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GRT Driver Rudeness


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I have been taking GRT pretty much daily since 2001. In all these years, I've only seen two drivers act extremely appauling, and one of those times was tonight.

The first time was about 5 years ago, where a bus driver refused to stop to let anyone off the bus for about 5 minutes because someone kept pulling the bell. He wouldn't even stop to let the lady with her kids and groceries off. I called GRT about that when I got home, but never heard anything after that.

Today, I was waiting at King St S and Allen St E (right near uptown Waterloo). The bus was a few minutes late... it was supposed be there at 21:12, it was 21:15. I was waiting at an intersection with a bus shelter and below a street light, so I was pretty visible. Even still, sometimes drivers just aren't paying attention and fail to notice the person on the sidewalk. I've have drivers go by a few times. Sometimes I think they did it on purpose (e.g. I was in plain sight on a sunny day, but had my bike with me) and other times I think they truely just failed to see me. As you've probably figured out, this bus ran the stop.

However, if this driver had claimed that he didn't see me, then that would have far worse implications. Why? Because when I noticed the bus was accelerating as it approached, and failed to signal that it was pulling over, I leaned out into the road way and waved my arms. This put me right where the bus was coming, and had I not leaned back a second before he passed, I would have wound up on his windsheild. So that leaves two options, either he was running the stop intentionally or he was not paying attention to something directly in his path and nearly hit a pedestrian.

Quite annoyed at both the bus driving by and nearly finding out what a windsheild hitting you at 50Km/h feels like, I tried calling GRT customer service but they had closed at 20:30. So I waited for the next bus. When the next bus got into the terminal, I noticed that the bus that ran my stop and nearly hit me, was still there. I wasn't eager to accuse the wrong driver, so I checked the bus number, and the route. I remembered that the bus that drove by was the 7B Fairview, #24xx, and the driver had glasses (the driver said the run number was 712 for anyone who's curious). I checked this bus and sure enough, it was the 7B Fairview, #2428, and the driver was wearing glasses. Given the fact that the 7B was at 30 minute frequency at this time, this was the same bus.

Now for a disclaimer... I was upset, very upset. However, I've worked in customer service for over 3 years, and I know being rude or yelling doesn't usually get you a good response. So I walked onto the bus, and very forcefully, but still respectfully and calmly spoke to him. His responses however, were absoutely deplorable. Obviously I don't have a recording of the conversation, so I'll try to paraphrase it as best as I can...

Me: "Excuse me, I'd like to know why you drove past my stop and nearly hit me?!?"

Driver: (a "fuck off" attitude) "Where was that"

Me: "Two intersections after King and Willis"

Driver: "Wasn't me"

Me: "Um it was the 7B that drove past me so it must had been you"

Drive: "You're mistaken son" ("Son" was said in an extremely condesending tone, like a "whatever kid" tone)

Me: "I saw the route I know it was you, and it IS NOT SON" (Plus I was in business attire, so it's not like I was dressed like a regular 20 year old joe)

Driver: (Shrugs) "Don't know what to tell you"

Me: "I was leaning out on the road and you nearly hit me. So either you drove by intentionally, or would have hit me because you weren't paying attention"

Driver: (Shrugs again and in a "I don't give a flying fuck" tone and facial expression) "I drove by there and there was no one there"

Me: "Well I'm pretty sure I know where I was"

Driver: (Shrugs again) "Don't know what to tell you"

Me: "You know, I've worked in customer service for a number of years..."

Driver: (Cuts me off) "Good for you"

Me: "...and I would never speak to someone with the disrespect and lack of concern as you are now."

Driver: (shrugs)

Me: "You know, even if you think someone is [full of it], you should still try to pretend like you care"

Driver: (still the "are you done yet?" tone) "Thanks for the advice"

Me: "Well I guess I'll be speaking to the supervisor tomorrow" (I go to get off the bus)

Driver: "You go do that"

Me: (turns around and gets back on) "Actually you can get a supervisor here"

Driver: (With a staunch "get the fuck off my bus" tone) "There's a supervisor up beside the security office"

Me: "I want to speak with one here"

Driver: "If you want a supervisor then go up to their office, there's one on duty in there"

Me: "Fine. I'll go talk with them then."

So I get off the bus, go to the supervisor's office, and of course there's no one there. I found a security guard who took some basic information and said he'd let a supervisor know and I'd get a call back.

One thing I'd like to note, is how often the driver changed his position. First he didn't drive past that stop, then I must have been mistaken on the bus destination sign, bus number, and the face of the driver, then he just doesn't seem to know anything.

Simply because of the driver nearly hitting me, and then as I've put it, not "giving a flying fuck" about it, when I got home I called Waterloo Region Police Services and reported to them that the driver was driving in a manner that I would have been hit had I not gotten out of the way. The dispatcher told me that because their was no actually accident there wasn't much they could do, but they did take the information and said they would contact GRT tomorrow morning to talk with a supervisor and try to have a talk with the driver about it. Understandably they can't do much since it's just my word against his, but I did appreciate the genuine concern the dispatcher had.

I've tried to remember this to the best of my ability. Although I may not have it right word for word, the tones, attitudes, and the types of responses I got from the driver are still very fresh in my memory.

I just can't believe that any person who is in a job that requires some level of social skills, would give a "fuck off" attitude so immediately and persistantly when a customer brings a serious concern to them. I doubt anything serious will happen to this driver due to the union protections, but I don't think anyone would doubt such an employee would be immediately fired from almost any other job if that happened.

