Archer Posted July 15, 2022 Report Share Posted July 15, 2022 On 6/19/2022 at 6:03 AM, TTC103 said: I feel like this issue is a good example of why things cost so much for the TTC. I'm sure that Alstom has proposed changes to how the TTC reschedules trains to ensure that trains are always correctly routed, but the TTC and its workers seem to think they understand the problem better than the Alstom's safety engineers, who almost certainly have dealt with this issue before for clients operating driverless trains. If you constantly ignore the advice of experts, and then turn around and blame them after something goes wrong, they might not want to work for you anymore, or they will start charging extra to offset the cost of working with a difficult customer. You put far too much faith in the Alstom engineers. My first hand experience, having worked with them, is that they are abysmal engineers and have utterly no idea how their software and control systems work. The number of times they have been unable to explain why things happen in the system is unbelievable. Now, some of that may come from the fact that TTC didn't go with the Iconis front-end, instead going with a hybridized version that is similar to the existing legacy signalling interface. But there's utterly no reason why Alstom, who made the entire interface, are utterly clueless as to how it works. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted July 17, 2022 Report Share Posted July 17, 2022 On 7/13/2022 at 2:01 PM, nfitz said: That's at afternoon peak, when there's already 4-minute service. In some of the off-peak slots they are adding 5 trains, increasing the number of trains from 14 to 19. This pushes Saturday daytime service from 20 to 26 trains - it was only 24 trains in summer 2019 (but 26 trains in January 2020). Sunday daytime is now 22, same as summer 2019 and January 2020. The real deficit is still rush-hour with 31 trains at AM Peak compared to 41 in summer 2019 (and 46 trains in January 2020). PM Peak will be only 27 trains, compared to 36 trains in summer 2019 and 43 trains in January 2020. Are they doing any overhaul work on the T1's since there are more spares available? We don't have replacements for them even put out for tender so it's safe to say that they will be around for a few more years. Will they be wrapping all of them in the shiny wrap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ber Posted July 17, 2022 Report Share Posted July 17, 2022 On 7/15/2022 at 6:46 PM, Archer said: You put far too much faith in the Alstom engineers. My first hand experience, having worked with them, is that they are abysmal engineers and have utterly no idea how their software and control systems work. The number of times they have been unable to explain why things happen in the system is unbelievable. Now, some of that may come from the fact that TTC didn't go with the Iconis front-end, instead going with a hybridized version that is similar to the existing legacy signalling interface. But there's utterly no reason why Alstom, who made the entire interface, are utterly clueless as to how it works. well... their incompetence is prob a reason why their previous entity failed to stay in the market which led to their sale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-717 Posted July 18, 2022 Report Share Posted July 18, 2022 On 7/16/2022 at 8:39 PM, Shaun said: Are they doing any overhaul work on the T1's since there are more spares available? We don't have replacements for them even put out for tender so it's safe to say that they will be around for a few more years. Will they be wrapping all of them in the shiny wrap? https://stevemunro.ca/2022/06/22/the-gaping-hole-in-ttc-funding/ This article touches on the issue at hand, they've already contacted suppliers but haven't actually awarded the contract because a large chunk of the required funding is still missing, which poses the threat of jeopardizing the whole project. The T1s are scheduled to remain in service for "a few more years" anyway (until 2026–2030), but if they get a 10-year extension it'll be a LOT more than just "a few more years". Hopefully they'll be able to get the required funding in time (don't know if there's a set deadline) so they can avoid moving forward with the life extension option. This ain't New York, Toronto's subways were never meant to last 40–50 years instead of 30–35, and the T1s & TRs are no exception. Quote Subway Trains and Facilities The purchase of subway trains (primarily replacements for the existing T-1 fleet on Line 2 BD) must be fully funded before the TTC signs a contract lest the City be on the hook for funding that was assumed to be available from others. The total project cost is $2.3 billion of which only $619 million in City funding has been nailed down. No provincial nor federal contribution has arrived. If TTC is unsuccessful in receiving funding for the subway car purchase, then the existing funding of $619 million will need to be increased by $100 million and utilized for T1 Life Extension Overhaul instead, to extend the useful life of the T1 trains from 30 to 40 years, thereby deferring the cost of subway trains that will inevitably be required. [p. 25] The TTC has an RFP on the street for supply of these trains, but it is unclear if they will be able to award the contract. If the decision is taken to rebuild the existing fleet, this carries two major risks: Whether the fleet will last reliably to 2040. The TTC’s experience with life extension programs has mixed results notably with the CLRV/ALRV streetcar fleets, and of course with the SRT fleet. What will be done about the signal system on Line 2. ATC conversion is a funded project, but retrofitting the T-1 fleet for ATC operation would be expensive and add to the complexity