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Ontario Line (formerly Downtown Relief Line)


Orion9131
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an awful lot of it also seems a bit pie-in-the-sky.

Indeed. For example, anyone who takes the RT knows that there is still freight traffic on the Stouffville line.

That said, the freight volume is low enough that it could be moved to night only operations and the union station capacity issue can be partly solved with better integration with GO transit on the lakeshore line; especially after the planned electrification. I mean, once service is boosted to a train every 15 minutes after electrification, does every train running on the Stouffville line really have to end up at union station?

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I know GO owns the Stouffville line and this idea intends of beefing up service along that corridor. However running it along the Lakeshore corridor is where I see the first major snag. As far as I know I don't think there's a dedicated track into Union. Meaning it would have to be negotiated or built outright, which could drive up the cost. Otherwise you wind up building another feeder line into the Danforth line which will do nothing for the situation at Yonge station.

Says who? Use FRA-compliant DMUs and it doesn't become an issue.

It's precisely the little niggly details like that which is why I made my original post.

Dan

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Surprised no one has posted about the I-METRO-E proposal by a Markham city councillor, which I personally think is a much better option over building the DRL (at least for commuters that currently travel using an east-end feeder bus service, east of Kennedy).

http://www2.markham....m#_Toc320775952

http://www.insidetor...m/print/1335146 Article including map.

Says who? Use FRA-compliant DMUs and it doesn't become an issue.

It's precisely the little niggly details like that which is why I made my original post.

Dan

The 10-car Stouffville line trains currently run every half hour (and have crowding issues), which means if they were replaced with single-deck 2-car DMUs (with a capacity of say 55/car), you'd need one every four minutes to maintain the same capacity in rush hour. With 4-car units, you'd need one every eight minutes. The issue then would not be line capacity, but platform capacity at Union. (You'd also need to double-track most of the current line, but that's easier).

Also, are there any FRA-compliant low-floor DMUs?

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Is there much demand for FRA compliant DMU's? Seems agencies are more content in buying the rail ROW, or negotiating temporal separation deals.

There is - there wouldn't be competing designs from Siemens, Bombardier, Nippon Sharyo and US Railcar otherwise.

Dan

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Does this count?

(yes, I know you'd have to find someone to build the units...)

As a low floor vehicle? Meh.

Only the trailer has a lower floor. The bottom level of the power units is at the "regular" height of a passenger car.

As for a builder, US Railcar owns the designs.

Dan

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  • 1 month later...

Downtown relief line 'next priority': TTC Chair

"I think generally speaking across the region, we know we need to find ways to raise this investment money to continue to build this needed infrastructure. The next question is how we do it," said Stintz.

Stintz said she didn't want to rule any revenue source out, although she added she feels are "a lot of inherent problems with tolls."

Meanwhile Mayor Rob Ford, who was at the event on Keele Street just south of Finch Avenue West, saw things differently.

"We can find efficiencies. I'm not one to implement new taxes," Ford said.

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Great. Now we just need to invent a TBM that can cut through bedrock as easily as we can walk through air and we can get started. </sarcasm>

And someone needs to point out to Ford that it's doubtful that there are enough efficiencies to cover the removal of the land transfer tax before he can start dreaming of subways again.

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Great. Now we just need to invent a TBM that can cut through bedrock as easily as we can walk through air and we can get started. </sarcasm>

And someone needs to point out to Ford that it's doubtful that there are enough efficiencies to cover the removal of the land transfer tax before he can start dreaming of subways again.

Don't worry about Ford anymore, he's impotent on this file (and other's). Watch and listen to what Byford and Stintz are saying and doing. They're running the show now, Ford's just along for the ride. :lol:
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After all, if his persecutory delusions result in him getting enough pity votes, he could make transit even worse in this city if he's reelected.
He has little influence on the transit file now as mayor. I can't see that this would suddenly change if he was re-elected mayor, if the council make-up didn't change significantly.
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I can't see that this would suddenly change if he was re-elected mayor, if the council make-up didn't change significantly.