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Ya know, I can't say for sure what happened or didn't happen in your case, but put yourself in the shoes of the driver...even just for a moment. We deal with some real wackos out there (and no, I'm not saying you're a wacko or anything), late July I had some lady call me every name in the book in front of the whole bus full of people because some other guy on the bus was making comments about her and I didn't immediately kick the guy off the bus (the bus was pretty full, and I didn't personally hear anything until the lady started letting her feelings known to me personally), but she was making such a stink the guy got off on his own right then and there anyways, so, problem solved, right? No, she wanted my name, called me names, threatened to sue me etc. I was just shaking, nervous and angry, and if I had been in civillian clothing going about my personal life somewhere else in the world I would've told her right where to go and how to get there, but I can't do that on the job. Anyways, I reported it immediately to a supervisor, but within the next 2 days she was still calling management and her regional councillor etc. and the fun continued.

Now, when we get so many people like that on the bus how are we to distinguish what is and isn't a legimate complaint anymore. Sure, we're in the customer service business, but this isn't retail where the majority of people WANT to be there, many of our customers are those who don't want to be customers, they are low-income, or mentally unstable, or physically challenged in one way or another and are reliant on the bus and if they have a bee in their bonnet or just generally a bad day they let us hear it. Even just last week, I had a crush load on the 7F and I was already 10-15min. late, stopped to let someone off at Fourth and Wilson on the way to Fairview, and had a 25-30yo lady with a stroller come running up to the bus wanting on board. I requested that she fold the stroller up because I had a crush load, but she didn't want to fold up the stroller, even though the 2yo kid was already walking beside her, to which I replied she would need to wait for the next bus in that case, and it would be along shortly...but instead of seeing the crush load bus she decided to call me and @$$hole anyways, even though if I was even remotely on time, she wouldn't even have seen my bus at all.

Drivers are human too, and to be completely honest, there's more than a few customers out there who, if they were anywhere else, they would deserve to be told how it is, but you can't say anything, you got to sit there and take it, be as politically correct and nice as possible...get a few of them in the day and you'll be tempted to pull the hair out of your own head. Now, I'll say again, I wasn't there and didn't see what happened at either location, but even if you had a legitimate concern, what did you hope to accomplish by rasing it with the driver? Now, assuming he didn't do what you described on purpose (which is still possible, but he's just going to deny it anyways and you'll still be in the same position, but now with a driver who doesn't like you on top of your earlier problems) from the driver's point of view (and really, no offense intended, I'm just trying to illistrate a point), he's got yet another irrational customer going off on a tangent, he's got to sit there and be nice, even though he's probably feeling that he hasn't done anything wrong, and despite being politically correct this customer won't drop the issue, but he can't say anything offensive, but his feelings come out in his tone regardless, but again driver's are only human too, and deep down inside we can think some pretty nasty things. Any number of factors could've played a role in how he responded, could've been behind schedule from the start of his shift, could be nasty or rude customers etc.

Now, having said that, you could've made your own case look better having not said all that to the driver at all. Yes, we have some rude and bad bus drivers out there (even some who don't like other bus drivers), and yes, you have a concern...so find security or a supervisor, put the details in writing, and call customer service during business hours, by being as respectful as possible about the incident you only help yourself. Now, don't take this the wrong way, but what you've gone and done is made yourself look irrational and it's much less likely that anyone's going to take the complaint seriously. If you play the respect is a two-way street game and generally customer service will bend over backwards to accomodate you.

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I've learned that most drivers don't give a shit so don't bring anything up with them. Their only job is to drive, and even if it is something as simple as the heat being on too high (in AUGUST! :D) or the sign displaying the wrong route (telling them that usually gets me a "what the fuck do you want me to do about it?" from them) I find that bringing it up with the driver results in nothing good.

And never--NEVER--tell them when they're early. EVER.

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when I noticed the bus was accelerating as it approached, and failed to signal that it was pulling over, I leaned out into the road way and waved my arms. This put me right where the bus was coming, and had I not leaned back a second before he passed, I would have wound up on his windsheild. So that leaves two options, either he was running the stop intentionally or he was not paying attention to something directly in his path and nearly hit a pedestrian.
He probably thought you were some whacko for going into the path of the bus. People that run across roads against red lights and hop out into the path of buses will always get left behind for safety reasons. Stopping to pick up people who perform moronic actions only condones the behaviour. I would have left you behind as well and would have had security there to get rid of you long before you went searching for them. Also I dont know why security is taking customer complaints. They should be out doing their job. Are they the after hours customer service reps now? No wonder the terminal is a breeding ground for gangs!
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There is one driver on the 7 route where both times I was on his bus he missed a stop.

First time he didn't stop despite a stop request.

Second time he didn't stop the bus at a bus stop despite me ringing the bell for it and a passenger waiting at that stop. He bypassed one more stop before passengers on the bus decided to yell at him to let us off.

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Now for a disclaimer... I was upset, very upset. However, I've worked in customer service for over 3 years, and I know being rude or yelling doesn't usually get you a good response. So I walked onto the bus, and very forcefully, but still respectfully and calmly spoke to him. His responses however, were absoutely deplorable. Obviously I don't have a recording of the conversation, so I'll try to paraphrase it as best as I can...

Me: "Excuse me, I'd like to know why you drove past my stop and nearly hit me?!?"

