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Denis T

Y-U-S line becoming too long?

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To be honest, it would probably be easier to just knock down the temporary walls and convert the Sheppard subway to TRs rather than to make room for heavy work on the Sheppard T1's at Wilson or the future Richmond Hill yard.

Thing is Steve Munro reckons there are now more T1s than are needed for BD so that would create even more spares.

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Thing is Steve Munro reckons there are now more T1s than are needed for BD so that would create even more spares.

True, but spares sitting in a yard don't cost that much money compared to setting up additional facilities in Richmond Hill or Wilson just for the Sheppard T1s.

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Someone correct me, but are trains allowed to go "full speed" through platforms even though the stations are closed?

i wouldn't think so because of that very tiny gap that exists between the train and the platform, so any lateral motion caused (i.e coming out of a turn or a sation that is on a curve) will cause contact between the two.

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i wouldn't think so because of that very tiny gap that exists between the train and the platform, so any lateral motion caused (i.e coming out of a turn or a sation that is on a curve) will cause contact between the two.

They are, but only in very, very specific cases. Deadheading trains which pass in-service stations are not.

Dan

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Someone correct me, but are trains allowed to go "full speed" through platforms even though the stations are closed?

No, trains when deadheading through stations, or bypassing for whatever reason, are not allowed through at full speed at any time. On Sheppard, the station timing enforces it. 25km/h or less.

They are, but only in very, very specific cases. Deadheading trains which pass in-service stations are not.

Dan

No way at any time. 25km/h maximum through stations when bypassing for any reason, in service or not, work car or passenger. What is the very specific case that you are thinking of Dan?

i wouldn't think so because of that very tiny gap that exists between the train and the platform, so any lateral motion caused (i.e coming out of a turn or a sation that is on a curve) will cause contact between the two.

Not because of the gap either, because the trains enter some stations at 75km/h or more.

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No way at any time. 25km/h maximum through stations when bypassing for any reason, in service or not, work car or passenger. What is the very specific case that you are thinking of Dan?

After the stabbing of Jimmy Trajceski in 1995, Victoria Park Station was closed for a number of days as the investigations were wrapped up. Trains travelled through the empty platforms at track speed, and certainly not at 25km/h.

Dan

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After the stabbing of Jimmy Trajceski in 1995, Victoria Park Station was closed for a number of days as the investigations were wrapped up. Trains travelled through the empty platforms at track speed, and certainly not at 25km/h.

Dan

Some people drive 130km/h on the 401 and the speed limit is 100km/h.

Some people get caught by police, some people do it every day and get away with it.

Back on topic... York Region doesn't deserve a subway, even if they are funding part of it. The density of Vaughan is too low and the land around the new subway line is already partially developed. A subway to a Walmart store and an expansive parking lot is all this is. If it weren't for political interference this city (Toronto) might actually get the subway and LRT network that it deserves, DRL anyone? All York Region should get is increased GO service.

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After the stabbing of Jimmy Trajceski in 1995, Victoria Park Station was closed for a number of days as the investigations were wrapped up. Trains travelled through the empty platforms at track speed, and certainly not at 25km/h.

Dan

Like BBC 9197 pointed out, what people are supposed to do and what people actually do are often two different things. 25km/h max through the station when bypassing for deadhead or otherwise.

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1 hour ago, Streety McCarface said:

I think the Yonge Line and the University-Spadina line should be numbered and coloured differently, but still run the same service as is, without requiring a transfer at Union Station. 

Why? What would that accomplish other than further confusing an already confused public? 

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Just now, eja2k said:

Why? What would that accomplish other than further confusing an already confused public? 

In all honesty, I'd be much less confused. I'd know the colour differentiations between the two lines and would be able to use them accordingly. Every time I look at a map, it takes me a minute to figure out whether I should go to the Yonge side or the University-Spadina side. 

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On 8/26/2016 at 12:16 AM, nfitz said:

Why resurrect a 4-year old thread to make an inane comment?

It's been 4 years, time for another bump... 

If the extension to Richmond Hill Centre does eventually go ahead, assuming the destination is downtown, would the cheaper TTC fare outweigh the faster travel via GO (provided they increase their frequencies)?  I can't imagine riding the majority of the Yonge Line especially during rush hour!

