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3 hours ago, armorand said:

And thats WITH the artic?! Oh wow.

Any changes for mid-Winter signup then, like extra buses on hand, or extra trips during rush hour? Or just waiting until Spring to change it?

Keep in mind that only one key on MO is using an artic. That particular trip might've been a regular bus and wouldve filled up quickly if so.

Also, I doubt we'd be seeing changes unless buses were seeing extreme overloads on every trip on a consistent basis.

Ridership can be a strange beast. Certain MP trips are often packed to the brim on some days. Those same trips are sometimes nearly empty on other days on the same day of the week. 

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3 hours ago, Transit Fan said:

Keep in mind that only one key on MO is using an artic. That particular trip might've been a regular bus and wouldve filled up quickly if so.

Also, I doubt we'd be seeing changes unless buses were seeing extreme overloads on every trip on a consistent basis.

Ridership can be a strange beast. Certain MP trips are often packed to the brim on some days. Those same trips are sometimes nearly empty on other days on the same day of the week. 

I was just about to mention, if they increased capacity on the MO with extra artics, it might take some pressure off the train in the NE, potentially enough pressure to allow for 100% three-car consists (Nenshi mentioned in an article someone posted in another thread about "running more U2's on three car consists" due to technical & age issues) and shall I dare say, two-car consists, to save mileage on some of the other LRV's. That or maybe a short-turn key or two, between Lions Park & Rundle, specifically? It might help out a little bit, with moving people between the two points, assuming the transfers happen at Rundle for the EB crushloads, and WB MAX service short-turning at Lions Park would maximize efficiency.

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38 minutes ago, armorand said:

I was just about to mention, if they increased capacity on the MO with extra artics, it might take some pressure off the train in the NE, potentially enough pressure to allow for 100% three-car consists (Nenshi mentioned in an article someone posted in another thread about "running more U2's on three car consists" due to technical & age issues) and shall I dare say, two-car consists, to save mileage on some of the other LRV's. That or maybe a short-turn key or two, between Lions Park & Rundle, specifically? It might help out a little bit, with moving people between the two points, assuming the transfers happen at Rundle for the EB crushloads, and WB MAX service short-turning at Lions Park would maximize efficiency.

I don't notice a huge change in the number of people getting off at Lions Park in the evening rush hour since the Max started up. I even get off there sometimes to return a book to the Riley library and get back on the next train sometimes, and honestly I don't notice much difference in traffic on the platform.

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42 minutes ago, chills_on_the_train said:

I don't notice a huge change in the number of people getting off at Lions Park in the evening rush hour since the Max started up. I even get off there sometimes to return a book to the Riley library and get back on the next train sometimes, and honestly I don't notice much difference in traffic on the platform.

I meant, as in short-turning the MAX on a few keys there, just so it could focus on SAIT-bound riders, mostly. Unless these crush loads are all destined beyond SAIT, for Foothills and the U of C?

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4 hours ago, Transit Fan said:

Keep in mind that only one key on MO is using an artic. That particular trip might've been a regular bus and wouldve filled up quickly if so. 

The person on Twitter is likely right when they described the vehicle as a "large" bus: Block history on Transit55 suggests the MAX Orange bus due to leave Russett Road WB at 7:39 a.m. corresponds with the key serviced by the lone artic on the route.

1 hour ago, armorand said:

[…] maybe a short-turn key or two, between Lions Park & Rundle, specifically? It might help out a little bit, with moving people between the two points, assuming the transfers happen at Rundle for the EB crushloads, and WB MAX service short-turning at Lions Park would maximize efficiency.

You remind me of something I noticed the other day. I was riding a very full Arboc and ended up standing at the front of the bus, right next to the list of destinations that can be programmed into the destination sign. Under MAX Orange, "Rundle" is listed a possible end-point. I wonder if the addition of a Brentwood-Rundle short-turn is the planned next step in the development of this route?

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12 minutes ago, downbeat said:

You remind me of something I noticed the other day. I was riding a very full Arboc and ended up standing at the front of the bus, right next to the list of destinations that can be programmed into the destination sign. Under MAX Orange, "Rundle" is listed a possible end-point. I wonder if the addition of a Brentwood-Rundle short-turn is the planned next step in the development of this route?

Correct, when the MAX routes were first introduced they programmed short turning into the signs for future use (MO Rundle and MT Heritage for example.)

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Hmm, if that artic is managing to max out and has to leave people behind, that is pretty darn good for ridership. Although that would suck having to wait 16 more minutes only for the next MO to be full as well!

From the NE, I suspect that the MO route is currently most attractive to those whose destination is either 16th Ave, SAIT, UofC or the two hospitals. These same people are probably either:

  • Living within walking distance of a MO station
  • Taking a feeder bus which takes them to Saddletowne or Rundle stations
    • This is a main one since if someone is already taking a bus to one of these two stations, they're not really going out of their way to catch the MO compared to someone who gets dropped off at a neighboring station. (See below).

