drum118 Posted January 22, 2020 Report Share Posted January 22, 2020 7 hours ago, nfitz said: However 4401 was also sent for welding repairs - unlike 4400 which was sent back for completion in 2013 had to leave a second time for welding repairs in 2018. (I'm curious about 4402, if they did the welding repairs when it got sent back in 2015). In terms of arrival in Toronto ... all 204 have arrived at some time or another. Though 4603 is still on a CP flatbed somewhere, rather than on TTC track, if I've been following along at home correctly ... 4401 arrived June 17, 2013 on TTC property as prototype car only and own by BBD as noted above. A big different between being a prototype and production car. Why did it take until May 14, 2018 to shipped 4401 to had its welds fix and shipped to TB be rebuilt after that late 2019??? I expect the welds issue surface in 2017 and took sometime for BBD to come up with an action plan and to get TTC to sign off on the plan. The car could have been sent back to TB in 2014-2016 like 4400 that arrived September 29, 2012, sent back to TB in 2013 and return July 4, 2014. 4400 was shipped on September 07, 2018 for welds fixing and off loaded October 03, 2019 and reenter service November 21, 2019 4402 still needs its welds fix Just because 4401 has been on TTC property, it didn't comply with the contract and only will comply with the contract upon its arrival when every that is and in service. https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/bombardier-in-talks-to-combine-rail-unit-with-alstom-1.1377325 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smallspy Posted January 22, 2020 Report Share Posted January 22, 2020 7 hours ago, drum118 said: Just because 4401 has been on TTC property, it didn't comply with the contract and only will comply with the contract upon its arrival when every that is and in service. Without access to the contract, you have no idea whether this is true or not. None of us do. Dan 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfitz Posted January 22, 2020 Report Share Posted January 22, 2020 4 hours ago, smallspy said: Without access to the contract, you have no idea whether this is true or not. Or more particularly, the settlement agreement. 12 hours ago, drum118 said: I expect the welds issue surface in 2017 and took sometime for BBD to come up with an action plan and to get TTC to sign off on the plan. I thought we'd discussed the weld issue here long before 2017. TTC was reporting publicly on "manufacturing difficulties with weld processes in Sahagun, Mexico" at least as early as January 2016 - and it's inconceivable that it wasn't part of the October 2015 Board decision to commence a claim. Surely TTC was aware of welds issue much earlier than you claim it surfaced! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drum118 Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 4601 is now tracking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MK78 Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 On 1/21/2020 at 5:54 PM, crs1026 said: Actually, no. Repeating what I just posted to UT.... 4401 is still a Bombardier demonstrator. It has never been accepted by TTC. When 4603 is delivered and commissioned, TTC will have accepted 203 cars.... not 204 cars. Only when 4401 is finally ready for commercial service, will the order be complete.f 4401 has never carried a revenue passenger. Thanks for the clarification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TTC Guy Posted January 23, 2020 Report Share Posted January 23, 2020 4603 is at Lambton CP Yard 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLRV4094 Posted January 24, 2020 Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 4602 is out currently testing at Humber Loop signed onto 501 and eariler I saw 4600 at Long Branch for the first time. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttc rider Posted January 24, 2020 Report Share Posted January 24, 2020 Car 4603 was unloaded at Hillcrest this morning (i.e. Fri, Jan 24). Car 4436 was used to tow it off of CP's transporter. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drum118 Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 These would be great for 501, 504 and 510. Looks like they are going getting about 15 cars or less a year and already a year late. Zürich receives first new Flexity tram Should Bombardier build more streetcars for Toronto? Here's why one TTC board member says no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfitz Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 If Minnan-Wong says we shouldn't buy more, then clearly we should. Why is he always wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 2 hours ago, drum118 said: These would be great for 501, 504 and 510. Looks like they are going getting about 15 cars or less a year and already a year late. Zürich receives first new Flexity tram Should Bombardier build more streetcars for Toronto? Here's why one TTC board member says no It says they are late because the city council took longer for them to deliver. It doesn't mention that bombardier is at fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfitz Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 25 minutes ago, Shaun said: It says they are late because the city council took longer for them to deliver. It doesn't mention that bombardier is at fault. I'm not seeing that in the article. Which quotes Minnan-Wong as saying "Bombardier ... ... demonstrated that they cannot deliver on time" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T3G Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 19 minutes ago, nfitz said: I'm not seeing that in the article. Which quotes Minnan-Wong as saying "Bombardier ... ... demonstrated that they cannot deliver on time" I presume it was the Zurich article which was being referenced. 