OC Transpo to crack down on idling buses to cut waste

[MAX BRT]

OC Transpo to crack down on idling buses to cut waste

Read more: http://www.ottawacit...l#ixzz1vF9qXijJ

. . .Diesel is the lifeblood of the transit system, though, and efforts to conserve it touch on practically everything OC Transpo does, from planning routes to maintaining buses to trying to manage the behaviour of drivers - with whom managers have had a difficult relationship.

The transit service was $750,000 over its budget in the first quarter, with fuel accounting for $400,000 of that overrun. The situation is actually slightly worse than that: a report to the commission says consumption for the quarter was more like $500,000 over the $10.4-million diesel budget, but OC Transpo lucked out a bit with prices that were slightly lower than forecast.

OC Transpo also has the advantage of a relatively new fleet of buses. "A new fleet generally means you're consuming at reasonable rates," Manconi told transit commissioners. The bad news is the situation is sure to get worse as the city's hundreds of recently purchased buses age.

One thing to try is turning off buses when they're not in use. In cold weather, older diesel engines often needed to be left running - even overnight - in case they couldn't be started again, but that's less often the case now. It may even make sense to assign workers at night to turn off the engines of buses growling away in the dark of a night that's not as cold as forecast, Manconi said.

Bus drivers also need to turn off buses if they have pauses between runs, Manconi said, unless there's a specific good reason to do otherwise. . .

An additional challenge is trying to make the most of OC Transpo's hybrid buses, which have saved fuel but not nearly as much as they were supposed to. They're too often put on routes that don't take advantage of diesel-and-electric engines' strong point, which is dealing with a lot of stopping and starting.

That's partly a consequence of tight "interlining" - the practice of having one bus change routes repeatedly in the course of a day, depending where it's needed. Manconi's predecessor Alain Mercier favoured it as a way of minimizing the number of buses (and expensive drivers) on the street, but interlining makes it hard to keep hybrids on hybrid-friendly routes. It also contributes to more "deadheading," when an empty, out-of-service bus gets driven from the end of one route to the start of another in a different place.

Both are being reviewed by a joint committee of managers and union members, Manconi promised, whose mission is to improve service and conditions for drivers while sticking to OC Transpo's budget.

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I wish OC Transpo success in this endeavor. I dislike waste. Anyone know of other TAs where this is being addressed?

I'm also curious about the challenge of making best use of the hybrids (in this case Orion's with BAE 2nd generation propulsion, correct?)

[A. Wong]

ETS and I'm pretty sure Strathcona County Transit and St Albert Transit have anti-idling policies where the engine should be shut down if there is a long layover, like at a terminal, and the weather is not overly cold.

Shutting down an engine immediately after stopping (without a proper cool-down period) might cause some mechanical damage in the long run though.

[Ramirez]

There are bus stops throughout the Los Angeles County area telling operators to turn off their engine when they are on "layover", although I do not know how much natural gas is wasted while idling...

Example:

Line 246: Artesia Transit Center

On the bottom of the bus sign it says:

Turn off engine per rule 2.16

I'll try to get a picture so you guys get what I mean if you're confused about what I said

[323 Surrey Ctrl Stn]

Coast Mountain Bus Company/Translink implemented this a few years ago. I don't know the actual numbers but the savings did add up!

Chris Cassidy

[Megabus Rider]

I though the engines were programed to shut down after like 10-15 minutes of being on idle except if on fast idle. This is common on Motor Coaches.

[general682002]

Coast Mountain Bus Company/Translink implemented this a few years ago. I don't know the actual numbers but the savings did add up!

Chris Cassidy

More than few years ago, at least more than a decades.

The CNG is a different story, their sticker from the dashboard says run the bus idle for 2 minutes before shutting it down. The reason is because of the CNG engines are very hot!

[Megabus Rider]

More than few years ago, at least more than a decades.

The CNG is a different story, their sticker from the dashboard says run the bus idle for 2 minutes before shutting it down. The reason is because of the CNG engines are very hot!

