General Route Discussion and History

[downbeat]

Glad to see transit using physical media to drum up engagement and public input for the forthcoming services changes. Apart from the sign attached to this bus stop near SAIT, I also saw a big sandwich board in the south bus bay at Lions Park station listing all the routes and encouraging people to leave comments.

 

[Transit Fan]

Noticed one of those this morning at NB 1 St @ 8 Ave SW where the 18 and 112 stop.

I guess they've learned some lessons from last year. Although, it makes you wonder if we would've ended up with anything different last year had there been a bigger emphasis on collecting feedback.

[downbeat]

The signs aren't perfect, though: The picture I took was at a stop for 19/65/105/414. The sign talks about changes in the southwest … it's not immediately obvious Route 414 is part of the proposed changes and the stop in question is clearly not in the southwest, so people might not pick up on what's going on.

[downbeat]

A transit employee at one of the in-person public engagement sessions had some neat insights into the thinking behind splitting Route 414 and extending service south to MRU and Garrison Green.

• The interlining of proposed Routes 141 and 51 is apparently an interim measure. It’s expected passenger volumes on Route 51 will eventually necessitate switching to standard-sized buses, at which point the routes will no longer interline.
• Due to street design at the northern terminus of Route 414/141, Transit must continue to use shuttles there.
• Once Currie Barracks is built up, Route 51 is meant to be rerouted to give coverage in that neighbourhood as well.

[downbeat]

According to this tweet, which includes a link to a PDF stored on Calgary Transit's website, there is a proposal to realign Routes 36 and 41 in the Ogden area starting in June. Frequency on those two routes would improve at peak hours, while Route 75 would also be discontinued at that time.

And here's the link to the PDF in the tweet:

http://www.calgarytransit.com/sites/default/files/content/PDF/ogden_riverbend_june2019.pdf

 

[Blake M]

19 minutes ago, downbeat said:

According to this tweet, which includes a link to a PDF stored on Calgary Transit's website, there is a proposal to realign Routes 36 and 41 in the Ogden area starting in June. Frequency on those two routes would improve at peak hours, while Route 75 would also be discontinued at that time.

And here's the link to the PDF in the tweet:

http://www.calgarytransit.com/sites/default/files/content/PDF/ogden_riverbend_june2019.pdf

 

I feel like it's still quite duplicated. 20A Street and 18 Street are still pretty close together. The 75 being cancelled will also anger quite a few. 

[Transit Fan]

Odd that they would just cancel the 75, it's a pretty well used route. A slight bump in frequency to the 36/41 during peak hours isn't going to make up for its cancellation. Connecting to the 24 isn't exactly ideal either and you can't transfer to the 302 or any of the other SE express routes from that area.

[downbeat]

We don’t know how final these plans are … just because a city councillor retweets something doesn’t make it automatically true. 

[Gsgeek540]

18 hours ago, downbeat said:

We don’t know how final these plans are … just because a city councillor retweets something doesn’t make it automatically true. 

Its already a done deal. Operators started signing up for their work this week and maps with the changes to the 36 and 41 are posted and the 75 is removed. Many of decisions are done 1-2 signups in advanced.

[downbeat]

1 hour ago, Gsgeek540 said:

Its already a done deal. […] Many of decisions are done 1-2 signups in advanced.

Ok, this is good to know. Thanks for confirming the realignments!

[Gsgeek540]

In addition, there is a new route (128) for Cornerstone and Redstone to offset the 145 that has minimal change.

[armorand]

On 5/11/2019 at 12:19 PM, Gsgeek540 said:

In addition, there is a new route (128) for Cornerstone and Redstone to offset the 145 that has minimal change.

It's too bad Google Maps is apparently completely stuck at least 3 years behind, on Calgary imagery... it still shows alot of undeveloped land, missing buildings and makes it hard for me to consider the scope of development. Not just for Calgary, but across Western Canada too (Winnipeg's is still stuck on at least 2015). Really annoys me... 