Driver: (a "fuck off" attitude) "Where was that"

Me: "Two intersections after King and Willis"

Driver: "Wasn't me"

Me: "Um it was the 7B that drove past me so it must had been you"

Drive: "You're mistaken son" ("Son" was said in an extremely condesending tone, like a "whatever kid" tone)

Me: "I saw the route I know it was you, and it IS NOT SON" (Plus I was in business attire, so it's not like I was dressed like a regular 20 year old joe)

Driver: (Shrugs) "Don't know what to tell you"

Me: "I was leaning out on the road and you nearly hit me. So either you drove by intentionally, or would have hit me because you weren't paying attention"

Driver: (Shrugs again and in a "I don't give a flying fuck" tone and facial expression) "I drove by there and there was no one there"

Me: "Well I'm pretty sure I know where I was"

Driver: (Shrugs again) "Don't know what to tell you"

Me: "You know, I've worked in customer service for a number of years..."

Driver: (Cuts me off) "Good for you"

Me: "...and I would never speak to someone with the disrespect and lack of concern as you are now."

Driver: (shrugs)

Me: "You know, even if you think someone is [full of it], you should still try to pretend like you care"

Driver: (still the "are you done yet?" tone) "Thanks for the advice"

Me: "Well I guess I'll be speaking to the supervisor tomorrow" (I go to get off the bus)

Driver: "You go do that"

Me: (turns around and gets back on) "Actually you can get a supervisor here"

Driver: (With a staunch "get the fuck off my bus" tone) "There's a supervisor up beside the security office"

Me: "I want to speak with one here"

Driver: "If you want a supervisor then go up to their office, there's one on duty in there"

Me: "Fine. I'll go talk with them then."

Are you serious? I don't understand what it is with you people where you get yourselves involved in these confrontations where it is obvious you will not get a positive response. What were you expecting? Absolutely ridiculous.

Firstly, you should not have approached the driver you were sure, but not certain that it was. Secondly, who do you think you are going in there with your "I've worked in customer service..." non-sense? It's not your job to be lecturing him, so don't be surprised you received the response that you did.

I'm quite sure you've never driven a bus so let me explain a little something about driving at night. When the inside of your bus is illumintaed (which is GRT policy at night), there is often glare which can make it difficult to see depending on the conditions outside. I know that some drivers are idiots, however I'm almost certain that there are none who genuinely have no concern for the public. Do you think any of them actually want to live with the thought permanently embedded in their minds that they killed someone? Absolutely not. Because of this, it leads me to belive that he simply didn't see you due to the glare.

Another thing I've learned is that many things depend on perception. To you he simply wasn't paying attention and then nearly hit you. To the driver, he didn't see you due to glare and then had some idiot run out in front of his bus, likely scaring the hell out of him. Would you stop for someone like that? Likely not even though your intention was not to scare him.

What were you expecting when you threatened to speak to the supervisor, and then demanding he call one to the bus? At this point you've left the bus but went back for yet another confrontation.

All in all, you instigated a confrontation, accomplished nothing and made yourself look like a fool. Well done.

I've learned that most drivers don't give a shit so don't bring anything up with them. Their only job is to drive, and even if it is something as simple as the heat being on too high (in AUGUST! :D) or the sign displaying the wrong route (telling them that usually gets me a "what the fuck do you want me to do about it?" from them) I find that bringing it up with the driver results in nothing good.

And never--NEVER--tell them when they're early. EVER.

My watch is almost perfectly in sync with the clocks at the Charles St. terminal and various other GRT facilities. I never run early and somehow have had numerous people tell me that I am. Since I'm the one driving the bus on the schedule that is based on the time GRT provides me with, it is the passenger's responsibility to ensure their watch is in sync with mine, not the other way around. So yea... don't ever come on my bus and tell me that I'm running early unless you're dead certain you have the same time as me.

That being said, I'm also fully aware that some drivers do run early, which is unfortunate, although there's nothing I can do about it. It does get rather tiresome hearing that you're late or early all the time when people's watches are off.

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Ya know, I can't say for sure what happened or didn't happen in your case, but put yourself in the shoes of the driver...even just for a moment. We deal with some real wackos out there (and no, I'm not saying you're a wacko or anything), late July I had some lady call me every name in the book in front of the whole bus full of people because some other guy on the bus was making comments about her and I didn't immediately kick the guy off the bus (the bus was pretty full, and I didn't personally hear anything until the lady started letting her feelings known to me personally), but she was making such a stink the guy got off on his own right then and there anyways, so, problem solved, right? No, she wanted my name, called me names, threatened to sue me etc. I was just shaking, nervous and angry, and if I had been in civillian clothing going about my personal life somewhere else in the world I would've told her right where to go and how to get there, but I can't do that on the job. Anyways, I reported it immediately to a supervisor, but within the next 2 days she was still calling management and her regional councillor etc. and the fun continued.

Now, when we get so many people like that on the bus how are we to distinguish what is and isn't a legimate complaint anymore. Sure, we're in the customer service business, but this isn't retail where the majority of people WANT to be there, many of our customers are those who don't want to be customers, they are low-income, or mentally unstable, or physically challenged in one way or another and are reliant on the bus and if they have a bee in their bonnet or just generally a bad day they let us hear it. Even just last week, I had a crush load on the 7F and I was already 10-15min. late, stopped to let someone off at Fourth and Wilson on the way to Fairview, and had a 25-30yo lady with a stroller come running up to the bus wanting on board. I requested that she fold the stroller up because I had a crush load, but she didn't want to fold up the stroller, even though the 2yo kid was already walking beside her, to which I replied she would need to wait for the next bus in that case, and it would be along shortly...but instead of seeing the crush load bus she decided to call me and @$$hole anyways, even though if I was even remotely on time, she wouldn't even have seen my bus at all.

