FlyerD901

Future TTC Bus Orders

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Looks like TTC is looking for manufacturers for a future bus order.

Future TTC Bus order

Document request list Here

R32PA16809 - FUTURE BUS PROCUREMENT OF TTC BUSES

The Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) is seeking an expression of interest in order to identify and obtain information from firms interested in participating with future bus purchases. The TTC currently operates and maintains a fleet of approximately 2,000 buses to support the movement of its customers across the Greater Toronto Area. A move to steady state procurement has been implemented and the TTC plans on purchasing approximately 120 buses annually.
 

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Looks like after 18 years, TTC could consider having an option to buy the New Flyer Xcelsiors otherwise, we will be stuck with the LFS forever.

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It's about time. It's a huge win for whoever wins the contract. Hopefully New Flyer does consider meeting the requirements and provide a stainless steel model. Hopefully we'll see the award around June?

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Stainless Steel was never the problem, it was the cross reference check and some other requirements.

23 minutes ago, 21 Brimley said:

Looks like after 18 years, TTC could consider having an option to buy the New Flyer Xcelsiors otherwise, we will be stuck with the LFS forever.

They always had the option to go with NFI, it just didn't meet their requirements.

With this news, I wonder if they will still go with Nova for the remaining option of the current contract in 2017?

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31 minutes ago, FlyerD901 said:

Stainless Steel was never the problem, it was the cross reference check and some other requirements.

They always had the option to go with NFI, it just didn't meet their requirements.

With this news, I wonder if they will still go with Nova for the remaining option of the current contract in 2017?

I always thought they would price a stainless steel model significantly higher than Nova.

TTC's contract with Nova was for up to 250 buses. They ordered 213. They'll have to negotiate if they were to order 120 more buses for the current price. 

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I'm sure NFI could under bid similar to what they did for NYC to get a foot in TTC. Stainless steel frame is also just a factor, as I mentioned earlier they had the cross reference issue to deal with, and other things that are evaluated altogether. Nova wasn't 100% compliant either they still had some specs to get them up to standard.

I'm hoping they go with NFI or even split the order every year.  And a better paint for these buses, and a proven perimeter seating arrangement.

12 minutes ago, Xtrazsteve said:

I always thought they would price a stainless steel model significantly higher than Nova.

TTC's contract with Nova was for up to 250 buses. They ordered 213. They'll have to negotiate if they were to order 120 more buses for the current price. 

 

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35 minutes ago, FlyerD901 said:

I'm sure NFI could under bid similar to what they did for NYC to get a foot in TTC. Stainless steel frame is also just a factor, as I mentioned earlier they had the cross reference issue to deal with, and other things that are evaluated altogether. Nova wasn't 100% compliant either they still had some specs to get them up to standard.

I'm hoping they go with NFI or even split the order every year.  And a better paint for these buses, and a proven perimeter seating arrangement.

 

Yes the cross reference list is quite important. TTC doesn't want to pay New Flyers to be the middleman for parts when they can go get them from the original supplier. 

It would be interesting if they do a 60/60 split. NYC buys buses from both NFI and Nova but they need a heck of a lot more buses.

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34 minutes ago, Xtrazsteve said:

Yes the cross reference list is quite important. TTC doesn't want to pay New Flyers to be the middleman for parts when they can go get them from the original supplier. 

It would be interesting if they do a 60/60 split. NYC buys buses from both NFI and Nova but they need a heck of a lot more buses.

That above could be an option to replace the NG hybrid and older VII buses built before 2006. They might need Artics before McNicoll is in operation.

Since this 108 bus order is cosmetically the same as last years LFS order, there is still no back window at all on the first four orders. 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, 21 Brimley said:

That above could be an option to replace the NG hybrid and older VII buses built before 2006. They might need Artics before McNicoll is in operation.

Since this 108 bus order is cosmetically the same as last years LFS order, there is still no back window at all on the first four orders. 

 

 

I don't know how this is relevant with this discussion.

