Jump to content
1604

Green Line LRT

Recommended Posts

47 minutes ago, TimmyC62 said:

Following up on the Council meeting, engineers seem to have decided definitively that tunneling under the Bow is technically too dangerous, and that a bridge will have to be implemented: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/green-line-tunnel-bridge-1.5195297

This makes *way* more sense than some of the stuff being reported the other day ...

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If thats the case though... should we expect a bridge like Edmontons, in between two tunneled segments of the system? Or are they planning to make the 16th Avenue station above-grade as well?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, armorand said:

If thats the case though... should we expect a bridge like Edmontons, in between two tunneled segments of the system? Or are they planning to make the 16th Avenue station above-grade as well?

If they’re going with the bridge, there’s not much doubt the downtown tunnel would need to surface somewhere in Eau Claire to start onto the bridge. While it would be super awesome to see the bridge enter into a portal in the bluff on the other end, my guess is that since the portion north of 16th Avenue is planned to be at grade anyway, your latter guess is likely the better bet. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, CTrainDude said:

If they’re going with the bridge, there’s not much doubt the downtown tunnel would need to surface somewhere in Eau Claire to start onto the bridge. While it would be super awesome to see the bridge enter into a portal in the bluff on the other end, my guess is that since the portion north of 16th Avenue is planned to be at grade anyway, your latter guess is likely the better bet. 

At this point I'm fully expecting them to move the line to 3rd street and build it in-street. Close the intersections at 2nd, 3rd, and 8th avenues to build stations and the bridge entrance. Something like that. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Honestly, if the design is going to regress that much to the point where they would need to close off intersections downtown in order to accommodate at-grade stations or keep the line running at-grade at a major intersection like 16th Ave N, I wouldn't bother building this thing at all.

They'd be better off reverting back to the old BRT transitway plans and building that out all the way to North Pointe and Seton with buses running in mixed traffic in downtown.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm wondering if we're going to go back to this, then: GcpbMDM.jpg

It was widely agreed during the planning process that produced these options that putting it on the streets would be a bit cheaper, but incredibly disruptive to traffic and to the Green Line itself once running. 

This option was disruptive to Prince's Island park, though. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Blake M said:

At this point I'm fully expecting them to move the line to 3rd street and build it in-street. Close the intersections at 2nd, 3rd, and 8th avenues to build stations and the bridge entrance. Something like that. 

Throws a wrench into Red Line future tunnel through Downtown though, unless they can tunnel it through Olympic Park and have it directly run underneath 7th or 6th Avenues in the future? Or south on 9th?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, armorand said:

Throws a wrench into Red Line future tunnel through Downtown though, unless they can tunnel it through Olympic Park and have it directly run underneath 7th or 6th Avenues in the future? Or south on 9th?

I really don't think the city's considering building the 8th Avenue tunnel. Or if they are, we will see that accommodated for with the Green Line construction

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Blake M said:

I really don't think the city's considering building the 8th Avenue tunnel. Or if they are, we will see that accommodated for with the Green Line construction

In that case though, if they don't decide to build it, then they definitely need to stop approving new suburbs in the south, maybe concentrate actual employment centres on those lands instead (to also take advantage of empty trains going back to Somerset in AM/leaving in PM) and consider some new BRT or something. If the Red Line tunnel won't be built out, they should definitely take some concrete steps to limit the demand in the future, if they do decide to permanently write off a Red Line tunnel (even though the infrastructure for it already exists barricaded off underneath City Hall...)

Not just for Red Line too, but just for straining Calgary Transit: city planning should be alot better, and maybe densify areas so that if the Green Line is going to take up underground real estate, the Red line will be in a better position to have its capacity utilized to the max, by putting employment centres where these new suburbs are going up, and instead forcing those subrban developers to go with TOD/mid/highrises instead - which along MacLeod Trail/LRT (or along major roads - Heritage Dr, Southland Drive, Elbow Drive, 14th St SW, MRU etc), is a very strong possibility.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’d say LRT has limitations in general, underground or not. There comes a certain point in a city’s sprawl/growth where heavy commuter rail should begin to be considered. 

Especially with outlying suburbs (Airdrie, Okotoks, Chestermere, Cochrane) and their continuous expansion towards Calgary proper.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Nick B said:

I’d say LRT has limitations in general, underground or not. There comes a certain point in a city’s sprawl/growth where heavy commuter rail should begin to be considered. 

Especially with outlying suburbs (Airdrie, Okotoks, Chestermere, Cochrane) and their continuous expansion towards Calgary proper.

You realize that there is no instance of commuter rail in North America that can match LRT in terms of capacity, right?


Dan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, smallspy said:

You realize that there is no instance of commuter rail in North America that can match LRT in terms of capacity, right?