41 minutes ago, Shaun said: It says they are late because the city council took longer for them to deliver. It doesn't mention that bombardier is at fault. Which is not fully accurate. Even though it took eons to get the order off the ground, the cars should've still started delivery in late 2018 - if the article is correct: The new trams were tendered in 2011 but due to a disagreement with the city council they were not formally ordered until March 2017. The CHF358m (EUR325.5m) contract was placed in order to start replacing the Tram-2000 generation dating from 1976-87. Under the original timescale deliveries should have begun a year ago to be ready for the expansion of the network in 2019, instead of which VBZ has been struggling with a tram shortage, met in part by reinstating two Mirage cars from the heritage fleet into passenger service. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfitz Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 33 minutes ago, PCC Guy said: I presume it was the Zurich article which was being referenced. Ah, I looked at the other article. Hmm, that one doesn't even mention Toronto. The complete lack of context in some these posts makes them difficult to comprehend. If the focus of the post is the Zurich cars, then what has that got to do with Minnan-Wong - which was what was in the larger font? And hang on, they were ordered in 2017, and delivered in 2019? What has this got to do with Bombardier being late? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tramguy Posted January 26, 2020 Report Share Posted January 26, 2020 One man's opinion! Stricter oversight by TTC on Bombardier should remedy the challenge. By the time you mess around getting new quotes, (Alstom, Siemens et al) it will be 2026 by the time the 60 streatcars hit the streets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leylandvictory2 Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 7 hours ago, nfitz said: I'm not seeing that in the article. Which quotes Minnan-Wong as saying "Bombardier ... ... demonstrated that they cannot deliver on time" and Minnan-Wong was the guy who suggested TTC to buy BYD buses. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MK78 Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 13 hours ago, leylandvictory2 said: and Minnan-Wong was the guy who suggested TTC to buy BYD buses. And was dumbfounded when he learned that the BYD use a different charging infrastructure than the New Flyers & Proterras. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gil Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 4405 (? I know it ended in a 05) is now sitting at Lambton Yard as of this morning (around 9:15am). South side of the yard right next to the through tracks around Runnymede. Given its location, getting a photo of it may be tricky if you're not on a train passing the yard. I won't be riding the train home tonight, but if it's still there tomorrow (and I get a decent seat) I'll try and get a photo. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ttc rider Posted January 27, 2020 Report Share Posted January 27, 2020 On 1/26/2020 at 12:16 PM, nfitz said: If Minnan-Wong says we shouldn't buy more, then clearly we should. Why is he always wrong? He is not "wrong". His comments now simply align with many others he has made over the years and with his general, anti-transit attitude. Regardless of what Minnan-Wong is saying, I doubt we will see any contract for new streetcars signed with the current provincial administration at Queens Park. The fact that only 1/3 of the cost is funded by the City almost guarantees the project will languish and be put aside until after the next election cycle, long after Bombardier will close shop. I wouldn't be surprised if any streetcar purchase is put on hold indefinitely in favour of new electric buses. A similar situation to that in the 1990s, when the city lost its trolleybus network, and the CNG technology was the "green" hype of the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drum118 Posted January 28, 2020 Report Share Posted January 28, 2020 4601 is doing its first day of testing on 501 as an in service (501A), running between Bathurst and Neville. Left the yard just before 5 pm and currently eastbound at Kingston Rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Downsview34. Posted January 28, 2020 Report Share Posted January 28, 2020 Spotted 4603 testing on King around 6:40pm 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drum118 Posted January 28, 2020 Report Share Posted January 28, 2020 4603 is now tracking and out testing on Roncesvalles along with 4601 that is in the Roncesvalles Yard. 4406 was out in the yard yesterday and now back in the service bay Alstom's plan to acquire Bombardier's railway operations (Not Merger) Le projet d’Alstom pour racheter à Bombardier ses activités ferroviaires Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drum118 Posted January 30, 2020 Report Share Posted January 30, 2020 4602 has enter service on St Clair 512 after arriving January 17, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CLRV4094 Posted January 30, 2020 Report Share Posted January 30, 2020 8 hours ago, drum118 said: 4602 has enter service on St Clair 512 after arriving January 17, 2019 4602 is now on 504B. However it did enter service as a 512 tripper 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaun Posted January 30, 2020 Report Share Posted January 30, 2020 So if Bombardier goes under and is not able to merge with another company who will own the patents and technical knowledge of how to build more Flexity Streetcars? Will the TTC be able to tender the same cars with another manufacturer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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