However, i'm curious what the percentage of people outside this category is. For example, there's many feeder buses that intersect with the MO on 52nd St as well as connect to nearby LRT stations like Whitehorn or Mcknight. How many people heading to those NW destinations are getting off and taking the MO at 52nd St or taking the train down to Rundle, getting off and taking the MO as opposed to just taking the Blue line downtown and transferring to the Red line. At the current frequencies, the MO may not be as enticing as just taking the train if you factor in the wait time.

It sounds like a bump in frequency is warranted now. But taking the above thoughts into account, I wouldn't be surprised if a higher frequency also helps to attract additional ridership as well.

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10 hours ago, armorand said:

I meant, as in short-turning the MAX on a few keys there, just so it could focus on SAIT-bound riders, mostly. Unless these crush loads are all destined beyond SAIT, for Foothills and the U of C?

If you board a Max Orange and ride it from Brentwood to Saddletowne, you may leave Brentwood empty but the bus will immediately start to pick up people on 31st Street. And some of those people will go as far as say Martindale Bv. Short turning buses at Lions Park may help people at SAIT but will not do a whole lot for those at U of C and Foothills Hospital

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Looks like either an EB 1 or MP sideswiped another vehicle pretty hard at the transitway crossing at 26th St SE this afternoon. Not entirely surprised given the close calls I see on a regular basis at these intersections. People are really bad with obeying those no right turn restrictions used during the u-turn light phases all along 17th Ave as well. Anyway, there was a pretty big emergency and transit response, hopefully everyone was okay.

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15 hours ago, Blake M said:

8313 has lost its MAX Purple wrap

On the bright side, at least it reverts to a livery that isn't as bland and uninspiring as Winnipegs :P

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43 minutes ago, yvarushin said:

Lol 8078 is displaying 304 Stampede Park 😒😒😒😒😒

That’s the previous route number for the Stampede North Express, isn’t it?

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11 minutes ago, downbeat said:

That’s the previous route number for the Stampede North Express, isn’t it?

 

56 minutes ago, yvarushin said:

Lol 8078 is displaying 304 Stampede Park 😒😒😒😒😒

Thaaaaats riiiiight, and has been since this morning!

20200217124514~2.JPG

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4 hours ago, downbeat said:

Nice to hear MAX Orange is well-used on the weekend. (Please see the second tweet.) 

 

 

302 starting to get standing loads & in the case of one driver - kicking people off the bus halfway to Downtown, in the middle of Ogden (nowhere)...

If anything needs more buses BRT-wise, MO and the 302 should definitely get some priority.

Curious though - considering NE community expansions, while the train has yet to be extended... is it possible to extend MO right up to the new suburbs, right up towards Stoney even? 

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6 hours ago, armorand said:

Curious though - considering NE community expansions, while the train has yet to be extended... is it possible to extend MO right up to the new suburbs, right up towards Stoney even? 

Right now that wouldn't be necessary, all that needs to be done is expanded service on routes like the 119, 128, 145, 157

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8 hours ago, Blake M said:

Right now that wouldn't be necessary, all that needs to be done is expanded service on routes like the 119, 128, 145, 157

One-seat trips through the NE, to Sunridge Mall/Rundle, and going along to SAIT/U of C, along with transfers onto MO, would help to boost ridership on both that & the future 52nd St BRT. Between the employers, students and everybody - it might be worth it to get MAX hooked onto some of the new neighborhoods. Even if its just for one-seat trips and minimal need for multiple transfers. The feeders will do well, with future expansion of course, but the only significant ways to increase ridership in the far NE - is direct routes (bus or future LRT), or convincing Airdrie Transit/Crossiron/Amazon/etc to send buses to/from Saddletowne, as opposed to Rundle, to help boost CT ridership considerably. If the CT  bus routes are feeding Airdrie routes between NE Calgary and Balzac, along with extended MO right up to city limits, the ridership potential could be enormous. Maybe enormous enough, to shave off hundreds of millions worth of LRT expansion, which could be reallocated towards a future Northlands station (have you seen the proposal for massive TOD on the mall lands?), or towards the Green Line, or towards more MAX. 

