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TTC Orion VII Retirements

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5 hours ago, raptorjays said:

I think they might be getting some of the 8400-8617 from Birchmount once all of the Orion Vlls retires. It is still hand me down but still better than old crappy 81xx

You realize the 8400-8617 are even more deficient than the "crappy" 81XX you refer to right? For starters those Novas are king of air flow issues with air seeping through the doors like no mans business due to the horrid door design. Then add the bad A/C which cant circulate air properly, warm air generated by the engine which one can feel on the rear seats of those vehicles, rear windows which cant open, reduced overall capacity (seated+standing) due to shorter bus length and you get the idea. 

It would be a blessing from God if those Orions were transferred to Queensway.

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4 hours ago, lip said:

You realize the 8400-8617 are even more deficient than the "crappy" 81XX you refer to right? For starters those Novas are king of air flow issues with air seeping through the doors like no mans business due to the horrid door design. Then add the bad A/C which cant circulate air properly, warm air generated by the engine which one can feel on the rear seats of those vehicles, rear windows which cant open, reduced overall capacity (seated+standing) due to shorter bus length and you get the idea. 

It would be a blessing from God if those Orions were transferred to Queensway.

(I can’t believe I’m defending this bus...) Please get your facts right before jumping to conclusions. The LFS only comes in the 40’ model. The interior seating layout is poor for standing capacity. If the TTC went back to a perimeter seating layout, you could accommodate more standing room in the rear of the bus (as is the case with Barmpton Transit and Miway) 

Seats in the rear of the LFS fleet:

9000-9002/9004-9152: 15

8400-8504 & 8510-8572/8574-8617: 17

8620-8716: I want to say 17, but different layout from the previous 2 batches

8720-8964 & 9200-9239: 17

3100-3369 & 3400-3569: 17

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9 hours ago, bus_7246 said:

(I can’t believe I’m defending this bus...) Please get your facts right before jumping to conclusions. The LFS only comes in the 40’ model. The interior seating layout is poor for standing capacity. If the TTC went back to a perimeter seating layout, you could accommodate more standing room in the rear of the bus (as is the case with Barmpton Transit and Miway)

The official "documented" length of the LFS, XD40, and Orion VII are all 40 foot. However put you actually went out and measured these 3 models, you would find the XD40 is actually 41 feet in length while the Orion VII is 42 feet long.

Hell you dont even need a tape measure, just take a look with your own naked eyes and you could tell that the other 2 models are longer.

So there are the facts for you.

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2 hours ago, lip said:

The official "documented" length of the LFS, XD40, and Orion VII are all 40 foot. However put you actually went out and measured these 3 models, you would find the XD40 is actually 41 feet in length while the Orion VII is 42 feet long.

Hell you dont even need a tape measure, just take a look with your own naked eyes and you could tell that the other 2 models are longer.

So there are the facts for you.

IIRC, would that also mean they need additional paperwork from MTO because they're over 40ft?

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On 6/10/2019 at 10:04 AM, bus_7246 said:

 The LFS only comes in the 40’ model. The interior seating layout is poor for standing capacity. If the TTC went back to a perimeter seating layout, you could accommodate more standing room in the rear of the bus (as is the case with Barmpton Transit and Miway) 

 

Problem with perimeter seating as we all remember from the pre Orion-VII days, people don't like to be squished like sardines sitting in a row. and nowadays more people are overweight & obese, meaning a lot of those seats would be wasted because nobody but the smallest people or kids could fit. You kind of see this in the back row of 5 seats, and in the 3 rows in front, but the problem becomes more amplified when there are like 10 seats in a row, at least with the standard spacing.

 

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22 minutes ago, MK78 said:

Problem with perimeter seating as we all remember from the pre Orion-VII days, people don't like to be squished like sardines sitting in a row. and nowadays more people are overweight & obese, meaning a lot of those seats would be wasted because nobody but the smallest people or kids could fit. You kind of see this in the back row of 5 seats, and in the 3 rows in front, but the problem becomes more amplified when there are like 10 seats in a row, at least with the standard spacing.