CNG Engines have higher compression ratio than it's regular gas engine counterpart, you would have to do the same thing with diesel engines, usually there is a decal to advise on how long to run it.

[Halifax_Route10]

Metro Transit has a no-idling policy as well. If it's not cold outside, and the driver thinks they'll be idling for more than three minutes, they have to kill the engine.

[Bus_Medic]

CNG Engines have higher compression ratio than it's regular gas engine counterpart, you would have to do the same thing with diesel engines, usually there is a decal to advise on how long to run it.

Mostly to cool off the turbo.

If the engine is shut down right away and the turbo is screaming hot, the residual engine oil left in the impeller shaft bearings can 'cook' and leave abrasive deposits on the shaft itself, leading to damage over time.

Also excessive heat from the heads and cylinder liners takes several minutes to work its way into the coolant and be expelled in the radiator. Shutting down the engine immediately after a long highway burn obviously stops the water pump and rad fan, trapping it in the block.

Google "heat soaking" to see what I mean.

For both these reasons, idling or high idling for a few minutes before shutting down is a good idea. Ideally it's best to shut down from low idle, that way the turbo freewheels for less time after the oil pressure drops off.

[Ramirez]

There are bus stops throughout the Los Angeles County area telling operators to turn off their engine when they are on "layover", although I do not know how much natural gas is wasted while idling...

Example:

Line 246: Artesia Transit Center

On the bottom of the bus sign it says:

Turn off engine per rule 2.15

I'll try to get a picture so you guys get what I mean if you're confused about what I said

Any other TA that has something similar to this on their bus stops?

[kadooment95]

I remember OC having stickers on the dashes of the MCI Classics, and pretty much everything after that until Orion VI's

I have a pic of the sticker, but can't figure out how to attach it.

Goes like this though.

Engine Idling Procedures

On hot days (above 25C)

- If waiting period is more than 10 mins, idle for 3 mins then shut down

- if waiting period is less than 10 mins, remain idling

On cold days (below -5c) remain idling

On other days idle 1 minute, then shut down.

All in all this makes sense, and its what I do with the trucks at work. They've had this policy for years now, but no one sticks to it at all.

[MCIBUS]

The only issue with shutting down for more then 10 mins espically like it will be this wekend the bus gets hot and when it comes to the stop to pick up passengers the bus is still hot even with the A/C running people wil open the windows.

[Megabus Rider]

The only issue with shutting down for more then 10 mins espically like it will be this wekend the bus gets hot and when it comes to the stop to pick up passengers the bus is still hot even with the A/C running people wil open the windows.

There should be an exception during Smog alerts or the driver will be doing CPR all day! That's no joke cuz thats when heat strokes are on the rise!

[MAX BRT]

Good point. It gets complicated when its hot or cold.

It sounds like all TAs have had idling policies for years, I can't imagine OC transpo does not already have one.

Maybe a lot of drivers ignore it though.

The issue seems to be what happens when the buses are not in use. Sounds like buses run all night when its cold! Thats gotta be thousands of dollars up in smoke. Geez, there has got to be a better way. Pay someone to go around with a battery charger?

[MCIBUS]

The issue of running buses al night is that Ottawa can get quite cold in the winter nights.

And though OC has Merivale,Pinecrest, ST Laurent North & South, there isn't enough space to park inside al the buses out of those garages.

St Laurent does have 'plug In Station" but it can onkly handle so many buses(not sure of how many.

And though industrial is the newest Garage it has limited indoor parking(I believe this parking is designed for maintaince or waiting buses to be fixed. Industruial to has a "Plug In station" as to how many I'm not sure.

The problem here compared to Toronto or Vancouver is Ottawa getrs way colder in all reality there should of built Industrial to store all the buses stored their inside.

I'm not sure how well these "plug In stations" actually work, but if they work well then OC should at least expand the ones at St Laurent to accomidate all the ones stored outside. I"m not exactly sure which bus models can be pluged into these stations thought?

[M.Wright]

And though industrial is the newest Garage it has limited indoor parking(I believe this parking is designed for maintaince or waiting buses to be fixed. Industruial to has a "Plug In station" as to how many I'm not sure.

