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Thanks "School Bus 101" for finding that. Here's some of my thoughts:

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the route 20 will be rerouted to follow the 72/73 route from Crowchild to Craigie Hall. It will also no longer go through Brentwood.

Not sure I like the idea of the 20 bypassing Brentwood station. Also, people that currently use the 20 to access Foothills will lose out on the direct connection.

The 72/73 will be eliminated, and the route 38 will replace the 72/73 from Rundle to Craigie Hall.

I think they meant to say Whitehorn? I initially assumed it'd just go to Brentwood. To get to Craigie Hall would mean overlapping with the 9/20 or via ACH the same way the current 72/73.

The 31 will be extended to Lions Park along the current 19 routing. The 19 will terminate at Lions Park.

I had a feeling the 19 would end at Lions Park.

The 104 will also be extended to Craigie Hall from the FMC.

Straight-forward enough; makes sense to provide the connection to UofC.

The route 8 will be extended along the current route 91 to terminate at the FMC (I am personally concerned about overcrowding on this route). The route 91 will be retired.

The BRT kinda goes this same route but I suppose this is intended to cover the non-express stops? A bit of overlap with the 38 depending on how that works though.

The route 9 will be extended to follow the current route 20 from Craigie Hall to Crowchild, and will then follow the current 72/73 routing to Chinook (I am again concerned about overcrowding on this route with the change.).

Kind of like how existing 20 users would lose direct access to Foothills. Current 72/73 users now lose direct access to ACH.

Personally, I think the changes are good overall, but that the change to the 8 and 9 should be flipped (it will make more sense when the maps are released) and the 8 served with an articulated bus. Most people get on or off in the NW-HUB area, so it makes more sense, in my opinion, to connect the SW with the ACH and West Campus via the FMC, rather than the north.

From the above changes, I also think we could use a single route that connects from the SW (preferably at some major hubs like Westbrook and/or MRU) to the Foothills, University, ACH and probably Brentwood. Thinking about it, if only the South Crosstown could bridge the gap between Westbrook and Foothills, it could then follow the same route as the North Crosstown at 16th and make those exact connections.

 

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From the map i saw the route 9 would still go to Foothills, then to Chinook. I will try getting a picture of the map today.

Irrelevant but hey why not: id like to see a bus that goes from Westbrook or 69 street or westhills to Crowfoot or Tuscany

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The full set of bus changes are available now!

https://engage.calgary.ca/BusReview

Had a chance of look over some of the proposals, things that immediately caught my eye:

  • 23 is Saddletowne - Mckenzie Towne via the entire length of 52 Street
  • Many routes now doing a clockwise loop around Marlborough mall. Going to be a very busy hub for connections.
  • They use SE, SX and NX in many pages but then one page lists new routes 303 and 307. I assume they'll use the route numbers but could buses display letters instead of a route number?
  • SX is only 25 minutes peak and off-peak.
  • NX is 15 min peak and 20-30 off-peak.
  • 1 and SE share the transitway and both no longer use 7th Ave downtown. SE is limited stops in Inglewood + extended to East Hills. 1 looks to be all stops in Inglewood, limited stops on the transitway and then turns off into Penbrooke. 440 stays intact and still peak-hour only. The 87 (Applewood) is supposedly going to serve all local stops along 17th east of 36 St and then turns north on 36 St to Marlborough. Not a very big fan of this. They're not fixing the route duplication with the 1/305 at all. :( 
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On 4/13/2018 at 7:36 PM, DarkKeyo said:

The engage page got taken down sometime between now and when that link was posted. I guess it was still to early

The page looks to be back up now since today is the official start date of when they're supposed to start taking online feedback.

