Jump to content

General Subway/RT Discussion


FlyerD901
 Share

Recommended Posts

If there are issues with crew changes taking too long and delaying operations, perhaps using the extra trained operators to make those go more smoothly, say by a double or triple step-back?

Naaaah, the TTC will undoubtedly think of much better ways of redeploying employees, in ways that DON'T make operations more reliable and increase customer satisfaction.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/5/2022 at 11:14 AM, Ed T. said:

If there are issues with crew changes taking too long and delaying operations, perhaps using the extra trained operators to make those go more smoothly, say by a double or triple step-back?

Naaaah, the TTC will undoubtedly think of much better ways of redeploying employees, in ways that DON'T make operations more reliable and increase customer satisfaction.

There was a time when the stepback crew member would take the train from Finch to Sheppard, get off and then take the northbound train back to Finch. What was the advantage of doing that?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Shaun said:

There was a time when the stepback crew member would take the train from Finch to Sheppard, get off and then take the northbound train back to Finch. What was the advantage of doing that?

That has never been a thing.

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Shaun said:

I have seen it. Unless it was a crewing adjustment. 

Yeah a crew is late. This happens a lot on Line 2 years ago when I use to take it after pm rush. Sometimes it happens twice on the same trip. They do this with the 501 too, not sure they still do.

Basically the crew is suppose to be already at southbound Sheppard (in this case) but they are behind and only reach northbound Sheppard. They swap so they are in the position where they magically made up time. Of course that means the crew that got swap would be super late and another crew change would be needed to bring them up to speed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

Yeah a crew is late. This happens a lot on Line 2 years ago when I use to take it after pm rush. Sometimes it happens twice on the same trip. They do this with the 501 too, not sure they still do.

You used to see it on 506 pre-Covid, with crew swaps in both directions at Coxwell.

So what happened to step-back crewing anyhow?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

Yeah a crew is late. This happens a lot on Line 2 years ago when I use to take it after pm rush. Sometimes it happens twice on the same trip. They do this with the 501 too, not sure they still do.

I was on a 501 car from Dufferin Gate Loop to Queen and Dovercourt in October 2022 and they stepped back at King and Dufferin

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone know where they plan to stage and dig the big hole to either extract or put in the bore machine for the North Yonge extension near Finch Stn?

Unlike the other 3 big provincial priority projects, I don't see any big plot of empty land they can do this near Finch Stn.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Cityflyer said:

Does anyone know where they plan to stage and dig the big hole to either extract or put in the bore machine for the North Yonge extension near Finch Stn?

Unlike the other 3 big provincial priority projects, I don't see any big plot of empty land they can do this near Finch Stn.

Move the YRT terminal to the park and ride lot. Presto, problem solved.

Actually, the tail tracks must go halfway way to practically cummer, so I dunno.

 

 

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Cityflyer said:

Does anyone know where they plan to stage and dig the big hole to either extract or put in the bore machine for the North Yonge extension near Finch Stn?

Unlike the other 3 big provincial priority projects, I don't see any big plot of empty land they can do this near Finch Stn.

Looking at this diagram (assuming it's to scale!) and the Finch Station article on Transit Toronto, it seems the tail tracks should extend around the full station length since it accommodates a full 6 car trainset. As a result, using Google Maps, the north end of the tail track tunnel should end around the area of this empty plot of land. Logically, this seems to be the best place to dig the hole for the bore machine(s) as everywhere else is built up unless they buy it out like they did with the Line 2 extension at Sheppard/McCowan.

I highly doubt they would buy and relocate those high rise apartments/condos nearby.

ttc-finch-station-model-1968.jpg

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7838176,-79.4164032,3a,75y,275.44h,97.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sEwuJQIXB4wQ2H8DbFrv6aA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 hours ago, Orion V said:

Looking at this diagram (assuming it's to scale!) and the Finch Station article on Transit Toronto, it seems the tail tracks should extend around the full station length since it accommodates a full 6 car trainset. As a result, using Google Maps, the north end of the tail track tunnel should end around the area of this empty plot of land. Logically, this seems to be the best place to dig the hole for the bore machine(s) as everywhere else is built up unless they buy it out like they did with the Line 2 extension at Sheppard/McCowan.

