvalles. And I've seen people staring out at High Park loop, wondering where High Park subway station is.

The streetcars ran into High Park, on the same alignment as far as I can tell, at least nby 1899. Hopefully they won't get removed. Howard Park is the last quiet residential street with streetcars on it. (Used to be on streets such as Dovercourt, Hallam, Lappin, etc.)

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On 4/25/2017 at 3:23 PM, Ed T. said:

Upper Gerrard is considerably longer than the Howard Park section. But it's true, if there are people left on the Carlton car when it turns onto Howard Park, they mostly get off at Roncesvalles. And I've seen people staring out at High Park loop, wondering where High Park subway station is.

The streetcars ran into High Park, on the same alignment as far as I can tell, at least nby 1899. Hopefully they won't get removed. Howard Park is the last quiet residential street with streetcars on it. (Used to be on streets such as Dovercourt, Hallam, Lappin, etc.)

It's interesting to ride a streetcar in a residential neighbourhood without all the shops and people walking on the streets. The 506 offers that on Howard Park and Upper Gerrard. Hopefully the 506 will stay put.

 

4415 was tracking on the 509 most of the day. It's back?

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