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2101 on the 50 Queensway route today spotted via Transsee. One of the longest routes in the network.

Noting that from the highest reported unit being in the process of delivery is 2104. As mentioned in the last few posts in the thread that they have been rotated along different local routes. One of the other longest routes being the 96 Keele-Yonge. The electric bus fleet expanding and determining how to adapt to those routes with the amount of mileage it can provide on a single charge. 

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4 hours ago, menath said:

2105 has been spotted at New Flyer's Crookston plant

Credit: Atlas Flyer 

 

244222985_1014317366030916_1812957679305857857_n.png

He didn’t take the photo, he was able to get it from a different Facebook group which those were posted on.

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Is there something about the configuration of the YRT fleet that makes the ride so jerky?

Its not the operator because almost every bus is like that and I can't blame it on new flyer because I rode on Nova equipment and found the same. 

I would take a guess and say that Allison does a better job of providing a smoother ride.  

But is that the answer? Does anyone else feel the same way?

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2 hours ago, Shaun said:

Is there something about the configuration of the YRT fleet that makes the ride so jerky?

Its not the operator because almost every bus is like that and I can't blame it on new flyer because I rode on Nova equipment and found the same. 

I would take a guess and say that Allison does a better job of providing a smoother ride.  

But is that the answer? Does anyone else feel the same way?

Depends where the jerky ride is coming from, YRT uses Voith and for the most part it’s a smooth transmission until it gets “tired” and will sometimes slam between gears ( nowhere as bad as ZF ), other factors could be a rougher suspension or in the case of their new flyers the operator can open them while moving however the interlock will catch almost at a stop and slam the bus, Novas don’t open until stopped. 
 

the jerky ride Can also be caused by the brake hold feature grabbing the bus when stopping which happens on the Xcelsiors 

Just now, ZümmyZüm said:

Depends where the jerky ride is coming from, YRT uses Voith and for the most part it’s a smooth transmission until it gets “tired” and will sometimes slam between gears ( nowhere as bad as ZF ), other factors could be a rougher suspension or in the case of their new flyers the operator can open the door while  moving however the interlock will catch almost at a stop and slam the bus, Novas don’t open until stopped. 
 

the jerky ride Can also be caused by the brake hold feature grabbing the bus when stopping which happens on the Xcelsiors 

 

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13 hours ago, Shaun said:

Is there something about the configuration of the YRT fleet that makes the ride so jerky?

Its not the operator because almost every bus is like that and I can't blame it on new flyer because I rode on Nova equipment and found the same. 

I would take a guess and say that Allison does a better job of providing a smoother ride.  

But is that the answer? Does anyone else feel the same way?

 

11 hours ago, ZümmyZüm said:

Depends where the jerky ride is coming from, YRT uses Voith and for the most part it’s a smooth transmission until it gets “tired” and will sometimes slam between gears ( nowhere as bad as ZF ), other factors could be a rougher suspension or in the case of their new flyers the operator can open them while moving however the interlock will catch almost at a stop and slam the bus, Novas don’t open until stopped. 
 

the jerky ride Can also be caused by the brake hold feature grabbing the bus when stopping which happens on the Xcelsiors 

 

Iiiiiif I remember properly, York has the retarder activating as soon as the operator's foot is off the accelerator. Could that be a contributing factor?

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That could be it. It feels like go stop go stop.

It would be better to program it so that the first 1/8 of the brake pedal being depressed would trigger the retarder, before the service brake is activated. 

I don't find it as bad with the VIVA fleet but that's probably due to the fact that it stops less. 

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1 hour ago, Waiting for 30 Minutes said:

 

 

Iiiiiif I remember properly, York has the retarder activating as soon as the operator's foot is off the accelerator. Could that be a contributing factor?

Ah that’s true their retarder is set off the accelerator

 

1 hour ago, Shaun said:

That could be it. It feels like go stop go stop.

It would be better to program it so that the first 1/8 of the brake pedal being depressed would trigger the retarder, before the service brake is activated. 

I don't find it as bad with the VIVA fleet but that's probably due to the fact that it stops less. 

Off the brake can also be rough, the agency needs to set and maintain the retarder so it doesn’t have an aggressive kickdown. VIVA probably gets more care and attention for the brand plus on a 60ft you don’t feel it as much 

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I find the Xcelsior brakes are not as smooth as the other buses. It's hard to explain, you really have to drive the buses to understand what I mean. Its like how the hell did they go from the smooth brakes of the D40LFs to the XD40?

