Jump to content

Eglinton Crosstown line


Recommended Posts

  • 3 weeks later...
3 hours ago, Tom1122 said:

How many cars have been delivered to date? I know 6225 is on property.

They responded on Twitter saying 20 have been delivered to the Eglinton maintenance facility. Though I don't think this would be correct since the first unit is 6200 and units from 6222 and forward being delivered by rail into the site. I would say at least 25 to 30 by now. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, GTAmissions1 said:

They responded on Twitter saying 20 have been delivered to the Eglinton maintenance facility. Though I don't think this would be correct since the first unit is 6200 and units from 6222 and forward being delivered by rail into the site. I would say at least 25 to 30 by now. 

 

How do you know they delivered every unit sequentially? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

How do you know they delivered every unit sequentially? 

Maybe he assumed the Flexity Outlooks were delivered sequentially (except the Kingston units) so naturally these Freedoms should be done the same.

And aren't ION and ETS's delivered in sequential order iirc?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

46 minutes ago, Orion V said:

Maybe he assumed the Flexity Outlooks were delivered sequentially (except the Kingston units) so naturally these Freedoms should be done the same.

And aren't ION and ETS's delivered in sequential order iirc?

Edmonton's cars have not been delivered in order. After the pilot vehicle (1001) was delivered, the first "production" unit delivered was 1004, followed by 1007, then 1005. Part of this IIRC was due to completed units being backed up in Kingston while Edmonton was unable to receive the vehicles on property.

I would take the tweet from Metrolinx with a grain of salt. The PR communications people who run the Twitter account normally aren't hardcore transitfans like us, and can take some liberties with the information, such as rounding the number of cars delivered. They are a couple of people removed from those actually receiving and accounting for the cars, so they might just get a simple answer of "around/at least 20" from the first person they ask and send that reply out to the public, rather than waiting for another day or few to get in touch with someone who would message someone else who would have the exact count. There's also other technicalities regarding the status, such as which cars are delivered and on property, but not accepted by Metrolinx yet, which make it difficult to say what the exact number is.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The Flexity cars are built in order, but as Articulated correctly pointed out Edmonton's are being delivered out of order as they didn't have a location to deliver them to until more recently. As of early this year, Bombardier had about 15 of their cars sitting at Millhaven waiting to be shipped.

 

As for the Metrolinx cars, they've got over 30 of the cars on the property. 45 have been completed - I think that it was 6245 that was spotted being shipped to Thunder Bay for equipment installation 2 weeks ago, and 2 more cars are on their way up there now.

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
2 hours ago, Cityflyer said:

Hard to take an article seriously that says "As it turns out, the coupled Bombardier Flexity Freedom LRVs look a lot like the conjoined GO Trains that run together across the GTA — but with only two cars in the convoy."

Pretty clear that whoever wrote this has never been to Toronto ... or perhaps even Canada.

  • Haha 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Gil said:

BlogTO also ran this story last week: https://www.blogto.com/city/2020/11/toronto-new-science-centre-subway-station/

Aside from the fact that they're referring to the underground Eglinton LRT station as a subway station (lest someone think construction on the Ontario Line was well underway), it's an interesting sneak peek into the project.

It is a subway station. TTC already currently considers Line 4 Scarborough stations to be subway stations ... and the underground Line 5 Eglinton stations are a lot more like Line 1/2/3 stations.  Once they get to 3-car trains on Line 5, the length (and platform) is almost the same as the 4-car Line 4 trains/platforms.

Are the elevated trains in the Bronx not called subways?

Are the surface and cut-and-cover sections of the London Underground not called Tubes?

TTC has been clear that this will be part of the Subway network for branding. For example see the final page of http://ttc.ca/About_the_TTC/Commission_reports_and_information/Commission_meetings/2015/November_23/Reports/Eglinton_Line_Station_Names__Combined_Report.pdf

image.thumb.png.fd5474e2deefae9777fb5a7e66060224.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, nfitz said:

It is a subway station. TTC already currently considers Line 4 Scarborough stations to be subway stations ... and the underground Line 5 Eglinton stations are a lot more like Line 1/2/3 stations.  Once they get to 3-car trains on Line 5, the length (and platform) is almost the same as the 4-car Line 4 trains/platforms.

Are the elevated trains in the Bronx not called subways?

Are the surface and cut-and-cover sections of the London Underground not called Tubes?

TTC has been clear that this will be part of the Subway network for branding. For example see the final page of http://ttc.ca/About_the_TTC/Commission_reports_and_information/Commission_meetings/2015/November_23/Reports/Eglinton_Line_Station_Names__Combined_Report.pdf

image.thumb.png.fd5474e2deefae9777fb5a7e66060224.png

The terminology of "subway", at least in the Toronto context, is particular to the technology used. In this way, lines 1, 2, and 4 are all true subways, as they use heavy rail technology powered by a third rail that needs to be fully grade separated. Line 3 (formerly the Scarborough RT) is not a subway in this context, as it uses smaller and lighter vehicles with LIM propulsion systems. All four lines, however, can be considered the more generic terms of "rapid transit" or "higher-order transit", which the Eglinton Crosstown/Line 5 would also be considered as. In fact, in that document you link, the very first leg of the "decision tree" states "Is it higher-order (rapid) transit?", going on to list multiple examples of higher-order transit, including Subway and LRT.