of any overhaul. The SSE to Sheppard is planned to operate with ATC. Conversely if the existing system is left in place, it would be over 70 years old by 2040. This is not simply a question of shuffling money around in the budget, but of potentially boxing in the TTC’s options for the future of the Bloor-Danforth subway. Related unfunded projects include changes to Greenwood Yard and additional storage to accommodate the co-existence of old and new fleets. Further in the future is a new subway yard west of Kipling Station that could be either a standalone project or built as part of a western extension of Line 2. Meanwhile on Line 1 YUS, the TTC plans a new yard in York Region to supplement storage for that line. However, this yard is not part of the Yonge North Extension project and it is not funded. Funding for additional trains both to extend Line 1 and to increase service is likewise not part of the YNSE project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted August 28, 2022 Report Share Posted August 28, 2022 Although the Scarborough subway is a better solution it's still more expensive than ordering new trains for the Scarborough RT. Does anyone know if the price tag for new cars the TTC was quoted is similar to what was quoted for Vancouver? https://buzzer.translink.ca/2022/08/next-generation-of-skytrain-cars-take-shape/ They could have piggybacked on that order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bus_Medic Posted August 28, 2022 Report Share Posted August 28, 2022 4 hours ago, Shaun said: Although the Scarborough subway is a better solution it's still more expensive than ordering new trains for the Scarborough RT. Does anyone know if the price tag for new cars the TTC was quoted is similar to what was quoted for Vancouver? https://buzzer.translink.ca/2022/08/next-generation-of-skytrain-cars-take-shape/ They could have piggybacked on that order. https://youtu.be/JizzeERcZjg 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptorjays Posted September 5, 2022 Report Share Posted September 5, 2022 Isn’t this headway ridiculous even though it is Sunday night?? Taken at Bathurst Stn when going home from the EX 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted September 5, 2022 Report Share Posted September 5, 2022 11 hours ago, raptorjays said: Isn’t this headway ridiculous even though it is Sunday night?? Taken at Bathurst Stn when going home from the EX That's not bad. If it was double that they would need to short turn a train to reduce the headway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-717 Posted September 5, 2022 Report Share Posted September 5, 2022 Pretty normal during off-peak hours, even pre-covid. Still not as bad as New York, where you could be waiting over 20 mins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted September 6, 2022 Report Share Posted September 6, 2022 Anyone know why there is still a slow order between Yorkdale and Wilson? I thought the closure was supposed to fix those problems. It probably takes longer to travel by train than if you could walk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IRT_BMT_IND Posted September 15, 2022 Report Share Posted September 15, 2022 The slow order on the southbound track just north of Bloor station is bad too, the train has to enter the station at a walking pace because of it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted September 15, 2022 Report Share Posted September 15, 2022 11 hours ago, IRT_BMT_IND said: The slow order on the southbound track just north of Bloor station is bad too, the train has to enter the station at a walking pace because of it. Likely due to problems with the cross over tracks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Articulated Posted September 15, 2022 Report Share Posted September 15, 2022 1 hour ago, Shaun said: Likely due to problems with the cross over tracks. The work zone is on the outdoor section of the southbound track, well north of the crossover; there are sections of ballast dug up in this area. The slow order actually ends at the crossover, being six car lengths from the end of the work zone; however, given the platform is almost there, there's no room to accelerate to full speed before needing to stop, so trains continue their slow speed into the platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTAmissions1 Posted September 29, 2022 Report Share Posted September 29, 2022 TTC Line 1 is now fully enabled with automated train control or ATC for short along the entire line. Phasing out a decades old signal block system with something more modern. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted September 29, 2022 Report Share Posted September 29, 2022 Can someone tell me if there is still bunching at Finch during peak periods? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
81-717 Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 https://stevemunro.ca/2022/10/11/will-line-2-renewal-ever-happen/ And the jeopardy of line 2's fate continues... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raptorjays Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 13 hours ago, 81-717 said: https://stevemunro.ca/2022/10/11/will-line-2-renewal-ever-happen/ And the jeopardy of line 2's fate continues... Probably another evidence that Line 2 is treated like trash. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bus_Medic Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 13 hours ago, 81-717 said: https://stevemunro.ca/2022/10/11/will-line-2-renewal-ever-happen/ And the jeopardy of line 2's fate continues... You make it sound like it’s closing instead of the SRT 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T3G Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 1 hour ago, raptorjays said: Probably another evidence that Line 2 is treated like trash. Do you people realize how ridiculous these comments sound in the era of air-conditioned, wheelchair accessible transit vehicles? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted October 12, 2022 Report Share Posted October 12, 2022 5 hours ago, T3G said: Do you people realize how ridiculous these comments sound in the era of air-conditioned, wheelchair accessible transit vehicles? The issue with the T1's was finding new computer components and spares which are becoming difficult to find. Its not like the H1 and H2 days where you could just rebuild or reverse engineer components or build new ones that fit. With that said would it be possible to build and replace the entire computer system with new technology? And would that be more cost effective than buying new rolling stock? The T1's use a GTO VVVF traction motor which is still very commonly used around the world so I'm sure someone knows how to create a code for it. Maybe you can use an existing software and modify it to fit the current profile programmed today. I don't know how plausible that is but it could extend the life of the T1's without having to worry about computer components. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyerD901 Posted October 15, 2022 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2022 NEW SUBWAY TRAINS his Request for Proposals is an invitation by the Toronto Transit Commission to those Proponents that were pre-qualified under Request for Supplier Qualification P76PH22075 - New Subway Trains to submit Proposals for New Subway Trains. The successful Proponent will be responsible for all Deliverables associated with the NST of every kind (Car and non-Car), in every stage of their preparation and completion, to be provided, and all work, including warranty work and latent defect work. For clarity, this scope of Work includes associated equipment necessary to facilitate operation and maintenance of the trains. Request for Proposal documents are available for download through TTC’s Bonfire Portal at https://ttc.bonfirehub.ca/opportunities/55969 The Proponent must have been pre-qualified by TTC for its Proposal to be evaluated. Only the following companies have been pre-qualified by TTC and only Proposals submitted by these prequalified Proponents will be evaluated and accepted: 1. Alstom Transport Canada Inc. 2. CRRC Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd. 3. Hyundai Rotem Company 4. Kawasaki Rail Car, Inc Name of Trade Agreement(s) that is Applicable to the procurement - Canada-European Union Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement (CETA) Chapter 19, Canadian Free Trade Agreement (CFTA) Chapter 506, Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) chapter 15 and United States-Mexico-Canada Agreement (USMCA) chapter 13. I hope everyone is able to read it, if not let me know 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Oke Posted October 15, 2022 Report Share Posted October 15, 2022 5 hours ago, FlyerD901 said: NEW SUBWAY TRAINS his Request for Proposals is an invitation by the Toronto Transit Commission to those Proponents that were pre-qualified under Request for Supplier Qualification P76PH22075 - New Subway Trains to submit Proposals for New Subway Trains. The successful Proponent will be responsible for all Deliverables associated with the NST of every kind (Car and non-Car), in every stage of their preparation and completion, to be provided, and all work, including warranty work and latent defect work. For clarity, this scope of Work includes associated equipment necessary to facilitate operation and maintenance of the trains. Request for Proposal documents are available for download through TTC’s Bonfire Portal at https://ttc.bonfirehub.ca/opportunities/55969 The Proponent must have been pre-qualified by TTC for its Proposal to be evaluated. Only the following companies have been pre-qualified by TTC and only Proposals submitted by these prequalified Proponents will be evaluated and accepted: 1. Alstom Transport Canada Inc. 2. CRRC Qingdao Sifang Co., Ltd. 3. Hyundai Rotem Company 4. Kawasaki Rail Car, Inc Name of Trade Agreement(s) that is Applicable to the procurement - Canada-European Union Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement (CETA) Chapter 19, Canadian Free Trade Agreement (CFTA) Chapter 506, Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP) chapter 15 and United States-Mexico-Canada Agreement (USMCA) chapter 13. I hope everyone is able to read it, if not let me know Interestingly, Siemens is left out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted October 15, 2022 Report Share Posted October 15, 2022 38 minutes ago, John Oke said: Interestingly, Siemens is left out My instincts say the Chinese company will be cheapest but likely won't win. Alstom likely has the upper hand since they have the facility to build trains in TTC gauge and could modify the TR design. Hyundai and Kawasaki may be good candidates. Do they have to pick the lowest bidder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MK78 Posted October 15, 2022 Report Share Posted October 15, 2022 34 minutes ago, Shaun said: My instincts say the Chinese company will be cheapest but likely won't win. Let's hope the TTC management learned from the BYD eBus debacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted October 15, 2022 Report Share Posted October 15, 2022 9 minutes ago, MK78 said: Let's hope the TTC management learned from the BYD eBus debacle. Look how long it took Boston to accept their new Chinese trains into service. Something like 4 years? They finally retired their Hawker cars from the 70's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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