Drivers are human too, and to be completely honest, there's more than a few customers out there who, if they were anywhere else, they would deserve to be told how it is, but you can't say anything, you got to sit there and take it, be as politically correct and nice as possible...get a few of them in the day and you'll be tempted to pull the hair out of your own head. Now, I'll say again, I wasn't there and didn't see what happened at either location, but even if you had a legitimate concern, what did you hope to accomplish by rasing it with the driver? Now, assuming he didn't do what you described on purpose (which is still possible, but he's just going to deny it anyways and you'll still be in the same position, but now with a driver who doesn't like you on top of your earlier problems) from the driver's point of view (and really, no offense intended, I'm just trying to illistrate a point), he's got yet another irrational customer going off on a tangent, he's got to sit there and be nice, even though he's probably feeling that he hasn't done anything wrong, and despite being politically correct this customer won't drop the issue, but he can't say anything offensive, but his feelings come out in his tone regardless, but again driver's are only human too, and deep down inside we can think some pretty nasty things. Any number of factors could've played a role in how he responded, could've been behind schedule from the start of his shift, could be nasty or rude customers etc.

Now, having said that, you could've made your own case look better having not said all that to the driver at all. Yes, we have some rude and bad bus drivers out there (even some who don't like other bus drivers), and yes, you have a concern...so find security or a supervisor, put the details in writing, and call customer service during business hours, by being as respectful as possible about the incident you only help yourself. Now, don't take this the wrong way, but what you've gone and done is made yourself look irrational and it's much less likely that anyone's going to take the complaint seriously. If you play the respect is a two-way street game and generally customer service will bend over backwards to accomodate you.

Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I can definately understand what drivers' go through and how they feel. I'm not going to play the "who's got a worse job" card, but as someone who's worked in really nasty call centres, I can definately understand. In one call centre I worked at, it was high pressure from management and customers treated us like crap. People are big over the phone, so you can probably guess the types of things people say to us that they wouldn't say to someone's face. All the calls are recorded, so despite how the person was acting, our responses were "yes sir," "yes ma'am".

That being said, I got my share of crazies, and my share of people who were legitimately upset. I still had to treat both with respect. Sure if a customer was abusive we could threaten to disconnect, but we still had to be respectful and polite until that point. That's where this driver failed. Right off the beginning the tone and attitude was uncaring and disrespectful. He might have had a rough day, he might have just had a crazy customer. But you know what? I got crazy after crazy every 7 minutes for 8 hours a day. When I got to the point that I wanted to be rude and disrespectful you know what I did? I found a new job. When you are an employee dealing with customer service, you don't get to take your stress out on someone from the get go. No driver should have to put up with what I'm sure a lot do, but unfortunately other job markets are a lot less rewarding, and a lot more stressful. As someone who's worked in crappy conditions, this driver gets my understanding, but not my acceptance. At the end of the day, he acted inappropriately to a customer. If he can not do the job in a proper manner, he should not do the job at all.

As for talking to the driver directly, there wasn't anyway to know that would have been a bad idea at the time. Most escalation processes I've seen start with the person talking to the employee directly, and escalating as required. Had the driver given a simple, "I don't recall passing you but if I did then I'm sorry" then it would have been the end of it. However this driver chose to needlessly escalate the issue.

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Had the driver given a simple, "I don't recall passing you but if I did then I'm sorry" then it would have been the end of it.

Unfortunate that this happened. I would have to agree that windshield glare seems to be the most likely cause, and the driver couldn't say anything like that because that could be taken as an opening for a lawsuit.

My watch is almost perfectly in sync with the clocks at the Charles St. terminal and various other GRT facilities. I never run early and somehow have had numerous people tell me that I am. Since I'm the one driving the bus on the schedule that is based on the time GRT provides me with, it is the passenger's responsibility to ensure their watch is in sync with mine, not the other way around. So yea... don't ever come on my bus and tell me that I'm running early unless you're dead certain you have the same time as me.

That being said, I'm also fully aware that some drivers do run early, which is unfortunate, although there's nothing I can do about it. It does get rather tiresome hearing that you're late or early all the time when people's watches are off.

In Halifax, all the buses have GPS, and an LCD monitor on the dashboard with a display telling the drivers if they're on time or not. So if the driver is on time, it says "0" w/ a green background, if they're late 5 minutes, it'll say "L5" w/ a yellow background and it'll say "E2" and have a red background if they're 2 minutes early. If an irate passenger tells the driver "you're early!", the driver simply has to point at the screen and say "I'm not according to control."

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In Halifax, all the buses have GPS, and an LCD monitor on the dashboard with a display telling the drivers if they're on time or not. So if the driver is on time, it says "0" w/ a green background, if they're late 5 minutes, it'll say "L5" w/ a yellow background and it'll say "E2" and have a red background if they're 2 minutes early. If an irate passenger tells the driver "you're early!", the driver simply has to point at the screen and say "I'm not according to control."

Although an ancient idea, it is a fantastic one. I hope GRT can adopt something similar for better schedule adherance.