My main concerns are:

  • Expected frequency of the South Crosstown is way too low. 25 minutes during peak, seriously?
  • Way too much service overlap on 17th Ave with the 1, SE and 87.
  • All of the industrial routes seem to connect to the Red Line and/or deep SE (east-west direction) now. Outside of the 23 and the 43, people working industrial jobs in the NE and East seem to be worse off now. From 52 St, to get to say 36th or Marlborough, you need a transfer now. Although I guess it's faster for those further north along 52 St.
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Oh also in June, routes 412 and 452 will be replaced by route 111, with route 456 changing to 156 and a new route 164

1 hour ago, Transit Fan said:

The page looks to be back up now since today is the official start date of when they're supposed to start taking online feedback.

My main concerns are:

  • Expected frequency of the South Crosstown is way too low. 25 minutes during peak, seriously?
  • Way too much service overlap on 17th Ave with the 1, SE and 87.
  • All of the industrial routes seem to connect to the Red Line and/or deep SE (east-west direction) now. Outside of the 23 and the 43, people working industrial jobs in the NE and East seem to be worse off now. From 52 St, to get to say 36th or Marlborough, you need a transfer now. Although I guess it's faster for those further north along 52 St.

The website sucks. I can't view the maps properly

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  • 2 weeks later...

Had a chance to visit last night's bus review open house.

A few things I picked up regarding certain changes:

  • They're aware of the low frequency on the SX; appears to be more of an issue with lack of funding rather than not wanting to up the frequency.
  • Intention behind having both the 1 and SE overlap is to have a branch route where the 1 is able to connect the areas north of 17 Ave to the transitway. While East Hills should help the BRT gain some additional ridership east of 52nd St, it's probably not enough to the point where the BRT could run by itself at super high frequencies. I remain skeptical since there might just be too much overlap still but they seem to have high hopes that the dedicated transitway will be encouraging a lot more ridership.
  • East Hills terminal will be located on the side street just north of the Walmart and south of the traffic circle. Currently, there's not really much there adjacent to it and it'll be a few minutes walk to places like the Costco. It's supposed to be a more central location once the area is more developed however.
  • Moving towards more of a grid network which explains why all the industrial routes are now travelling east-west. Also why routes like the 43 and 23 are sticking to their respective main roads (36 St and 52 St) rather than jumping back and forth between the two like the existing 23/72/73 do.
  • New 23 will be one of the straightest (if not the straightest) crosstown routes in the city with the only turns being the bus loops at the two ends.
  • Expected launch of new BRT routes and accompanying network changes is expected to be sometime in November.
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1 hour ago, Transit Fan said:

 

  • Moving towards more of a grid network which explains why all the industrial routes are now travelling east-west. Also why routes like the 43 and 23 are sticking to their respective main roads (36 St and 52 St) rather than jumping back and forth between the two like the existing 23/72/73 do.

I wish I could visit an open house to chat about the idea of grid networks, because Calgary is missing two of the things that usually makes them successful. One is frequency on those routes. The other is that major destinations are close enough to the grid that having routes on the grid doesn't involve missing the destinations by several blocks. I'm not sure I could explain that using just the feedback forms. 

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Popped by tonight's open house with @vicinity who might have more to add. Most of our major concerns and questions have already been covered in @Transit Fan's excellent post above but there are a few things to add:

  • "NX", "SX", and "SE" are placeholders. They have a team specifically working on the branding of the routes right now.
  • Once the SW BRT launches, they're hoping to revisit the frequency of the SX and hopefully be able to increase it. 'About a year'. They seemed quite aware 25 minute headways are not ideal.
  • The reason for the November launch is they're waiting for the 17 Ave SE transitway to be finished; they can't launch the network in separate pieces.
  • They'd like to have a BRT station WB 16 Ave @ 19 St NW but were having trouble getting enough land for it to work. Longer term plan is still to get one put in there somehow.
  • Might be some temporary routing around Foothills until some of the construction wraps up.

I get the sense they truly want as much feedback as they can get, wouldn't hesitate to send anything and everything in.