For the Novabuses and the older New Flyers, the brakes respond as you want them to. As you step on the brake and gradually push harder, the brakes respond accordingly to how hard you are pressing just like a car would. Because the brakes actually depress as you step on them, it allows for the bus to come to a gradual and smooth stop.

For the Xcelsiors, I find their brakes feel more like stiff planks that don't really depress much. Because of this, there's either light braking or harsh braking and no in-between because the brake pedal doesn't really depress as much as the other buses owing to its stiffness.

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York Region has opened the bids and tender process for the Operations and Maintenance contract of their upcoming South-East division at Orlando yard, where the VIVA BRT division and the current Southeast division will be merged into one.

 

https://york.bidsandtenders.ca/Module/Tenders/en/Tender/Detail/b9421957-1eeb-4680-bbf0-91b648a13a43

 

It will be very interesting to see who is awarded this contract, especially since Miller will no longer have the leverage of owning the yard and maintenance shop, like it currently does at 8050 Woodbine Avenue,  which previously resulted in contract awards and extensions for 20 years based on property ownership alone. 

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2 hours ago, TransitMotorcoach said:

York Region has opened the bids and tender process for the Operations and Maintenance contract of their upcoming South-East division at Orlando yard, where the VIVA BRT division and the current Southeast division will be merged into one.

 

https://york.bidsandtenders.ca/Module/Tenders/en/Tender/Detail/b9421957-1eeb-4680-bbf0-91b648a13a43

 

It will be very interesting to see who is awarded this contract, especially since Miller will no longer have the leverage of owning the yard and maintenance shop, like it currently does at 8050 Woodbine Avenue,  which previously resulted in contract awards and extensions for 20 years based on property ownership alone. 

Reading the documents and how the current capacity is 296 40 ft regular buses which there is plans to provision 55 Orlando Avenue to accommodate 420 40 ft regular buses to take in the buses from Southeast while handling the rapid transit functions of Viva fleet. 

Off-hand I know that already handle 90/90B Leslie buses at the BRT Division on Orlando Avenue since Southeast yard doesn't have the capacity to handle articulated buses.

Having a region owned garage definitely brought in more bidders to bid on the operations contract. As you mentioned, the contractor owned yard gives more leverage into renewal if the region can't find a suitable place to store their buses once done operations for the day. Dealing with storing buses on the available site.

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On 10/14/2021 at 9:23 PM, York Transit said:

I find the Xcelsior brakes are not as smooth as the other buses. It's hard to explain, you really have to drive the buses to understand what I mean. Its like how the hell did they go from the smooth brakes of the D40LFs to the XD40?

For the Novabuses and the older New Flyers, the brakes respond as you want them to. As you step on the brake and gradually push harder, the brakes respond accordingly to how hard you are pressing just like a car would. Because the brakes actually depress as you step on them, it allows for the bus to come to a gradual and smooth stop.

For the Xcelsiors, I find their brakes feel more like stiff planks that don't really depress much. Because of this, there's either light braking or harsh braking and no in-between because the brake pedal doesn't really depress as much as the other buses owing to its stiffness.

New Flyer uses a brake systems company called “AIRWOLF” which are similar to the feeling of a car. Stiff and very reactive with just the tap of the foot.

They started a partnership with this company in late 2012 I believe.

That’s probably the reason you notice the difference. The early year Xcelsior buses feel a lot different and more normal braking.

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Is it just me or is 99/98 faster than Viva BRT? All of the schedules point me to take the local bus over BRT. 

Wll VIVA ever be extended to Green Lane? Looks like there is more and more development pushing north. 

Why are there no routes going north from Green Lane towards Bradford along Yonge? The GO bus takes an indirect route.

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14 minutes ago, Shaun said:

Is it just me or is 99/98 faster than Viva BRT? All of the schedules point me to take the local bus over BRT. 

98/99 does tend to have a fairly aggressive running time, in order to minimize the number of buses required for the service. I have also tended to find that Viva schedules have more padding in the evening; this might be because of a number of factors, including a philosophy of having little change in travel time throughout the day due to the dedicated lanes, with most of the time savings due to fewer stops for passengers (and fewer red lights at cross-streets), as well as a general holdover of runtimes from early evening service (it's logistically impossible to be continuously modifying the schedule to match traffic conditions at each individual hour of the day).