I highly doubt they would buy and relocate those high rise apartments/condos nearby.

ttc-finch-station-model-1968.jpg

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.7838176,-79.4164032,3a,75y,275.44h,97.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sEwuJQIXB4wQ2H8DbFrv6aA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

 

The tail track structure is far longer than just a train, as it also includes the switches and crossovers to access the middle track.

 

That diagram is pretty close to representing what was built - from what I recall of the drawings, the north end of the platform is right in the middle of Bishop Ave., with the offices taking up the next 20-ish feet of space. All in all, the northern-most point of the structure is just short of the driveway to 5800 Yonge St.

 

Dan

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, smallspy said:

The tail track structure is far longer than just a train, as it also includes the switches and crossovers to access the middle track.

 

That diagram is pretty close to representing what was built - from what I recall of the drawings, the north end of the platform is right in the middle of Bishop Ave., with the offices taking up the next 20-ish feet of space. All in all, the northern-most point of the structure is just short of the driveway to 5800 Yonge St.

 

Dan

The former Toronto Hydro building is being used as a homeless shelter. They could tear it down and start digging from there. Move the shelter somewhere else or behind it has some space they could build a temporary structure. 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...
On 10/21/2022 at 12:50 AM, Ber said:

if the carbodies of  new order looks anything remotely close to that render id be severely disappointed. the TRs were already uninspriing with their utilitarian design...

 the render is just an effortless rehash with tweaked doors and windows along with a facelift of the nose. Surely they can find some industiral designers in north america who has more artisitc creativity than that...... 😒

On 10/21/2022 at 7:54 AM, Wayside Observer said:

You'd think but it looks like the bar keeps settling even lower.  The Toronto Rocket's have always given me a strong pre-production prototype feel waiting for the industrial designers to give it a final cleanup before being released to manufacturing, rather than that of a finished product.

I've actually come to quite like the proposed new design, especially with the red paint, to the point where I'd be disappointed if it ends up being anything other than.

On 10/22/2022 at 10:01 AM, smallspy said:

The aerodynamic changes are actually more noticeable in the tunnels than in the open air,  as the air has fewer places to go due to the structure. It's called the piston effect.

With the older trains, the blunt head end of the train is the predominant aerodynamic limiting factor - the place with the highest pressure and thus the most drag. The tail end of the train is the second highest. With the TRs, the skin effect of the air along the length of the train becomes the highest component of the drag.

Interestingly, this is the one place where the older cars do better than the TRs. The rivets along the side of the carbody break up the boundary layer of air, reducing the skin effect drag. Think of them as the surface of a golf ball.

Dan

@smallspy I'm also curious as to how a sloped, but flat (non-curved) front end (like on the proposed OL rolling stock design) would compare aerodynamically to the TR-style front end (which is both sloped and curved) as well as the boxy design like the T1? Does the fact that the T1 end caps have sideways-sloping sides (non-perpendicular to the long side of the car) also make any noticeable difference than if the end caps were completely flat?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, 81-717 said:

I've actually come to quite like the proposed new design, especially with the red paint, to the point where I'd be disappointed if it ends up being anything other than.

I'm also curious as to how a sloped, but flat (non-curved) front end (like on the proposed OL rolling stock design) would compare aerodynamically to the TR-style front end (which is both sloped and curved) as well as the boxy design like the T1? Does the fact that the T1 end caps have sideways-sloping sides (non-perpendicular to the long side of the car) also make any noticeable difference than if the end caps were completely flat?

The curved nose is what makes it more aerodynamic not the rounded corners. The H1-H3 cars had more rounded edges and they were not aerodynamic, but I think they were faster especially going downhill. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 11/10/2022 at 8:52 AM, smallspy said:

That has never been a thing.

