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Articulated

Articulated

Posted
Posted
13 hours ago, FabianColeyLOVESBUSES said:

There is actually two Nova full electric bus prototypes at Arrow Road. The LFSE and the LFSE+. I guess TTC might consider ordering some electric buses from Nova in the future.

Demonstrators are fairly common; many manufacturers tour their buses around for transit systems to look at, even ones that are extremely unlikely to ever be ordered. The costs are usually covered by the manufacturer, so it doesn't really cost the transit system anything to have them on property. Since the vast majority never see passenger service, most fans don't know they exist or ever visited.

However... given that Nova has been TTC's preferred supplier of buses since 2013, it would not be a surprise if TTC was taking a long, hard look at these demonstrators given they will be switching to fully electric buses within the next few years. Remember, the only reason that none of the eBuses in the test fleet were from Nova is because at the time the order was placed, Nova did not have a long-range bus available, only a short-range one requiring on-route charging.

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MK78

MK78

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15 minutes ago, Articulated said:

Demonstrators are fairly common; many manufacturers tour their buses around for transit systems to look at, even ones that are extremely unlikely to ever be ordered. The costs are usually covered by the manufacturer, so it doesn't really cost the transit system anything to have them on property. Since the vast majority never see passenger service, most fans don't know they exist or ever visited.

However... given that Nova has been TTC's preferred supplier of buses since 2013, it would not be a surprise if TTC was taking a long, hard look at these demonstrators given they will be switching to fully electric buses within the next few years. Remember, the only reason that none of the eBuses in the test fleet were from Nova is because at the time the order was placed, Nova did not have a long-range bus available, only a short-range one requiring on-route charging.

I wonder if the TTC decides on Nova for the next stage of the electric bus purchase, would they ever sell off the 60 buses from the 3 different manufacturers they have now, to simplify the operation, servicing, training, etc...

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Articulated

Articulated

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29 minutes ago, MK78 said:

I wonder if the TTC decides on Nova for the next stage of the electric bus purchase, would they ever sell off the 60 buses from the 3 different manufacturers they have now, to simplify the operation, servicing, training, etc...

TTC has kept smaller fleets of buses around, often for their expected lives. Most recently, the 52 RTS buses and 51 D40LF buses. There are other examples, such as the Orion I and VI buses, and even further back, some relatively smaller orders of some Flyer buses (D700A, D800, D800B) in what was otherwise a predominately New Look fleet.

For smaller oddball fleets, you would want to keep them based at only one garage, where both the operators and maintenance staff would be more familiar with how to operate and fix them respectively. Which is exactly what TTC has done, with all examples of each model based exclusively at one garage.

For the electric buses, that's an open question on how long they will last, and I don't think anyone will have an answer (or if they do, they're just simply guessing). Two of the manufacturers (BYD, Proterra) don't have a particularly long history of being in business, and I'd question their longevity in the marketplace. If the companies go under, the buses may need to be retired if replacement parts can't easily be sourced. That and any sort of extreme drop in range and/or reliability would be the two leading causes for early retirement. Otherwise, if performance and parts are adequate, no reason why they couldn't go for a full lifespan.

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Xtrazsteve

Xtrazsteve

Posted
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3 hours ago, MK78 said:

I wonder if the TTC decides on Nova for the next stage of the electric bus purchase, would they ever sell off the 60 buses from the 3 different manufacturers they have now, to simplify the operation, servicing, training, etc...

They need to test them long term so I don't see why they'll do that. TTC would want to know how they perform 5 years down the road so they'll know exactly what fleet they'll buy. 

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MK78

MK78

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Yeah both of you make good points. BYD I think uses a different charging system so Its pretty much stuck at Eglinton, as well as only being 10 buses it's the smallest risk long term.

I hope the Nova's would use the same charging system as the other two already in service.

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anyfong

anyfong

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1 minute ago, TTC7447 said:

You may want to check the date on that tweet in addition to earlier posts on the thread before claiming this happened today...

Blame BlogTO for reporting it late then, shouldn't have relied on it in the first place

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Tom1122

Tom1122

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Earlier I was looking on Transsee to try to find at least one of 7 electric buses I have yet to ride (5 Proterras and 2 BYDs). I looked for 3756 and Transsee put it on Hwy 404 but last seen November 22. 

It looked like it was going to Newmarket, IIRC the factory is in/around Newmarket as in 2019 I saw two TTC painted but at the time unlettered BYD buses. So is there a reason 3756 would be going to the factory that TTC can't do?

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Articulated

Articulated

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1 hour ago, Tom1122 said:

Earlier I was looking on Transsee to try to find at least one of 7 electric buses I have yet to ride (5 Proterras and 2 BYDs). I looked for 3756 and Transsee put it on Hwy 404 but last seen November 22. 

It looked like it was going to Newmarket, IIRC the factory is in/around Newmarket as in 2019 I saw two TTC painted but at the time unlettered BYD buses. So is there a reason 3756 would be going to the factory that TTC can't do?

TTC can't do work covered under warranty on their own buses in-house. The manufacturer would, or whatever company they designate to do the repairs.

Given these are also the TTC's first fully electric buses, it could also be an issue with a component or system that TTC staff aren't currently trained or equipped to repair.

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Wayside Observer

Wayside Observer

Posted
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19 hours ago, Articulated said:

Demonstrators are fairly common; many manufacturers tour their buses around for transit systems to look at, even ones that are extremely unlikely to ever be ordered. The costs are usually covered by the manufacturer, so it doesn't really cost the transit system anything to have them on property. Since the vast majority never see passenger service, most fans don't know they exist or ever visited.

There's a wristful irony about electric bus demonstrators in that Flyer leased one of their rebuilds back form the TTC and demonstrated it in a bunch of places.  I've seen pictures of it running in Hamilton, Boston, and Edmonton.  I think it was trialled in a few more places and Flyer did get some trolleybus sales out of it.

Eventually, it hasn't happened yet, but eventually my travels will have me cross paths with one of the current TTC electric buses but until then, the last time I rode on a TTC electric bus was on Bay St. in the fall of 1992 when they were put out for the last gasp of running out the lease period on the Edmonton BBCs.  My regular twice a day electric bus ride got shut down in December 1991 when the 61 Nortown line was changed to bus.  There was no reprieve or last stand for the three lines out of Eglinton and even though it was billed as a temporary mothballing pending a final decision later at the time, everyone knew they were never going to come back.  I'll gather my thoughts on it and write a more detailed post on it in a few days in December when we come up on 30 years (Where did the last three decades go?) from the beginning of the end.

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2044

2044

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Posted
30 minutes ago, Wayside Observer said:

There's a wristful irony about electric bus demonstrators in that Flyer leased one of their rebuilds back form the TTC and demonstrated it in a bunch of places.  I've seen pictures of it running in Hamilton, Boston, and Edmonton.  I think it was trialled in a few more places and Flyer did get some trolleybus sales out of it.

Eventually, it hasn't happened yet, but eventually my travels will have me cross paths with one of the current TTC electric buses but until then, the last time I rode on a TTC electric bus was on Bay St. in the fall of 1992 when they were put out for the last gasp of running out the lease period on the Edmonton BBCs.  My regular twice a day electric bus ride got shut down in December 1991 when the 61 Nortown line was changed to bus.  There was no reprieve or last stand for the three lines out of Eglinton and even though it was billed as a temporary mothballing pending a final decision later at the time, everyone knew they were never going to come back.  I'll gather my thoughts on it and write a more detailed post on it in a few days in December when we come up on 30 years (Where did the last three decades go?) from the beginning of the end.

It's kinda too bad they don't run the Proterras on Bay anymore.

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