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He probably thought you were some whacko for going into the path of the bus. People that run across roads against red lights and hop out into the path of buses will always get left behind for safety reasons. Stopping to pick up people who perform moronic actions only condones the behaviour. I would have left you behind as well and would have had security there to get rid of you long before you went searching for them. Also I dont know why security is taking customer complaints. They should be out doing their job. Are they the after hours customer service reps now? No wonder the terminal is a breeding ground for gangs!

Rapidtransit, you seem to be making some faulty assumptions. You seem to assume that I stepped out in front of the bus well in advance, which caused him to decide to pass me. I'm not sure how you could safely assume that from what I've said, but I'll just clarify right now.

I am over 6 feet tall and as such, sometimes I have to back up from a bus that is pulling over, so I don't get hit by the mirror. I can lean out quite far while still being on the sidewalk. In this case, far enough that at least the bus would have clipped my upper body. This part of King Street is narrow enough that leaning out over the roadway would get me hit by any large vehicle.

In addition, I was not leaning out in a way that could have even appeared mischeveous. It wasn't until the bus continued to accelerate and got so close that I knew that he wasn't planning on stopping, that I leaned out and waved at him. When it then became clear that he still wasn't stopping, I stood out of the way as not to get hit. It was not so last second that I was being reckless, but last second enough that had I continued to wave at him, he would have hit me.

I hope that clarifies things for you.

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Nice language in these posts ..... especially Mr. Cyr's. I don't think I'll even go there. Be professional, cause it "ain't showin'".

I do apologise Transit Man for any offense from the strong lanuage. I felt that the strong language was necessary to give a proper illustration, as a colloquialism would not provide a proper sense of the situation.

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Although an ancient idea, it is a fantastic one. I hope GRT can adopt something similar for better schedule adherance.

The Region had planned on installing their init system (what is currently installed on IXpress) on all routes. Not so much for just schedule adherence but as an answer to a number of issues, including calling out stops and security (which by the way is Health & Safety). If you strip away their reasons, one by one, for implementing this system (i.e having drivers call out stops) then there is not much purpose in spending the hundreds of thousands of dollars it would cost them to implement this system. You may agree with some that drivers are 'whiners' and H&S issues are ridiculous when it comes to calling out stops, but you should look at the big picture. Every action creates a reaction and one small act can 'bring the whole house down' so to speak. Obviously by your posts on this thread you seem to have some understanding of certain issues, so please think carefully before you bash someone else's posts (the GRT thread) or judge someone else's motives.

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Are you serious? I don't understand what it is with you people where you get yourselves involved in these confrontations where it is obvious you will not get a positive response. What were you expecting? Absolutely ridiculous.

Firstly, you should not have approached the driver you were sure, but not certain that it was. Secondly, who do you think you are going in there with your "I've worked in customer service..." non-sense? It's not your job to be lecturing him, so don't be surprised you received the response that you did.

I'm quite sure you've never driven a bus so let me explain a little something about driving at night. When the inside of your bus is illumintaed (which is GRT policy at night), there is often glare which can make it difficult to see depending on the conditions outside. I know that some drivers are idiots, however I'm almost certain that there are none who genuinely have no concern for the public. Do you think any of them actually want to live with the thought permanently embedded in their minds that they killed someone? Absolutely not. Because of this, it leads me to belive that he simply didn't see you due to the glare.

Another thing I've learned is that many things depend on perception. To you he simply wasn't paying attention and then nearly hit you. To the driver, he didn't see you due to glare and then had some idiot run out in front of his bus, likely scaring the hell out of him. Would you stop for someone like that? Likely not even though your intention was not to scare him.

What were you expecting when you threatened to speak to the supervisor, and then demanding he call one to the bus? At this point you've left the bus but went back for yet another confrontation.

All in all, you instigated a confrontation, accomplished nothing and made yourself look like a fool. Well done.

My watch is almost perfectly in sync with the clocks at the Charles St. terminal and various other GRT facilities. I never run early and somehow have had numerous people tell me that I am. Since I'm the one driving the bus on the schedule that is based on the time GRT provides me with, it is the passenger's responsibility to ensure their watch is in sync with mine, not the other way around. So yea... don't ever come on my bus and tell me that I'm running early unless you're dead certain you have the same time as me.

That being said, I'm also fully aware that some drivers do run early, which is unfortunate, although there's nothing I can do about it. It does get rather tiresome hearing that you're late or early all the time when people's watches are off.

PrevostH3-45, you as well seem to be making faulty assumptions and exaggerations off of what I said.

What was I expecting? Basic decency.

You say I should not have approached the driver because I was sure, but not certain that it was him. Given the facts of the situation, I assume you really mean that no one should ever approach a driver, as there is not much more certainty that could be had with that situtation. The facial features, bus year, and route were the same. Unless the bus was over 30 minutes early, it was him.

Who do I think I am going in there with my "I've worked in customer service..." non-sense? Please read what was said before responding. It wasn't until he continued with his rudeness that I said that. I didn't "go in there" with that attitude, so don't exaggerate what was said. However, I am a human being with basic decency, who has at minimum the experience to know the difference between horrible customer service and everything else. Also, it is not your job to post here, so don't use the "it's not your job" line. That's just hypocritical and ad hominem. ;) I am at the most basic level a human being and I have every right to say if I think someone is acting rudely.

