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2021-2030 SkyTrain Procurement


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41 minutes ago, Mac Write said:

Mark IV's? Has Bombardier even announced the Inovia 400?

IIRC the Innovia brand was dead even before the Alstom acquisition. Future LIM light-metro trains will be an extension of the Movia Metro platform.

41 minutes ago, Mac Write said:

I also saw in the document about retiring the Mark II trains.

In 2035, the original M-Line trains will be 33 years old. It’s possible that they’ll be replaced by higher-capacity trains in place of a major overhaul that would be needed at about that time.

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According to TransLink's PR, 125 cars of the initial order is to replace the MkI and for Broadway Extension, and 80 cars is to expand the capacity of existing lines.  Fleetwood/Langley extension will be from the options.  So when TransLink commit the option for 2025 opening of Fleetwood extension, it may be delivered the same time as the initial order, or the whole delivery schedule need to be adjusted?

So the likely outcome would be:

  • All MkI retired.  Expo Line will be fully 5-cars new train and 4-cars MkIII.  Millennium Line will be a mix of 2 and 4-cars MkII/III (about 1:2).
  • Most MkI retired, but some retained to make M-Line fully 4-cars MkII/III or 4-cars MkI.  This will need a minimum of 24 MkI cars, or perhaps more given the older trains may need higher spare ratio.

It is also possible that the options may not come quickly enough for the Fleetwood, Langley, and/or UBC extensions, so the MkI may be retained longer until the new trains for the extensions arrive.

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Higher resolution here:

Epdmn_0VQAA-CHS?format=jpg&name=orig

I think the rendering is still purely speculative, though other than some cosmetic differences this rendering is clearly based on a real life image at Main Street-Science World. It remains to be seen whether it would be a clean sheet model though. Reusing the basic design of the Mk III makes sense since it saves on development costs.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 12/17/2020 at 11:01 PM, nname said:

According to TransLink's PR, 125 cars of the initial order is to replace the MkI and for Broadway Extension, and 80 cars is to expand the capacity of existing lines.  Fleetwood/Langley extension will be from the options.  So when TransLink commit the option for 2025 opening of Fleetwood extension, it may be delivered the same time as the initial order, or the whole delivery schedule need to be adjusted?

From what I've read previously, the original plan from TransLink was to conduct the first Mark I retirements around 2026 (operations year 40) and that the refurbishment of Mark Is was meant to have the cars last about that long. I further read that the initial retirement wave would have been the 114 original Mark Is (circa 1985); the 36 1990-1995 cars could theoretically go on even further, to 2030-2035 respectively.

I don't know if they still intend on following this schedule; but at any rate, the carrying capacity of the new trains reaches parity with the original 114 Mark Is upon delivery of about 14 train sets, and with all 150 Mark Is upon delivery of 18 train sets (90 cars); meaning within the initial 125 cars, 35 cars form the surplus needed for the MLBE, which is about right (this is about 9 4-car trains; at a 3 min frequency, approximately 8 trains are needed to support MLBE operations, based on the estimated end-end travel time each way of 11 minutes).

If the 36 1990-1995 Mark Is (forming 6 6-car Mark I trains) do stay through 2030-2035, that creates some built-in surplus to support the SLS, and there will still be another 80 of the new Mark IV/III-b cars in the "service expansion" pool to draw upon.

Based on the delivery schedule, 14 trains will have been delivered by July 2025; 18 by November 2025; and 20 (100/205 cars) by the turn of 2026. I don't think the original Mark Is will necessarily be retired all at once at that time, since that will leave only around 30 surplus train cars (6 trains) for the Broadway subway and none for either SLS or service expansion; so my presumption is that the Mark I retirements will happen on a more gradual schedule, and that the combined presence of new Mark IVs (Mark III-bs?), 1986 Mark Is and 1990-1995 Mark Is will create the necessary surplus in trains to supply our extensions.

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Is there any information of the seating layout of these? I'm assuming it'll be the usual 1-2 rows like the Mark III, although I'd love side seats like the MK Is...

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16 hours ago, buizelbus said:

Is there any information of the seating layout of these? I'm assuming it'll be the usual 1-2 rows like the Mark III, although I'd love side seats like the MK Is...

The age old argument about what seating arrangement works best on Metros. I'm really curious to see what they choose.

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16 hours ago, buizelbus said:

Is there any information of the seating layout of these? I'm assuming it'll be the usual 1-2 rows like the Mark III, although I'd love side seats like the MK Is...

Given the March 2019 Engagement Report had perimeter/inwards-facing seats as second most preferred (after forward-facing), I imagine it's a real possibility.

Source: https://www.translink.ca/-/media/translink/documents/plans-and-projects/rapid-transit/2019_09_13_skytrain_fleet_engagement_summary.pdf

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