14 minutes ago, Shaun said:

Wll VIVA ever be extended to Green Lane? Looks like there is more and more development pushing north. 

The long-term plans for Viva do have an extension of Viva Blue north and east to East Gwillimbury GO; the timelines for future expansion have been in flux for a number of years due to budgetary constraints, and COVID has pushed any further expansions (including Viva Silver and the realignment of Viva Green onto Don Mills/Leslie) further into the future with no fixed dates for implementation.

14 minutes ago, Shaun said:

Why are there no routes going north from Green Lane towards Bradford along Yonge? The GO bus takes an indirect route.

Route 52 Holland Landing currently serves the area north of Green Lane, although it's been reduced to rush hours only as a result of COVID-related cutbacks.

North of Green Lane, Yonge Street/Highway 11 becomes a thoroughfare with very little development along it, and is very inhospitable to pedestrians; the community area is to the north, along Yonge Street rather than Highway 11, which is why both YRT 52 and GO 68 routes divert off of Highway 11 through this part.

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21 hours ago, Shaun said:

Is it just me or is 99/98 faster than Viva BRT? All of the schedules point me to take the local bus over BRT. 

Wll VIVA ever be extended to Green Lane? Looks like there is more and more development pushing north. 

Why are there no routes going north from Green Lane towards Bradford along Yonge? The GO bus takes an indirect route.

The Region is currently doing infrastructure work on Yonge north of Davis in preparation for transit lane construction, so the expansion to EG GO is underway. 

Route 52 goes up toward the cut-off with Holland Landing and Bradford, there's not much in that area right now except for a hotel. There's development coming along the road leading into Bradford however.

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On 10/18/2021 at 9:46 PM, Shaun said:

Is it just me or is 99/98 faster than Viva BRT? All of the schedules point me to take the local bus over BRT. 

Wll VIVA ever be extended to Green Lane? Looks like there is more and more development pushing north. 

Why are there no routes going north from Green Lane towards Bradford along Yonge? The GO bus takes an indirect route.

The current run schedules for 98/99 are very tight, especially north of Bernard  and quite often, we are delayed because of it. Going northbound, waiting for the advance green at Yonge and Davis to go left, that delays us too. Not to mention only having 3 minutes of recovery time at Green Lane.

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21 hours ago, tommike said:

yrt should send all eletric buses back. they fail in how they run them.

they put them out and cant have run all day then it a fail by them not the bus.

 

There are a number of factors for YRT running these buses:

- This is a pilot program meant to "test the grounds" with electric busses and their capabilities across Canada (hence the name "Pan-Canadian Electric-Bus Demonstration and Integration Trial). 

- These buses are still "new" technology, only having been in active service around North America for less than 10 years. Transit agencies and bus manufacturers are still learning how to improve the technology (just the same as regular electric car manufacturers).

- YRT originally stuck the eBusses on routes 55 and 44 (both with easy access to the rapid charging station at Newmarket Terminal), but have been expanding their use on many YRT North routes, showing progress in their comfort with running them on routes away from a charging station (especially routes 50, 96 and Aurora routes).

- YRT appears to be focusing on keeping these buses out primarily during busy periods (morning and evening), notably since bus service in northern York Region is significantly cut compared to pre-pandemic service levels. The service has generally been consistent during weekdays (excerpt from October 22nd):

- 1911 ran from 5:16 AM to 9:15 AM and then 2:46 PM to 8:21 PM.

- 1912 ran from 6:05 AM to 8:09 AM and then 2:03 PM to 6:56 PM.

- 1921 ran one route 44 routing in the morning run, then 3:05 PM to 6:30 PM.

- 1922 ran from 6:02 AM to 9:36 AM and then 3:24 PM to 8:23 PM.

- 2101 ran from 4:39 AM to 10:47 AM and then 2;09 PM to 8:09 PM.

- 2102 ran from 6:55 AM to 12:41 PM then 4:26 PM to 8:32 PM.

- 2103 ran from 5:48 AM to 8:48 AM and then 2:05 PM to 7:49 PM.

That's 7 out of the 9 electric busses (in active service) running. As things continue to improve, suspended services resume, and YRT gets more comfortable with the scheduling and operation of these busses, I'm sure we'll see them out more. So, overall, seems like YRT is doing fine with them?

 

 

 

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