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11 hours ago, armorand said:

One-seat trips through the NE, to Sunridge Mall/Rundle, and going along to SAIT/U of C, along with transfers onto MO, would help to boost ridership on both that & the future 52nd St BRT. Between the employers, students and everybody - it might be worth it to get MAX hooked onto some of the new neighborhoods. Even if its just for one-seat trips and minimal need for multiple transfers. The feeders will do well, with future expansion of course, but the only significant ways to increase ridership in the far NE - is direct routes (bus or future LRT), or convincing Airdrie Transit/Crossiron/Amazon/etc to send buses to/from Saddletowne, as opposed to Rundle, to help boost CT ridership considerably. If the CT  bus routes are feeding Airdrie routes between NE Calgary and Balzac, along with extended MO right up to city limits, the ridership potential could be enormous. Maybe enormous enough, to shave off hundreds of millions worth of LRT expansion, which could be reallocated towards a future Northlands station (have you seen the proposal for massive TOD on the mall lands?), or towards the Green Line, or towards more MAX. 

So a few things,

Airdrie Route 900 (and technically the 901 at one point) used to route via McKnight Westwinds, and thats it. The decision to run the 900 further down 36th Street to connect at Rundle was for Airdrie residents, so that they could take a single bus from their city to places like Sunridge, Peter Lougheed, and the surrounding area, without having to transfer to the CTrain and pay another fare. Besides, Airdrie Transit decided to add a stop on 104 Avenue, I assume so riders could then transfer to CT routes to the Airport and some northeast communities. However, until a proper regional partnership is created, Calgary Transit's goal will be to serve Calgarians, Airdrie Transit's goal, Airdrieites.

Where do you propose this Max Orange extension go? Besides, I don't know how extending the Max Orange would save hundreds of millions of dollars, because the train is still going to have to be extended at some point. The northeast is very densely and heavily populated, and a good number of that population takes transit. Thats why you see routes like the 145 that started off as the 445 over a decade or so ago as a rush hour shuttle route, grow into a service that runs about 21 hours a day, with rush hour frequencies (pre-covid) every 6-8 minutes. A Max Orange extension would be a nice thing for those residents, sure, but they've been promised a train already, and trust me, they'll need it.

What is this Northlands station you're referring to?

 

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9 hours ago, Blake M said:

So a few things,

Airdrie Route 900 (and technically the 901 at one point) used to route via McKnight Westwinds, and thats it. The decision to run the 900 further down 36th Street to connect at Rundle was for Airdrie residents, so that they could take a single bus from their city to places like Sunridge, Peter Lougheed, and the surrounding area, without having to transfer to the CTrain and pay another fare. Besides, Airdrie Transit decided to add a stop on 104 Avenue, I assume so riders could then transfer to CT routes to the Airport and some northeast communities. However, until a proper regional partnership is created, Calgary Transit's goal will be to serve Calgarians, Airdrie Transit's goal, Airdrieites.

Where do you propose this Max Orange extension go? Besides, I don't know how extending the Max Orange would save hundreds of millions of dollars, because the train is still going to have to be extended at some point. The northeast is very densely and heavily populated, and a good number of that population takes transit. Thats why you see routes like the 145 that started off as the 445 over a decade or so ago as a rush hour shuttle route, grow into a service that runs about 21 hours a day, with rush hour frequencies (pre-covid) every 6-8 minutes. A Max Orange extension would be a nice thing for those residents, sure, but they've been promised a train already, and trust me, they'll need it.

What is this Northlands station you're referring to?

 

Northlands: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/northland-village-redevelopment-land-use-amendment-1.5656426

Long story short, if theres going to be massive TOD built at Northland, the space CT set aside for an LRT station decades ago, might become quite useful for the addition of thousands of people in the immediate vicinity of Northland. 

As for more connections between the far NE of Calgary & Crossiron - realistically, how much more ridership can be extracted out of the far NE, without any straight-forward connections to Crossiron and Balzac? Alternatively, how many other connections can help boost the MAX lines, and Airdrie Transit at the same time? What I'm thinking, is that in the meantime (over next 5 years), the MO should be extended up 60 St or Metis Trail, to the edge of Calgary (Stoney Trail), where a bus loop can be built while still physically possible, and that bus loop could help facilitate transfers between Airdrie Transit & CT, with minimal costs and legal hassle, for both sides.

That way, Airdrie gets a boost for its transit services without needing to send as many buses into Rundle (saved time, money, diesel etc), and can also boost Balzac service, while CT can reap the benefits of higher ridership from connecting with Airdrie Transit in the far NE as opposed to Rundle, while also simultaneously boosting MAX ridership and future transit use within the far northern suburbs of Calgary. All within Calgary city limits. Split 50/50 on a bus loop and a shelter (no park and ride needed for obvious reasons), and the question of future transit use in the far NE of Calgary (with a massive employment centre just outside city limits - and CT coverage), will be solved to everybodys benefit.

Especially when the 52nd St BRT comes online - those buses will be packed to the brim, with MAX Orange extended north, while the LRT extension gets put aside for a few years. 

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An infill station at Northland in the NW could be useful if enough development happens there, but a NE LRT extension is a way higher priority than that’ll ever be.

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