 

Dan

It was a thing for a bit when the operator washrooms at Finch were out of service for repairs. The shuttle crew would take it so the regular operators had time to use the washrooms at Sheppard.

But it wasn't pre-planned, just a reaction to emergency repairs.

 

On 11/17/2022 at 9:10 AM, smallspy said:

The tail track structure is far longer than just a train, as it also includes the switches and crossovers to access the middle track.

 

That diagram is pretty close to representing what was built - from what I recall of the drawings, the north end of the platform is right in the middle of Bishop Ave., with the offices taking up the next 20-ish feet of space. All in all, the northern-most point of the structure is just short of the driveway to 5800 Yonge St.

 

Dan

Exact point the tail tracks end is here: https://goo.gl/maps/abF2zbB71NGQ4Bz69

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Does anyone know what the deal is with the TTC is constantly holding trains with "Camera Issues" on Line 1 these days? I hear a dozen of these calls on the radio per day.

Is it related to OPTO and there is some kind of interface between the train and platform cameras? I have not been to Line 1 in well over a year so I dont know what could be triggering these delays?

ATC was supposed to make the system reliable, but these delays due to camera issues are very frequent.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

In the operator cab, there is a camera feed that shows the rear end of the train as well as (I believe) the doors so the op knows when to open/close the doors and when it is safe to do so. I assume the camera issues would be related to that malfunctioning hence causing delays

On another note, I’ve seen at least one instance where a train pulled into the platform, the chime sounded to open the doors but they didn’t actually open. Then the chime sounded to close the doors and the train pulled off without anyone getting on/off of it because the doors never actually opened lol. I guess since the operator is in the front cab they wouldn’t have noticed that? Certainly saves the TTC in crew resources but, as you mentioned, seems there’s a lot of hiccups with OPTO

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, MK78 said:

Does anyone know what the deal is with the TTC is constantly holding trains with "Camera Issues" on Line 1 these days? I hear a dozen of these calls on the radio per day.

Is it related to OPTO and there is some kind of interface between the train and platform cameras? I have not been to Line 1 in well over a year so I dont know what could be triggering these delays?

ATC was supposed to make the system reliable, but these delays due to camera issues are very frequent.

It is to do with OPTO. The system has been reliable, but not to the 99.9% reliability that they want/need.

 

The issue is that if the train does not connect to the wayside system then the operator will not be able to see the doors as they close, and thus ensure that no one would get caught. Thus there are rules that need to be followed if that happens, and one of those rules is that there needs to be a second employee at the platform level to help with that. The radio calls are to get that second employee to the platform to help.

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, smallspy said:

It is to do with OPTO. The system has been reliable, but not to the 99.9% reliability that they want/need.

The issue is that if the train does not connect to the wayside system then the operator will not be able to see the doors as they close, and thus ensure that no one would get caught. Thus there are rules that need to be followed if that happens, and one of those rules is that there needs to be a second employee at the platform level to help with that. The radio calls are to get that second employee to the platform to help.

Yeah i figured it was something to that effect. Though if it requires a helper at platform level, there is not always one available and has to be dispatched. from what i've heard collectors do not perform this duty.

I hope they can iron out the issues, cuz it does seem a little flaky.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Assuming that a platform helper doesn’t get paid as much as a guard, and assuming that they’re available on call even if there is no assistance required, how much labour savings are we seeing here?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, MK78 said:

Yeah i figured it was something to that effect. Though if it requires a helper at platform level, there is not always one available and has to be dispatched. from what i've heard collectors do not perform this duty.

I hope they can iron out the issues, cuz it does seem a little flaky.

Apparently the original intention was that the Station Managers were supposed to be able to do this. But to the best of my knowledge, they are not.

 

Only operating staff and supervisors can. Which means that two trains get delayed when the crew from the second train has to come over to help the first.

 

Dan

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...