As for that map, it's a mockup from 5 years ago that some junior-level staffer created in Photoshop to mock up the proposed station names. It has a number of technical errors in it, not the least of which is the complete covering of all the Line 2 station bubbles east of Dufferin.

  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Will Line 5 and 6 have transit priority signals for the trains that will actually be ON giving the trains advantage at intersections during operation? Or will they be implemented in the OFF state like on 509/510/512 because the city didn't want to give streetcars in these routes priority over cars.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Articulated said:

... As for that map, it's a mockup from 5 years ago that some junior-level staffer created in Photoshop to mock up the proposed station names.

That's a lot of words, that ignore that TTC is branding Line 4 as subway - to this day. For example the current (October 2020) Subway and Streetcar map. http://www.ttc.ca/PDF/Maps/TTC_SubwayStreetcarMap.pdf Not to mention the Ride Guide 

Line 4 is shown as Subway. And Line 5 looks much more like a subway at most stations.

You might not like the way it's branded. But that's how it is, and that's what the public are going to call it - when they aren't calling it a streetcar, having virtually the same vehicles.
image.thumb.png.64ebb1b00d39817fe7df72b24c0980e7.png

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Orion V said:

Will Line 5 and 6 have transit priority signals for the trains that will actually be ON giving the trains advantage at intersections during operation? Or will they be implemented in the OFF state like on 509/510/512 because the city didn't want to give streetcars in these routes priority over cars.

Older Metrolinx Crosstown documents mention that it will have signal priority. However, I believe the city came out a few months ago and said that signal priority for the Line 5 would be limited (similar to the streetcar ROWs). Ultimately, it is up to the city since they run the traffic signals. I assume whatever is done on Line 5 will be the same for Line 6.

1 hour ago, nfitz said:

That's a lot of words, that ignore that TTC is branding Line 4 as subway - to this day. For example the current (October 2020) Subway and Streetcar map. http://www.ttc.ca/PDF/Maps/TTC_SubwayStreetcarMap.pdf Not to mention the Ride Guide 

Line 4 is shown as Subway. And Line 5 looks much more like a subway at most stations.

You might not like the way it's branded. But that's how it is, and that's what the public are going to call it - when they aren't calling it a streetcar, having virtually the same vehicles.
image.thumb.png.64ebb1b00d39817fe7df72b24c0980e7.png

Line 4 is a subway... the Sheppard Line. Line 3 is the Scarborough RT, or the "Scarborough Line" as it's called now. Personally, I think they just use the term subway for simplicity. It's easier to understand than calling them Rapid Transit lines.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, wil9402 said:

Personally, I think they just use the term subway for simplicity. It's easier to understand than calling them Rapid Transit lines.

Bingo. Meanwhile there's more Underground that's overground than underground. And parts of the Overground are underground.

And though Line 3 might be a subway ... I keep telling my kids it's a Skytrain. :)

  • Haha 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, Articulated said:

The terminology of "subway", at least in the Toronto context, is particular to the technology used.

In the Toronto context, a subway - historically - was a passageway located underneath another, crossing, passageway. Queen St. W. underneath the railway tracks near Dufferin is referred to as a subway. The Glen Rd. pedestrian tunnel under Bloor St. E. is a subway.

 

So to state categorically that the term is particular to the technology? I completely disagree.

 

Especially since prior to the opening of the line the technology used on the Eglinton line will not have been used in Toronto at all, so there is no historic precedence.

 

For the record, the Eglinton line will be a "subway" - and at the same time it won't be, either. When it is underground it is as much of a subway as either of the three existing heavy-rail systems used in Toronto, featuring floor-level loading, full grade separation, a full signaling system, emergency exits and other ancillary devices for keeping the public safe. Trains will stop at each station regardless of whether people are waiting for that station or not. It is as much of a subway as the SRT, if not more of one.

 

On the surface however, it will behave more like an LRT the likes of which we have on St. Clair, Spadina and the Harbourfront. Partial traffic separation, the use of traffic signals rather than its own discrete signal system, and stop-on-demand are all things that we've seen on the other lines already operating in Toronto. Yes, the vehicles will be different - but their operation here will not be.

 

Dan

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/11/2020 at 9:29 AM, smallspy said:

In the Toronto context, a subway - historically - was a passageway located underneath another, crossing, passageway. Queen St. W. underneath the railway tracks near Dufferin is referred to as a subway. The Glen Rd. pedestrian tunnel under Bloor St. E. is a subway.

My grandmother grew up near Weston Road and the Humber River, and refers to the railway bridge there as a "subway". Having grown up in Northern Ontario, it takes me a moment to figure out what she means when she mentions it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Orion V said:

Look at this video. At 14:25min.

They're installing the service stops with the Line 5 logo in pink instead of orange.

It's orange in person. Notice the lack of saturation on the red of the LFS in the background and the fact that it's a cloudy day.

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Please sign in to comment

You will be able to leave a comment after signing in



Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...