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Green Line LRT

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13 minutes ago, CanadianTransitTycoon said:

I assume Siemens does not offer the S70 anymore? If they still did, I'd bet on that being their offering.

I'm pretty sure they still offer the S70 - the Twin Cities in Minnesota were due to receive some this year.  I imagine it would likely be some variation of that proposed for Calgary, along with the "we've never steered you wrong before, we're buddies, aren't we?" pitch (which can be debated at another time, in another forum....).

Unless there's something that absolutely doesn't have a suitable North American crash rating, and how the vehicles handle extreme cold, I don't think there's much in terms of technology that would differ between European and North American light rail.  Light rail manufacturers will build you whatever your want, combining all sorts of vehicles and modules together to meet your needs - while theoretically there's an "off-the-shelf" version of each model, every agency heavily customizes the vehicles they order.

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7 hours ago, CTrainDude said:

I'm pretty sure they still offer the S70 - the Twin Cities in Minnesota were due to receive some this year.  I imagine it would likely be some variation of that proposed for Calgary, along with the "we've never steered you wrong before, we're buddies, aren't we?" pitch (which can be debated at another time, in another forum....).

Unless there's something that absolutely doesn't have a suitable North American crash rating,

Well on the bright side, unlike the German autobahns, no one's going to be going down Deerfoot, Centre Street or 52nd St SE anytime soon at over 200 km/h, so collisions shouldn't be a concern. Especially with Calgary's speed limits mostly capped at 50/60. Would the crash ratings and safeties really vary that much though between Europe and Canada? Or Japan and Canada?

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1 hour ago, armorand said:

Well on the bright side, unlike the German autobahns, no one's going to be going down Deerfoot, Centre Street or 52nd St SE anytime soon at over 200 km/h, so collisions shouldn't be a concern. Especially with Calgary's speed limits mostly capped at 50/60. Would the crash ratings and safeties really vary that much though between Europe and Canada? Or Japan and Canada?

You’re assuming that the crash ratings are stricter in Europe - The safety standards in the US for LRVs are stricter, so anything offered in “North America” generally satisfies those standards.  And keep in mind that LRVs in North America often travel faster when used as commuter-type rail than those used as trams in Europe. 

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11 hours ago, CanadianTransitTycoon said:

I assume Siemens does not offer the S70 anymore? If they still did, I'd bet on that being their offering.

The S70 is still offered, but it's a 70% low floor, not 100% low floor. 

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13 hours ago, armorand said:

https://new.siemens.com/global/en/products/mobility/rail-solutions/rolling-stock/trams-and-light-rail/avenio.html - found this page while looking up 100% Siemens lowfloor LRV's.

Has it just not been approved to run in North America? Problem with power conversions from European to North American power supplies and systems? Or literally just never offered by Siemens/not much demand due to high floor infrastructure thats been utilized in almost all North American mass transit systems and expensive to reconfigure for LRV's? That and maybe lack of new (low floor-based LRT) systems and other preferences elsewhere for Siemens, maybe? 

 

Power certainly isn't the issue- 750VDC is 750VDC anywhere in the world. The AC power into the substation though it what would differ and require different configurations of equipment, but, that's not an LRV issue.

" high floor infrastructure thats been utilized in almost all North American mass transit systems" my emphasis is bolded and italicized because I think that's quite false. Edmonton, Calgary, San Fransisco, Pittsburgh, and St. Louis I think are largely the only systems using a true high floor LRV. Those systems that have/ had LRV's with steps (ie San Diego, Denver, Salt Lake, Portland) are moving to 70% low floors, and I suspect others systems would go to 70% low floors when they replace equipment next time around (Sacramento, Buffalo) and a number of new systems have started off with 70% low floors (Houston, Charlotte, Sound Transit I believe). Plus, the plethora of smaller start ups that are 100% low floor. High floor systems are in the minority by a pretty good margin.

The simple answer is North American (US!) requirements. Siemens does have this to say (with my emphasis added):
"Low-floor concepts with low-level entrances, car floors without steps and the right level of comfort are the main criteria for such light rail vehicles.   Siemens offers you trams and light rail vehicles that optimally fit your requirements and your city, such as innovative single-articulated trams or highly flexible multi-articulated trams from the Avenio family. We have also developed a separate platform to meet specific North American market requirements with regard to technical standards, operating conditions, and localization."
https://new.siemens.com/global/en/products/mobility/rail-solutions/rolling-stock/trams-and-light-rail.html

 

Also they say:
"The body has a lightweight construction to reduce total weight. However, it takes into account the especially strict U.S. guidelines regarding static strength, crashworthiness, and fire protection."

As I recall with the TTC streetcar procurement, Siemen's did put in a bid and it came in something like $500 million more than Bombardier. Now there were some specific TTC requirements which meant that simply porting a European design wasn't going to work, but, even for a green field development like Edmonton or Calgary, perhaps there just isn't enough demand still for Siemen's to competitively port their 100% low floor design from Europe. Edmonton "only" bought 26 cars, so, I could see without an off the shelf LRV no consortium would have probably wanted Siemen's involved, and Siemen's couldn't competitively price a new product that has to go through R&D for a relatively small number of cars.
In Bombardier's case they won the TTC procurement and have since been able to offer that basic design from a large 204 car order for smaller purchases (Waterloo, Edmonton), and then the Metrolinx order, plus, being involved in the Calgary procurement.

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