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40 minutes ago, Gil said:

It's been 4 years, time for another bump... 

If the extension to Richmond Hill Centre does eventually go ahead, assuming the destination is downtown, would the cheaper TTC fare outweigh the faster travel via GO (provided they increase their frequencies)?  I can't imagine riding the majority of the Yonge Line especially during rush hour!

Last time I checked, the travel time from Richmond Hill Centre on the subway would be about a minute or two slower than the subway. But far less waiting for a train, with trains every couple of minutes at peak, compared to long waits.

Surely anyone travelling to any station on Yonge, they'll be riding this line. And many using Union as well - even if the fare was the same.

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Union theoretically should be an interchange station that splits the two sides of Line 1. But unfortunately due to the surroundings, they cannot build another platform that supports 2 rails horizontally to the existing platform nor can they build a platform under the existing one.

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It always was too long. They should have built the old plan and closed the loop at Steeles to allow both directions to operate independently or split the line at Union. Then choose some light metro technology (like what's being planned for OL) for two legs to Vaughan and Yonge North. This would allow subways to extend further north cheaper.

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There might be unbalanced directional demand. Everyone from York Region taking the subway south in the morning because they can get a seat. Then taking the GO train back north in the evening, because the northbound subway is crush-loaded by Queen, if not King or Union.

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11 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

It always was too long. They should have built the old plan and closed the loop at Steeles to allow both directions to operate independently or split the line at Union. Then choose some light metro technology (like what's being planned for OL) for two legs to Vaughan and Yonge North. This would allow subways to extend further north cheaper.

If the loop was created, can the clockwise trains operate totally independently from the counter clockwise trains?

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1 hour ago, Orion V said:

If the loop was created, can the clockwise trains operate totally independently from the counter clockwise trains?

Yes and no. Under normal operation there would be little interaction between the CW and CCW loops. Even if there was a minor delay on one train, such as a medical delay, one side would get held but the other can continue. However, major delays such as ones requiring power to be cut to the track would affect both directions. 

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1 hour ago, Orion V said:

If the loop was created, can the clockwise trains operate totally independently from the counter clockwise trains?

In mechanical problem events, yes but they'll also have to isolate power between the two directions. It'll reduce gaps as delays due to people holding up doors. It'll reduce the daily backlog at terminals which wouldn't exist with a loop.

These delays seem get wider as the line is extended longer.

Security and priority one incidents would still need a full shutdown regardless if they can cut the power in one direction or not.

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Then it seems splitting the line at Union to be a transfer station seems to be better than running it as a loop; from an operating perspective.

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Going southbound In the morning it's standing room only when the train gets to Sheppard.  So when this extension is built how are people south of Finch going to get on the train ? 

More express trains go trains from Langstaff would be useful to prevent overcrowding. 

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1 hour ago, Shaun said:

Going southbound In the morning it's standing room only when the train gets to Sheppard.  So when this extension is built how are people south of Finch going to get on the train ? 

More express trains go trains from Langstaff would be useful to prevent overcrowding. 

Covid19 might have helped this situation by starting to make more people work from home, work away from the financial district or with staggered start times. It might not be as bad as we thought it will be in 2030.

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20 hours ago, Orion V said:

Then it seems splitting the line at Union to be a transfer station seems to be better than running it as a loop; from an operating perspective.

Yes and no.

 

No because in its current configuration, it would force wider headways on both halves of the current line. And rebuilding the station to enable efficient turn-back operations would likely cost in the realm of a new line downtown.

 

But yes because the ridership levels are different between the two halves, and it would be as logical a place as any to split the services.

 

Dan

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2 hours ago, smallspy said:

Yes and no.

 

No because in its current configuration, it would force wider headways on both halves of the current line. And rebuilding the station to enable efficient turn-back operations would likely cost in the realm of a new line downtown.

 

But yes because the ridership levels are different between the two halves, and it would be as logical a place as any to split the services.

 

Dan

Would it be faster to turn trains around at St Andrew and have an empty train pick up passengers at Union and then head to Finch? 

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