 

TTC shouldn't be accommodating people who got fatter.

The back row of 5 seats can easily be spaced. Look at the VIIs where they have extra space between each seat in the 2006-2012 versions.

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4 minutes ago, Cityflyer said:

TTC shouldn't be accommodating people who got fatter.

The back row of 5 seats can easily be spaced. Look at the VIIs where they have extra space between each seat in the 2006-2012 versions.

But they are. Look at the Flexity streetcars. They have some seats that are extra wide (and not blue accessible seats), to accommodate just that.

They could space perimeter seating out a bit, every two seats, so people have a little more room.

Myself I'm not a huge guy, a little overweight but not huge, but I have broad shoulders, and it's tight sitting next to a person of the same size as me or larger.

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20 minutes ago, MK78 said:

But they are. Look at the Flexity streetcars. They have some seats that are extra wide (and not blue accessible seats), to accommodate just that.

That's not what they're for. They are for a mother and small child to share a seat.

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7 minutes ago, 2044 said:

That's not what they're for. They are for a mother and small child to share a seat.

Really. Where is that indicated? But they can just as easily acommodate an overweight/obese person without disturbing others or taking up two seats. I don't think its that big of a deal.

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53 minutes ago, MK78 said:

Really. Where is that indicated? But they can just as easily acommodate an overweight/obese person without disturbing others or taking up two seats. I don't think its that big of a deal.

Look up "mother and child" bus and train seats.

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21 hours ago, meltingtomato said:

IIRC, would that also mean they need additional paperwork from MTO because they're over 40ft?

I'm not too familiar with the MTO certification process, so you'd have have to ask someone who's a little more familiar on that one.

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1 minute ago, lip said:

I'm not too familiar with the MTO certification process, so you'd have have to ask someone who's a little more familiar on that one.

No. But a specific permit is required for the extra length the bike rack adds.

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I hope they know that their faces are on TV.  Good luck explaining that to your boss at work the next day. 

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Personally I don't think the damage is enough for the ES buses to retire, at least one of them I saw mainly has windows broken and words being written on them at the back.

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34 minutes ago, The Queensway said:

Personally I don't think the damage is enough for the ES buses to retire, at least one of them I saw mainly has windows broken and words being written on them at the back.

They can get windows from retired buses, and hopefully the graffiti will come off with paint thinner. 

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Meh, just sand the bodies and send them through again. At least no one torched them.

It must have looked like a gang of orangoutans yanking on those steering wheels.😋

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32 minutes ago, Byfold said:

Looks like they kept trying to start the bus.

If only the TTC could add transponder car keys to their buses to prevent such incidents. It would so easy to lock intruders out that way and keep everyone safe...

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24 minutes ago, Transit geek said:

If only the TTC could add transponder car keys to their buses to prevent such incidents. It would so easy to lock intruders out that way and keep everyone safe...

Unplug the pertinent multiplex modules or a relay or two, and they can select what can or can’t come on with the ignition switch. Unfortunately physically undoing the battery cables will also disable the fire suppression- something they may still want active.

cost: 0$

Hopefully, this is a learning experience for all of us.

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4 hours ago, bus_7246 said:

Two buses were towed to Hillcrest. All big windows were kicked out, a steering wheel went missing off one of them, also the other was tagged like nobody’s 

the other one's steering wheel is severely bent.  Clearly the vandals has tools to destroy the buses the way they did.

3 hours ago, Transit geek said:

If only the TTC could add transponder car keys to their buses to prevent such incidents. It would so easy to lock intruders out that way and keep everyone safe...

well they can kick out the windows like they did yesterday.  They broke the windows so they can use the window frames as ladders to get to the top of the bus.  Thankfully nobody fell off the roof from the buses. 

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