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I noticed there wasn't very many people at the open house yesterday. Not sure if they've all been like that but there was a handful of people trickling in and taking a look. I think the limited and random time slots isn't helping. They've been tweeting quite often about the engage site (and the open houses) so that definitely helps gives some awareness. Also, nearly every bus i've been on in the last week has had a poster up front regarding the bus changes. Given the scale of the proposed changes, I really hope enough people are made aware of the changes and are able to give feedback. One of my suggestions was to consider heading out to major hubs and putting up some of those display posters or even just being there and handing out info sheets with a map and a link to the engage site.

They did seem to appreciate even some of the minor details I was pointing out about certain routes. Like how the 17 Ave @ 68 St SE intersection needs a crosswalk and sidewalk on the south side before they even think of moving the BRT stop there. Or how the 1 would need to exit the transitway before approaching 52nd St in order to safely make the left turn onto NB 52nd without the intersection requiring an extra dedicated signal for it to turn.

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It's unfortunate (while completely understandable) the changes/BRT implementation won't go into effect until November. A September start-date would have been ideal because of the new semester starting in September for both MRU, SAIT and U of C.
Big changes halfway through the semester can add on more stress for students. That being said, it seems like CT and the City is doing an amazing job marketing the changes along with community involvement.

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Hopefully the weather cooperates this summer and the 17 Ave SE transitway can be completed by November. Construction just started ramping up this past week and there is still a ton of work to be done.

Many sidewalks are still incomplete even though the adjacent roadway has been built. As such, a few bus stops are currently just dirt and gravel. On most the avenue, they've only started work on one side so there's still the other side plus the median along with stations that needs to be done this year.

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  • 1 month later...

The engage site has stopped taking input since the 18th. Updates on the 2018 service review based on feedback should be expected before the end of June.

Do you guys expect there to be much difference from what was proposed?

One of the things they mentioned at the open house was how very little needed to changed for the 2016 NW service review. I wonder if it'll be the same this time around.

Keep in mind that the changes this time are affecting a much larger area of the city with many crosstowns and longstanding routes are being revised.

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2 hours ago, yvarushin said:

I’m not going to hold my breath but I hope they increase the SX BRT frequency from 25 to 10 (at least during peak hours) minutes like they originally proposed.

Yeah, I wouldn't count on that happening. They seemed well aware of the SX frequencies (or lack thereof) at the open houses already.

The main feedback they seemed to be looking for were things related to the design of the routes themselves.

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  • 4 weeks later...

All route 111 stops now have their stop numbers and route information decals, except for one, on 85th Street just south of 8th Avenue SW (stop number 3719) due to a closed sidewalk.  The stop numbers and route information decals were installed sometime between 12:15pm and 2:45pm today.

The sign for stop number #8885 which ran for the 452 has been taken down. 

IMG_8292.JPG

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  • 2 weeks later...

The engage page is currently being modified with feedback summary and new changes.

Some highlights:

SX increased to 20 min frequency weekdays

Route 90 extended to Foothills and UofC

Route 91 maintained between Lions Park and Foothills

Route 68 - Crosstown from Saddletowne to East Hills via 64 Ave, 68 St, 17 Ave

181 and 182 cancelled

131 replaced with 155. Restores service to 26 Ave se and adds new routing along 17 ave se between 44 st and 52 st se.

Decided on 1 and SE stops downtown. SE stops at 61 and 70 St instead of 60 and 68 St

 

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The most common concern among multiple routes seem related to the new grid system of routes and people requiring additional transfers. A few smaller streets will now be under-served compared to the existing network due to the bigger focus of having more service along the main roads of the grid. There is also dissatisfaction with the removal of 66, 125, 126, 176 express services due to needing transfers to complete the trip.

The Foothills hospital crowd was by far the most vocal and there seems to be a lot of dissatisfaction with the re-routing of the 20 away from the hospital. The initial proposal to remove the 91 combined with the fact that the NX only stops on 16th Ave thus requiring a long walk to both Lions Park and the hospital was also a tough sell as well.

 

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