I was looking at the map though, whatever I could gather from the map portion of Google Maps versus satellite, and I thought this would beg the question: with the far NE developing so rapidly, both inside and outside Stoney (outside being considered as: Crossirons, Amazon, new (empty) mall, along with casinos and such):

Would (or has?) CT and Airdrie considered extra service? And if it isn't going to be like how it currently is (Airdrie ICE running as deep as Rundle), would there be any chance of transferring closer to Crossiron? Saddletowne, perhaps? Or maybe a Stoney Park and Ride service, kind of like what's about to commence in South Edmonton with their LRT extension (or their NE LRT extension, terminating in between built-up Edmonton and St. Albert),, where they build a P&R and shuttle buses from it to Saddletowne, and have a transfer point for ICE?

The area outside in Balzac must be driving up employment and commerce significantly (that or people must really like moving to the far North/NE, just to drive all the way to Downtown or the SE for employment), so I'm kind of wondering when it will actually turn into more service... seems like a great opportunity to get at least some form of transit connection in between Saddletowne, Crossiron and all the new suburbs in between, and create ridership for both the future LRT extension, AND for an employment area that's generating thousands of jobs for people inside city limits (and CT transit coverage). Max BRT, perhaps? Someone did mention that Route 23/52nd St would become a future MAX corridor, so maybe while waiting for LRT, a MAX route (or extension, MO extension north) may help in that regard, to boost ridership and provide that connection beyond Saddletowne, that might help the situation?  

[downbeat]

Major surgery done to the 2019 Route Review in West Calgary, according to new info posted on the engagement site.

https://engage.calgary.ca/routereview

Some of the links on the route review site are broken but I was able to parse one of them below. Comments collected during the engagement period have not been posted yet.

Briefly, what I've noticed so far:

• Proposed changes to Routes 93 and 414 have been cancelled.
• Existing routes 18, 47, 63, 107 and 112 are deleted.
• Proposed routes 45, 51, 132 and 141 are deleted.
• Route 13 (revised) runs to West Hills via 46 Ave. S.W. instead of Lakeview. Has better service span than current Route 13.
• Route 22 (new route, revised) runs through Marda Loop to city centre, duplicating a good chunk of Route 7.
• Route 66 (new route) connects Lakeview and city centre via Grey Eagle Blvd., Sarcee Road and Crowchild Trail. Has better service span in Lakeview than combination of existing routes. 

Revised proposed West Calgary map can be seen here. The old proposed map can be seen here.

There are charts for a few neighbourhoods explaining how the revised proposed changes are better now than before. I looked at the one for Lakeview and can't understand the information in the top left corner. EDIT: Never mind — I see now the travel times are relative to the starred locations on the inset map.

There are also three more open houses scheduled for June, according to the site.

[armorand]

Lakeview residents definitely won't be very pleased, having to transfer all the way at MRU and then waiting and taking even longer to get to Chinook... 

Other than that, definitely like West Hills being alot more accessible - its almost impossible to get to, in any speedy manner... minus owning a car, but then again, defeats the whole purpose of mass transit

[downbeat]

1 hour ago, armorand said:

Lakeview residents definitely won't be very pleased, having to transfer all the way at MRU and then waiting and taking even longer to get to Chinook... 

I wonder what they heard during the previous public engagement sessions? Maybe they learned riders wanted better connections to the west and toward city centre than to Chinook? Making people transfer at Sarcee Road MAX station to get to Chinook might be a compromise the transit planners settled on.

Looking at the map another way … The new proposed Route 66 is essentially a Lakeview branch of the MAX — they share the same trunk north of 33 Ave. S.W. If the point is to discourage people from using the CTrain Red Line, this routing might just do it.

Also: Better frequency all-round on the proposed Route 66 (compared to the existing Route 47) might possibly make up for the slightly longer travel time if travelling to Chinook.

[downbeat]

On 5/10/2019 at 4:07 PM, Gsgeek540 said:

Its already a done deal. Operators started signing up for their work this week and maps with the changes to the 36 and 41 are posted and the 75 is removed. Many of decisions are done 1-2 signups in advanced.