That's the key point. The thing is, part of Ford's "woe is me" campaign is to also attempt to change the makeup of council and if you get enough people like Pasternak, who "don’t want to see North York left at the altar on transit any more", running on the Ford ticket and winning, we're going to have a mess on our hands.

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  • 1 month later...

Somebody define 'sheeple'?

People that act like sheep and stay and/or follow the flock. They don't make use of their own minds to look around their surroundings and adjust their behavior/path/direction/whatever to achieve a different and/or better result.

Skip to 1:50 for further explanation.

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I wonder if they'd ever debate installing a new pocket track either just north or south of Rosedale Station strictly for the purpose of storing a "saviour" or two for the morning rush hours, that ONLY run Bloor-Union on demand? At least the section north of Bloor is not tunnelled, so the cost is reduced exponentially in that sense.

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I wonder if they'd ever debate installing a new pocket track either just north or south of Rosedale Station strictly for the purpose of storing a "saviour" or two for the morning rush hours, that ONLY run Bloor-Union on demand? At least the section north of Bloor is not tunnelled, so the cost is reduced exponentially in that sense.

They have no problem running them from Davisville, so why bother?

Dan

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They have no problem running them from Davisville, so why bother?

Dan

You can only store one at Davisville. You really only can store about 3-4 "saviour" trains on the Yonge side. They can store 2 at York Mills but they generally don't.

It would make sense to do something like Orion 7029 suggested and keep those "saviour" trains running limited distance trips between Eglinton and St. Clair West, and deadheading back. You would need dedicated staff at the offload station to help minimize delays and service gaps.

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You can only store one at Davisville. You really only can store about 3-4 "saviour" trains on the Yonge side. They can store 2 at York Mills but they generally don't.

It would make sense to do something like Orion 7029 suggested and keep those "saviour" trains running limited distance trips between Eglinton and St. Clair West, and deadheading back. You would need dedicated staff at the offload station to help minimize delays and service gaps.

They can store quite a bit more than just one "saviour" at Davisville, although due to the track layout there they can only dispatch one every several minutes. And while I will concede that it would be very handy to have a location closer to Bloor to more immediately respond to gaps and crush-loaded situations, they seem to do passably well with the current setup.

Not that long ago, they used to run 3 or 4 "trippers" that basically ran on demand back and forth from Eglinton to Union (or to whatever location they could find on the University side to stick a train without delaying those behind) every morning rush hour. Maybe it's time they go back to doing something like this?

Dan

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They can store quite a bit more than just one "saviour" at Davisville, although due to the track layout there they can only dispatch one every several minutes.

Uh, no. They only have one standby at Davisville if they send it there. They can store a bunch of trains at Davisville, but to get them out, you need yard operators, and a supervisor to supervise. Mainline folk don't drive in the yard, other than the buildup and hoslters.

...and to add, mainline operators wouldn't know what to do with some of the switches in davisville.

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Uh, no. They only have one standby at Davisville if they send it there. They can store a bunch of trains at Davisville, but to get them out, you need yard operators, and a supervisor to supervise. Mainline folk don't drive in the yard, other than the buildup and hoslters.

...and to add, mainline operators wouldn't know what to do with some of the switches in davisville.

Is this a somewhat new thing? I seem to recall that they used to store at least three trippers at Davisville. Then again, this was back in the late 1990s, so perhaps it had to do with the closing of Davisville as an active division?

Dan

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Is this a somewhat new thing? I seem to recall that they used to store at least three trippers at Davisville. Then again, this was back in the late 1990s, so perhaps it had to do with the closing of Davisville as an active division?

Dan

They do bring out a few trains for the morning and afternoon rush from davisville, (>3) but there is always yard and supervisory staff involved.

The suggestion was about constantly circulating service extras on shorter trips, rather than storing them in some siding or pocket/centre track until needed.

The trouble is, they already do a form of this with the St. Clair West turnbacks.

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  • 2044 changed the title to Ontario Line (formerly Downtown Relief Line)

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