While I'm sure no one would want to live with the thought of hitting someone with a bus, we all do things sometimes without thinking about the consequences. While I understand that glare may be an issue at night, I was practically as visible as I could be. I was at an illuminated shelter, below a street light, on a clear night. Yes it's possible that glare might have caused him to not see me, but given the circumstances, that was highly unlikely. I don't have to be a bus driver to understand reflection and luminosity. For the sake of the argument, let's say it was glare. That still doesn't excuse his actions.

As for running out in front of the bus, yes that would be idiotic, had I actually done that. Please read what I posted before responding next time.

What was I expecting when I went back to the bus after the driver made a snide remark? I was expecting to get to speak with a supervisor. From the sound of what you've said, "I'm quite sure you've never (worked in other customer service industries) so let me explain a little something". Regardless of whether the driver thought he was right or wrong, the fact that just as I, according to you, should have realized the possible circumstances of the situation, the driver should have realized that I might have been completely right about what happened, and not been rude and dismissive right at the beginning, before the conversation became hostile.

Had it not been a bus which other people were depending on, I would have waited in that door for a supervisor. Because believe it or not PrevostH3-45, that type of behaviour is generally considered unacceptable in an industry without powerful union protections. Try something like that at any other job, and you'd get written up on the spot.

So all in all, I approached a driver with a complaint, and got a rude and dismissive response right at the beginning, which he degraded into more and more rude responses. Perhaps you'd support a new tagline for GRT... "Grand River Transit: Don't approach our drivers unless you want to be treated rudely."

Unfortunate that this happened. I would have to agree that windshield glare seems to be the most likely cause, and the driver couldn't say anything like that because that could be taken as an opening for a lawsuit.

That's a very interesting point that you made. I'm curious what other people think. Would the driver apologizing be opening up a lawsuit?

I personally doubt anyone would sue over that. So I think the risk of alienating customers is higher than being sued.

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While I'm sure no one would want to live with the thought of hitting someone with a bus, we all do things sometimes without thinking about the consequences. While I understand that glare may be an issue at night, I was practically as visible as I could be. I was at an illuminated shelter, below a street light, on a clear night. Yes it's possible that glare might have caused him to not see me, but given the circumstances, that was highly unlikely. I don't have to be a bus driver to understand reflection and luminosity. For the sake of the argument, let's say it was glare. That still doesn't excuse his actions.

As for running out in front of the bus, yes that would be idiotic, had I actually done that. Please read what I posted before responding next time.

Just an observation: You seem to be putting alot of the responsibility onto the driver. Why would you even consider leaning into the roadway in front of a bus that looked like it wasn't about to stop? If you are a regular night rider, carry a flashlight and when the bus is a reasonable distance away, flicker it on or off a couple of times. But please don't flicker it in the drivers eyes.

What was I expecting when I went back to the bus after the driver made a snide remark? I was expecting to get to speak with a supervisor. From the sound of what you've said, "I'm quite sure you've never (worked in other customer service industries) so let me explain a little something". Regardless of whether the driver thought he was right or wrong, the fact that just as I, according to you, should have realized the possible circumstances of the situation, the driver should have realized that I might have been completely right about what happened, and not been rude and dismissive right at the beginning, before the conversation became hostile.

Had it not been a bus which other people were depending on, I would have waited in that door for a supervisor. Because believe it or not PrevostH3-45, that type of behaviour is generally considered unacceptable in an industry without powerful union protections. Try something like that at any other job, and you'd get written up on the spot.

Why would you approach anybody in a time crunch situation? In front of other people? While someone is the middle of conducting the course of their duties?

So all in all, I approached a driver with a complaint, and got a rude and dismissive response right at the beginning, which he degraded into more and more rude responses. Perhaps you'd support a new tagline for GRT... "Grand River Transit: Don't approach our drivers unless you want to be treated rudely."

Drivers are not there to field customer complaints. That's why they have customer service at the terminal.

PrevostH3-45, you as well seem to be making faulty assumptions and exaggerations off of what I said.

That's a very interesting point that you made. I'm curious what other people think. Would the driver apologizing be opening up a lawsuit?

I personally doubt anyone would sue over that. So I think the risk of alienating customers is higher than being sued.

You'd be surprised at what people would sue over. Someone tried to sue the Region because it was raining and a bus drove by them causing a puddle by the side of the road to splash their cell phone and render it useless. ;)

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Just an observation: You seem to be putting alot of the responsibility onto the driver. Why would you even consider leaning into the roadway in front of a bus that looked like it wasn't about to stop? If you are a regular night rider, carry a flashlight and when the bus is a reasonable distance away, flicker it on or off a couple of times. But please don't flicker it in the drivers eyes.

Why would you approach anybody in a time crunch situation? In front of other people? While someone is the middle of conducting the course of their duties?

Drivers are not there to field customer complaints. That's why they have customer service at the terminal.

You'd be surprised at what people would sue over. Someone tried to sue the Region because it was raining and a bus drove by them causing a puddle by the side of the road to splash their cell phone and render it useless. ;)

Thanks hybrid1 for your thoughts. Just to clarify, I made sure I was not putting myself in harms way by not leaning out in a way that I could fall over, and leaving enough time to safely get out of the way. The main issue, is that he would have hit a pedistrian when he had enough time to stop, had I not gotten out of his way.

As for approaching the drivers, some people here seem to be supporting a system where drivers are insulated from their actions. I do not think that is appropriate. While people should follow up with management, people should not have to avoid the person who caused the problem, because they might be treated rudely.