I noticed a sign regarding this has gone up at the bus shelter outside Suncor Energy Centre on 6 Ave. S.W. (Oddly, I don't think Route 75 stops there. Yes, it does stop there for a.m. drop-off only. Duh!)

The sign has a URL at the bottom — http://www.calgarytransit.com/summer2019 — and it leads to details about the route realignments in Ogden/Millican/Riverbend.

[downbeat]

10 hours ago, downbeat said:

Major surgery done to the 2019 Route Review in West Calgary, according to new info posted on the engagement site.

https://engage.calgary.ca/routereview

[…]

Briefly, what I've noticed so far:

• […] Route 22 (new route, revised) runs through Marda Loop to city centre, duplicating a good chunk of Route 7.

I see now in one of the slides the proposed Route 22 will operate like Route 107 east of 20 St. S.W. The same slide shows Route 13 realigned slightly to allow for connections with Route 7 and 22.

[downbeat]

Well, it looks like the revised information for the 2019 service review wasn’t meant to go live so soon. If you go to the engagement site now, it says: “Check back starting the week of June 3, 2019 to see the revised proposed routes, and provide your input.”

The stuff I linked to above still works (for now) … I guess we’ll have to wait for the info to go live again to see all the slides containing the revisions to the new proposed bus service in west Calgary.

[downbeat]

More signage inviting public feedback on the amendments to the proposed bus service changes. 

[Transit Fan]

I think I prefer some of these latest changes more than what was originally proposed. However, there really isn't any way of making everyone happy.

A few things I like:

• The 13 is back to being similar to its current route
• 112 is kind of back as the 66 but only if you're east is 37 St SW. Unfortunately, the 13 as a direct bus won't be nearly as fast the 112 for those on 46 Ave SW.
• Extension of 93 to Chinook cancelled (this was never gonna be a good substitute for the 47 and would've made the route less reliable)
• An all-day version of the 107 for those north of 33 Ave. Although not too good for those along 20 St SW.

Unfortunately, for Lakeview, that neighborhood is really in such a weird location that makes it difficult to plan a good route for it. For those travelling east, anything that doesn't go down Glenmore directly is going to be vastly inferior. However, I do feel that the proposed 66 gives them more connection opportunities. Kind of direct access to MRU, 13 to Westhills, MT to Blue line or south to Heritage or beyond, 9 to Chinook or north to Blue line and beyond. It's definitely a bit slower if you're going east but at least you're transferring at a heated MAX shelter on a much quieter and safer road compared to Crowchild.

[Transit Fan]

Saw there was a notice about the Route 75 discontinuation at 12th St in Inglewood this morning. We'll probably see them popping up at all 75 stops this week if they're not already up.

[downbeat]

1 hour ago, Transit Fan said:

Saw there was a notice about the Route 75 discontinuation at 12th St in Inglewood this morning. We'll probably see them popping up at all 75 stops this week if they're not already up.

I suspect you are right. Saw those for the first time last Friday. 

[downbeat]

Not sure if this is the right topic … but if I’m reading Transit55’s live map properly, 8240 and 8266* are currently doing fill trips on Route 1. 

I guess the delays are bad … here’s a Route 1 bus going EB on 16th Ave N near Centre Street!

And there’s another one going WB on Memorial Drive. 

*P.S.: I actually saw passengers aboard 8266 going eastbound through Kensington. All of the bus signage said “OFF” however.

[downbeat]

On 5/27/2019 at 11:14 AM, downbeat said:

Well, it looks like the revised information for the 2019 service review wasn’t meant to go live so soon. If you go to the engagement site now, it says: “Check back starting the week of June 3, 2019 to see the revised proposed routes, and provide your input.”

The revisions to proposed transit modifications in West Calgary are now visible again. The links that were broken before look like they've been fixed, so a few more slides explaining the changes to the changes are now visible.

[downbeat]

I see (yet another!) detour for Route 90 coming … ramp from westbound 10 Ave SW to northbound Crowchild closing for two weeks.

https://newsroom.calgary.ca/upcoming-major-traffic-impact-as-part-of-the-crowchild-trail-upgrades-project/