Dan

I certainly do. Why do you ask?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Nick B said:

I’d say LRT has limitations in general, underground or not. There comes a certain point in a city’s sprawl/growth where heavy commuter rail should begin to be considered. 

Especially with outlying suburbs (Airdrie, Okotoks, Chestermere, Cochrane) and their continuous expansion towards Calgary proper.

Only thing is: will Kenney and Nenshi agree on heavy rail/an Alberta clone of GO Transit, using what was going to be HSR money, among other things? NDP would've agreed, but under Kenney, unsure if he would commit billions to a Calgary S-Bahn. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, smallspy said:

You realize that there is no instance of commuter rail in North America that can match LRT in terms of capacity, right?


Dan

At what point would a commuter train be carrying 80,000 people a day from Airdrie?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, vicinity said:

At what point would a commuter train be carrying 80,000 people a day from Airdrie?

Maybe if Red Deer got bought out and relocated to Airdrie 😂😂😂

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, armorand said:

Maybe if Red Deer got bought out and relocated to Airdrie 😂😂😂

Would be rather shocking to watch 80% of a city commute out and back every day.

Maybe by 2150 when the coasts have flooded and AB's population is ~300 million 🤣

  • Haha 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, vicinity said:

At what point would a commuter train be carrying 80,000 people a day from Airdrie?

Well, the line would probably run to Edmonton, possibly further north. Still, I see no need to carry that many people along that route.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, chills_on_the_train said:

Would be rather shocking to watch 80% of a city commute out and back every day.

Maybe by 2150 when the coasts have flooded and AB's population is ~300 million 🤣

Pole shift lmao, but seriously, i'd be scared if ANY city in Canada did that, nevermind Red Deer or Airdrie... 

However, with Winnipeg turning into Detroit at an alarming pace, we might just have our 80% commuter cities coming very shortly. :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The four LRV suppliers moving forward for the RFP stage have been released. And no Siemens - I bet they’re shocked and figured they had it in the bag. 

Quote

Light Rail Vehicle Request for Qualification

On February 1, 2019, The City released the RFQ for the Green Line's new fleet of Light Rail Vehicles (LRV). The Green Line will use low-floor LRV technology that has not been used before in Calgary.

This RFQ closed on May 16, 2019. We received submissions from eight Applicants and have concluded our evaluation. The four shortlisted LRV suppliers, who will be invited to participate in the next stage of the LRV procurement, the Request for Proposals (RFP) stage, are:

Alstom Transport Canada Inc.

Bombardier Transportation Canada Inc.

Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles

Kinkisharyo International L.L.C.

The LRV RFP is anticipated to be released in December of 2019.

 

https://www.calgary.ca/Transportation/TI/Pages/Transit-projects/Green-line/industry-information.aspx

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Bombardier made that list?!?! I'm just wondering, dont they still owe TTC dozens of trams?!?!?!??! 

Otherwise though, would be interesting, but I've always been a fan of those German LRV's. Would be nice to see some Japanese ones come into play!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, CTrainDude said:

The four LRV suppliers moving forward for the RFP stage have been released. And no Siemens - I bet they’re shocked and figured they had it in the bag. 

https://www.calgary.ca/Transportation/TI/Pages/Transit-projects/Green-line/industry-information.aspx

Depends I guess if Calgary was after a 100% low floor LRV which Siemens does not offer in North America yet. I'm not certain if Siemen's had a chance with Edmonton's Valley Line either. Bombardier and Alstrom where both involved on consortiums. I'm not sure however who the third consortium would have had for an LRV vendor as that wasn't obvious from the list of members.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, M. Parsons said:

Depends I guess if Calgary was after a 100% low floor LRV which Siemens does not offer in North America yet.

https://new.siemens.com/global/en/products/mobility/rail-solutions/rolling-stock/trams-and-light-rail/avenio.html - found this page while looking up 100% Siemens lowfloor LRV's.

Has it just not been approved to run in North America? Problem with power conversions from European to North American power supplies and systems? Or literally just never offered by Siemens/not much demand due to high floor infrastructure thats been utilized in almost all North American mass transit systems and expensive to reconfigure for LRV's? That and maybe lack of new (low floor-based LRT) systems and other preferences elsewhere for Siemens, maybe? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, armorand said:

https://new.siemens.com/global/en/products/mobility/rail-solutions/rolling-stock/trams-and-light-rail/avenio.html - found this page while looking up 100% Siemens lowfloor LRV's.

Has it just not been approved to run in North America? Problem with power conversions from European to North American power supplies and systems? Or literally just never offered by Siemens/not much demand due to high floor infrastructure thats been utilized in almost all North American mass transit systems and expensive to reconfigure for LRV's? That and maybe lack of new (low floor-based LRT) systems and other preferences elsewhere for Siemens, maybe? 

I assume Siemens does not offer the S70 anymore? If they still did, I'd bet on that being their offering.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...