If someone can not keep a cool head long enough to even say, "if you have a complaint you'd have to speak to customer service because drivers are not able to speak to you about it", then they don't belong behind the wheel of a bus.

Driver's are front line employees, and even if they can't address complaints, they should still know how to tell the customer how to make one in the manner GRT wants us to, in a respectful way.

Seems like someone needs some "sensitivity training" ................ (only a GRT driver would get that).

I'm suprised how long this post is getting, and the continued "comebacks". Enough already, OK. Put the issue to bed!

Wow, telling people to drop an issue while saying that... sort of like telling people to put the fire out with gasoline.

Also, I don't see anyone forcing you to read this thread. I actually appriciate the replies from people who are reading what was said and giving thoughful responses.

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PrevostH3-45, you as well seem to be making faulty assumptions and exaggerations off of what I said.

What was I expecting? Basic decency.

Faulty assumptions? Where?

You say I should not have approached the driver because I was sure, but not certain that it was him. Given the facts of the situation, I assume you really mean that no one should ever approach a driver, as there is not much more certainty that could be had with that situtation. The facial features, bus year, and route were the same. Unless the bus was over 30 minutes early, it was him.

No, you absolutely shouldn't have. Perhaps the bus was traded off as it got to the terminal with a bus of similar year. Maybe the drivers changed as one was coming on/ off lunch break. I'm not sure if there are any crews with lunch breaks that late, but it is possible.

Who do I think I am going in there with my "I've worked in customer service..." non-sense? Please read what was said before responding. It wasn't until he continued with his rudeness that I said that. I didn't "go in there" with that attitude, so don't exaggerate what was said. However, I am a human being with basic decency, who has at minimum the experience to know the difference between horrible customer service and everything else. Also, it is not your job to post here, so don't use the "it's not your job" line. That's just hypocritical and ad hominem. ;) I am at the most basic level a human being and I have every right to say if I think someone is acting rudely.

You were asking for what you got by confronting him. Did you really think he was really going to say, "oh I'm sorry I almost hit you"? Absolutely not.

The difference is this is a public website where everyone is entitled to my opinion. You posted your comments and I'm replying to them, my job or not. You cannot say with certainty that this was in fact the driver. Do you have any idea how many GRT drivers wear glasses? 167.

While I'm sure no one would want to live with the thought of hitting someone with a bus, we all do things sometimes without thinking about the consequences. While I understand that glare may be an issue at night, I was practically as visible as I could be. I was at an illuminated shelter, below a street light, on a clear night. Yes it's possible that glare might have caused him to not see me, but given the circumstances, that was highly unlikely. I don't have to be a bus driver to understand reflection and luminosity. For the sake of the argument, let's say it was glare. That still doesn't excuse his actions.

Unless you were the driver of that bus, you have no business commenting on what he saw or what he didn't see. I am simply telling you, illuminated shelter or not, glare can cause people to get missed. Excuse what actions?

Was he rude? Yes. I'm not disputing that. I'm saying that you should have known better when you confronted him.

As for running out in front of the bus, yes that would be idiotic, had I actually done that. Please read what I posted before responding next time.

What was I expecting when I went back to the bus after the driver made a snide remark? I was expecting to get to speak with a supervisor. From the sound of what you've said, "I'm quite sure you've never (worked in other customer service industries) so let me explain a little something". Regardless of whether the driver thought he was right or wrong, the fact that just as I, according to you, should have realized the possible circumstances of the situation, the driver should have realized that I might have been completely right about what happened, and not been rude and dismissive right at the beginning, before the conversation became hostile.

Had it not been a bus which other people were depending on, I would have waited in that door for a supervisor. Because believe it or not PrevostH3-45, that type of behaviour is generally considered unacceptable in an industry without powerful union protections. Try something like that at any other job, and you'd get written up on the spot.

Don't tell me to read your non-sense again when it is you who should be doing the re-reading. If you had bothered to read what I wrote you would have seen that I mentioned perception. To him he may have seen your "leaning out" as someone running out or about to run out.

So all in all, I approached a driver with a complaint, and got a rude and dismissive response right at the beginning, which he degraded into more and more rude responses. Perhaps you'd support a new tagline for GRT... "Grand River Transit: Don't approach our drivers unless you want to be treated rudely."

That's a very interesting point that you made. I'm curious what other people think. Would the driver apologizing be opening up a lawsuit?

I personally doubt anyone would sue over that. So I think the risk of alienating customers is higher than being sued.

You accused him of almost running you over and I imagine your tone was less than pleasant.

Let me remind you: Me: <<"Excuse me, I'd like to know why you drove past my stop and nearly hit me?!?">>

Why the need for the exclamation?

He told you he didn't know what to tell you. I can't understand why you didn't just leave it at that? You were asking for more by going into the customer service idiocy. Also don't bother suggesting that I condone poor customer service because I don't. I'll have you know that I have numerous customer commendations on file for exemplary customer service.

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He probably thought you were some whacko for going into the path of the bus. People that run across roads against red lights and hop out into the path of buses will always get left behind for safety reasons. Stopping to pick up people who perform moronic actions only condones the behaviour. I would have left you behind as well and would have had security there to get rid of you long before you went searching for them. Also I dont know why security is taking customer complaints. They should be out doing their job. Are they the after hours customer service reps now? No wonder the terminal is a breeding ground for gangs!