I was never 100% clear on how exactly these plug in stations work, but my understanding was that all they do is turn on the WABSCO heater and circulate the coolant while plugged in, therefore they are still consuming diesel, but at a reduced volume, of I think it was 1 litre per hour, but mind you Industrial stores about 250 articulated buses, so thats about 250 litres per hour, with the vehicles going nowhere, for hours on end, since this is where they are stored.

Also you are correct, the only buses parked on the inside are buses awaiting servicing, this is because they can have all the snow melt off of them prior to being put on an hoist so the mechanic doesn't have melting snow dripping onto him while working on the bus.

The problem here compared to Toronto or Vancouver is Ottawa getrs way colder in all reality there should of built Industrial to store all the buses stored their inside.

I'm not sure how well these "plug In stations" actually work, but if they work well then OC should at least expand the ones at St Laurent to accomidate all the ones stored outside.

Most of the people at Industrial do agree with that thought that they should of built the entire garage indoors to start with, instead of this outdoor parking, as this plug in system doesn't exactly work very well. Not to mention they are required at Industrial to idle the bus for a full hour before the bus goes into service, and by idle I mean with the bus running, not the plug in system.

Most of the fuel is probably wasted from the activities that goes on at Industrial Garage, due to the lack of indoor parking. But keep in mind that Industrial Garage was an Alain Mercier project.

But another cause of this is the amount of deadheading that is caused by all the interlining activities that OC does, which is mentioned in that article. If anything the only runs that should be doing major interlining is the rush hour tripper runs, for obvious reasons. Not to mention that all buses from Merivale and Pinecrest must be transferred to Industrial or St. Laurent for servicing, which sounds like they are going to resolve this soon. That's more fuel wasted.

There are lots of things OC can do other then crack down on idling to reduce fuel consumption.

[MCIBUS]

I'm not sure how OC schedules their runs or what bus goes on what route, or what bus is out of what garage or interlineing is done, but if the issue of the Orion VII's aren't meeting the expectations, then stop putting them on routes like express runs. Put them on all local(100's), cross town routes(1,2,7 etc) and put the inmvero's & Orion Vi's on express runs.I see it all the time. A Invero omn a troute 8 will a express run has a Orion VII. The route 8 should have that Orion VII and the Express should have the Invero.

As for storing the Buses outside, I'm not sure when the DD Buses stat arriving this Sept, won't help any. After alll there to tall to fit in Merivale,Pinecrest,ST. Laurent N & S(except for the repair bays I think not sure about that). In anycase one problem is how OC does its scheduling on what route a certain bus should go on?

[M.Wright]

I'm not sure how OC schedules their runs or what bus goes on what route, or what bus is out of what garage or interlineing is done, but if the issue of the Orion VII's aren't meeting the expectations, then stop putting them on routes like express runs. Put them on all local(100's), cross town routes(1,2,7 etc) and put the inmvero's & Orion Vi's on express runs.I see it all the time. A Invero omn a troute 8 will a express run has a Orion VII. The route 8 should have that Orion VII and the Express should have the Invero.

As for storing the Buses outside, I'm not sure when the DD Buses stat arriving this Sept, won't help any. After alll there to tall to fit in Merivale,Pinecrest,ST. Laurent N & S(except for the repair bays I think not sure about that). In anycase one problem is how OC does its scheduling on what route a certain bus should go on?

Well incase you didn't know, OC has a designated type of bus for each specific run, which is shown to the dispatcher when he types in the run number of the operator who is requesting a bus assignment. However I don't know the specific run assignments, but they should be better placed, as we do have a system to make sure they are placed on better runs (like route 8 instead of the express).

Same system will be in effect for the Double Decker, however since now the height restrictions won't be as strict (due to the fact MTO classified them as a regular transit bus), I assume the placement of them won't be as strict either. This means there is a chance of us seeing them on runs they generally aren't supposed to be on. But seeing as the height is now as high as a truck, seeing as trucks generally go anywhere in this city (as moving trucks always need to go down the smallest streets), the double deckers should be fine too.