We all know that this contract will replace the D40LFs, hybrids as well as new buses for service. The TTC isn't going to order any more artics. There is no plans in the fleet planning and they have limited use beyond their assigned routes. TTC don't need artics and shouldn't have ordered them at all.

TTC can change the specs if they want. If they really wanted a back window, the could have changed it half way. They don't need a new contract to do so. 

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Other transit systems don't order buses with rear windows anymore. MT, HSR, Brampton all had buses with rear windows and are now getting buses without them. Both NFI and Nova.

 

With talk of more Federal funding I wonder if TTC will fast forward retirement of other buses? TTC was planning on going with this type of procurement before the federal funding was announced.

 

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I hope nfi wins the contract.

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On 05/05/2016 at 1:53 AM, FlyerD901 said:

Other transit systems don't order buses with rear windows anymore. MT, HSR, Brampton all had buses with rear windows and are now getting buses without them. Both NFI and Nova.

 

With talk of more Federal funding I wonder if TTC will fast forward retirement of other buses? TTC was planning on going with this type of procurement before the federal funding was announced.

 

Mississauga is actually ordering buses with rear windows now. Any bus ordered from 2013-Present have rear windows...

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Its probably cheaper not to have rear windows, easier access for mechanics, and one less component to deal with. With all the talk about customer service from Byford and the experience it would be a great addition.

17 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

It's about time. It's a huge win for whoever wins the contract. Hopefully New Flyer does consider meeting the requirements and provide a stainless steel model. Hopefully we'll see the award around June?

EOI closes on May 27th 2016. So possibly June when we see who wins.

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17 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

I don't know how this is relevant with this discussion.

Hint: it's not.

10 hours ago, H4 5600 said:

I hope nfi wins the contract.

Neither is this.

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4 hours ago, FlyerD901 said:

Its probably cheaper not to have rear windows, easier access for mechanics, and one less component to deal with. With all the talk about customer service from Byford and the experience it would be a great addition.

EOI closes on May 27th 2016. So possibly June when we see who wins.

No one really cares if there is a window at the back.  

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If there are transit systems still ordering buses with a rear window I'm sure theres some importance. Some buses have the ceiling emergency exits glass where you could look up. lol. I forget if its MT or Brampton or both that has that.

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59 minutes ago, leylandvictory2 said:

No one really cares if there is a window at the back.  

I would like a rear window.

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1 hour ago, H4 5600 said:

I would like a rear window.

Good thing fanboys don't dedicate how TTC buys buses or we'll have 10 of every model at every garage.

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I use the rear window to see if there's an express bus coming towards us so I can get off at the next express stop to catch that bus..

I don't mind if there is or isn't a rear window..

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15 minutes ago, noahrp24 said:

I use the rear window to see if there's an express bus coming towards us so I can get off at the next express stop to catch that bus..

I don't mind if there is or isn't a rear window..

That's just it. And other reasons.

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25 minutes ago, FlyerD901 said:

That's just it. And other reasons.

in case the bus is hijacked the police can see what is going on from the outside I suppose.

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I would say that's an extreme example, but in this day an age anything is possible. A bus recently got hijacked to make a run to Timmies.

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1 hour ago, FlyerD901 said:

I would say that's an extreme example, but in this day an age anything is possible. A bus recently got hijacked to make a run to Timmies.

Can't miss out on the last day of Roll Up the Rim!

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With Nextbus etc you shouldn't need to be able to eyeball a vehicle to know it will serve a stop.

 

 

But then it goes wrong and TTC says "third-party, not our responsibility that it and our service have diverged"

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On 5/5/2016 at 9:41 AM, noahrp24 said:

Mississauga is actually ordernig buses with rear windows now. Any bus ordered from 2013-Present have rear windows...

YRT took a bit of an odd route, they didn't have a rear window for their 2014 XD40s but they got a rear window for their 2015 LFS, that followed the 2013 VIVA LFSA order that had windows, seems like the windows is more of a per transit authority choice and if they have the budget for it

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