Firstly, security at all GRT hubs sucks. TODAY at Highland Hills mall, there was a security guard there on his phone walking around texting while all the kids/teens were running around in front of the parked buses. You say security should do their jobs! I've only ONCE ever seen a security person so something in a situation that required them (see below)

Secondly, this issue is getting out of hand. We're all turning against eachother over a few drivers who don't know their ass from their mouth. Ive only ever seen a few who dont give a shit. Most are all good and even say "Have a good day/night" when you get off.

Only once has a driver made me so mad that i told HER to fuck off. I was on the 7 and the driver picked up a women using a walker. At the Charles Terminal, the driver was turning in and the women was getting up to get to the front so she could get off cause there is always a line up of people wanting to get on the 7. The driver stopped the bus as she was going towards the 7 bay and told her to sit back down. The woman was already up and she had to go back to her seat. Then as the driver was going under the platform , the women got up again using her walker. The driver stoped the bus UNDER THE PLATFORM blocking any other buses like the other 7's and the iXpress and told the woman to sit down. The woman just told her she was fine and asked her to just pull up to the bay to let her off. The driver wouldn't pull up the like 15 meters and made the woman go sit down. The women wouldn't sit back down cause she was already up and it was like 15M. The driver decided she was going to call security on the woman becasue she wanted to get off the bus. The woman was trying to get off but the driver wouldnt let her off until security came. The driver wouldnt unlock the back doors to let everyone else out. So people started to get mad at the driver but she still wouldnt open the doors to let others off. People had to go out the front doors past the driver and the woman who were still arguing. Security showed up the driver told them she was being "Unruly towards her" which she was cause the woman was pissed off at the driver. On the way out eveyone told the driver where to go and all sorts of fun names. I told her to fuck off which i really dont regreat. SHE PARKED THE BUS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD IN THE TERMINAL and called security on some elderly woman who needed a walker. Thats just sad. (Secuirty did let her off).

This was the ONLY experience that i've ever had like this. The funny thing is, the woman driver shops at my work and I remember her everytime she comes in and I glare at her.

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Just an observation: You seem to be putting alot of the responsibility onto the driver. Why would you even consider leaning into the roadway in front of a bus that looked like it wasn't about to stop? If you are a regular night rider, carry a flashlight and when the bus is a reasonable distance away, flicker it on or off a couple of times. But please don't flicker it in the drivers eyes.

I've had quite a few passengers at night use their cell phone waving in the air to signal me they are there, it seems to work pretty good although I have good eyesight so I can see them already anyways.

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Only once has a driver made me so mad that i told HER to fuck off. I was on the 7 and the driver picked up a women using a walker. At the Charles Terminal, the driver was turning in and the women was getting up to get to the front so she could get off cause there is always a line up of people wanting to get on the 7. The driver stopped the bus as she was going towards the 7 bay and told her to sit back down. The woman was already up and she had to go back to her seat. Then as the driver was going under the platform , the women got up again using her walker. The driver stoped the bus UNDER THE PLATFORM blocking any other buses like the other 7's and the iXpress and told the woman to sit down. The woman just told her she was fine and asked her to just pull up to the bay to let her off. The driver wouldn't pull up the like 15 meters and made the woman go sit down. The women wouldn't sit back down cause she was already up and it was like 15M. The driver decided she was going to call security on the woman becasue she wanted to get off the bus. The woman was trying to get off but the driver wouldnt let her off until security came. The driver wouldnt unlock the back doors to let everyone else out. So people started to get mad at the driver but she still wouldnt open the doors to let others off. People had to go out the front doors past the driver and the woman who were still arguing. Security showed up the driver told them she was being "Unruly towards her" which she was cause the woman was pissed off at the driver. On the way out eveyone told the driver where to go and all sorts of fun names. I told her to fuck off which i really dont regreat. SHE PARKED THE BUS IN THE MIDDLE OF THE ROAD IN THE TERMINAL and called security on some elderly woman who needed a walker. Thats just sad. (Secuirty did let her off).

Yeah okay, and you accomplished what by shouting that? Trying to act like a big man? Give me a break.

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ALWAYS complain if they are early, There is a million and a half excuses for being late, but there is NO excuse for being early.

This is why:

My watch is almost perfectly in sync with the clocks at the Charles St. terminal and various other GRT facilities. I never run early and somehow have had numerous people tell me that I am. Since I'm the one driving the bus on the schedule that is based on the time GRT provides me with, it is the passenger's responsibility to ensure their watch is in sync with mine, not the other way around. So yea... don't ever come on my bus and tell me that I'm running early unless you're dead certain you have the same time as me.

That being said, I'm also fully aware that some drivers do run early, which is unfortunate, although there's nothing I can do about it. It does get rather tiresome hearing that you're late or early all the time when people's watches are off.

I operate on the National Atomic Clock (albeit with a -15 to 15 second offset at times) and I expect public services, especially those operating on a public timetable, to be operating on this clock as well. In addition to that, the city's GIS/AVS system uses the National Atomic Clock. Buses themselves have clocks on them so that all buses are running the same time, so watches aren't even needed. (Nor should they be.)

Buses running earlier than the times posted (or the times posted just being wrong in some cases) is one of the biggest complains in this city regarding transit. I have been on buses that have left terminals before all buses have gotten to those terminals, and in many of those cases, the bus has actually been stopped by control so that people can make their connections. This should never happen, and yet it does. Almost daily. I have had buses go by my apartment almost ten minutes before schedule before, and there is no reason this should ever happen.

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