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Which TTC route branches do you think should turn into a new route themselves?


Goldeneye

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TTC should introduce a new 57 bus route just for elementary & secondary students that go to Jean Vanier CSS.Too crowded during morning/afternoon rush!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:o

As i use to live right behind Jean Vanier CSS its a easy walk to Eglinton Av so theres no need for a separate route for this school. Hunters Glen on the other hand could use a school special branch of the 21 Brimley.

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  • 1 month later...
One of those routes based on discussion that may be such a candidate would be current 91/91C/91F Woodbine to something like 93 Underhill and make the 91A the only 91 Woodbine service, based on schedule adherence and possibly due to the fact that the 91A is the only real Woodbine service whereas the 91/91C/91F operate farther north to York Mills and Woodbine Avenue isn't a very long street.

Woodbine Avenue today is split into two sections, the section south of O'Connor and the section north of Steeles. The section of Woodbine Avenue between O'Connor and Steeles was replaced by the Don Valley Parkway and Highway 404 in the 60's and 70's. So it was a fairly long street (excluding the York Region section), taking you from all the way from Steeles Avenue down to Lakeshore. I believe that the prior existence of the section of Woodbine Avenue between Steeles and O'Connor is the main reason why the TTC kept the route name "Woodbine". As for why the 91/C/F branches start off as far south as Danforth Avenue...the route's current routing follows small residential and commercial/industrial streets that are parallel to or are in close proximity to that section of Woodbine Avenue replaced by the DVP.

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Woodbine Avenue today is split into two sections, the section south of O'Connor and the section north of Steeles. The section of Woodbine Avenue between O'Connor and Steeles was replaced by the Don Valley Parkway and Highway 404 in the 60's and 70's. So it was a fairly long street (excluding the York Region section), taking you from all the way from Steeles Avenue down to Lakeshore. I believe that the prior existence of the section of Woodbine Avenue between Steeles and O'Connor is the main reason why the TTC kept the route name "Woodbine". As for why the 91/C/F branches start off as far south as Danforth Avenue...the route's current routing follows small residential and commercial/industrial streets that are parallel to or are in close proximity to that section of Woodbine Avenue replaced by the DVP.
Woodbine started up again at Eglinton - i.e. there was no Woodbine between O'Connor and Eglinton. Section from Eglinton to Lawrence was removed when the second section of the DVP was built (1961-1963); the section from Lawrence to Sheppard was in the next phase of the DVP (opened in 1966) and finally the section from the 401 to Steeles was lost during the construction of the 404 in 1976-77.
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  • 4 weeks later...
If anything the 81 Thorncliffe Park should be turned into a branch of the 25 Don Mills. The 81 shares almost the same routing as the 25 up to Thorncliffe Park Drive. I don't even get why it isn't even a seperate route.

You obviously never been there, or been on those two routes or know their purposes.

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Your crazy. You obviously never been there, or been on those two routes or know their purposes.

81 is pretty much a branch of 25 already. The only thing keeping it from being officially a branch is the route name & number and the fact that the schedules aren't made to create even headways. But, 81 should stay as a separate route anyways as to not confuse passengers heading to Thorncliffe and also because of the fact that 81 doesn't even use Don Mills, which is what 25's route name is.

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81 is pretty much a branch of 25 already. The only thing keeping it from being officially a branch is the route name & number and the fact that the schedules aren't made to create even headways. But, 81 should stay as a separate route anyways as to not confuse passengers heading to Thorncliffe and also because of the fact that 81 doesn't even use Don Mills, which is what 25's route name is.

A route name doesn't mean to much. Look at 72 Pape, 131 Nugget, and 123 shorncliffe. Its the purpose of the route that matters.

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A route name doesn't mean to much. Look at 72 Pape, 131 Nugget, and 123 shorncliffe. Its the purpose of the route that matters.

I can understand 72 Pape staying as is cause of 2 reasons. 1. (Which is not really a good reason but) It runs out of Pape station and 2. It serves Pape Ave between the Station and just north of Gerrard St plus that little section between Queen St and Eastern Ave.

123 Shorncliffe is a toss up cause you have all branches of that route serving all of Shorncliffe Rd but the 123 and 123C serves Browns Line as well while the 123A doesn't. In this case It's best off to leave it as Shorncliffe as all branches serves that street. Why name it 123 Shorncliffe / Browns Line when 123A cuts off at Sherway Gardens to head back to the Station? When the route started it was only the 123 and no other branches. It only went from Kipling Stn to Sherway Gardens so it was appropriate to name it 123 Shorncliffe as it served the whole street.

131 Nugget is where I'd most likely do the change BUT there is a history to the name "Nugget". In March 1985 when the Scarborough R.T. Started and 131 Nugget was "born" the route Went from the Town Centre to Neilson Rd only. Looping via Tapscott, Neilson and McLevin back to the Town Centre. Nugget as is today goes between McCowan Rd and Markham Rd while McLevin went all the way eastward to Morningside. 131 at that time spent very little time on McLevin but all of Nugget Ave was covered so it was called 131 Nugget. Today however as we all know it goes past Morningside to Malvern 3 residential area and 131 spends more time on McLevin as well as continuing to serve the whole Nugget Ave stretch. The route can be called 131 McLevin or 131 Nugget / McLevin but honestly tho it's best to keep it as is 131 Nugget.

Now what I'd change is the 162 Lawrence / Donway. I'd call it 162 Bridle path or if you want some history saved call it 162 Edwards Gardens. When the route was created that's what it was called "Edwards Gardens".

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It serves the neighborhood, and all the residents are familiar with the name.

Why mess with it?

I do agree with you 100%. Why change something when there's no problems with it. Just like if it ain't broken then don't try to fix it but since this topic is what it is might as well just go with it.

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Now what I'd change is the 162 Lawrence / Donway. I'd call it 162 Bridle path or if you want some history saved call it 162 Edwards Gardens. When the route was created that's what it was called "Edwards Gardens".
162 was never called "Edwards Gardens", it was "Lawrence-Donway" ever since it started in July 1991.

101 was known as "Edwards Gardens" between Feb 1981 and March 1988, before that it was called "Glenorchy" and after that "Donway - York Mills".

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162 was never called "Edwards Gardens", it was "Lawrence-Donway" ever since it started in July 1991.

101 was known as "Edwards Gardens" between Feb 1981 and March 1988, before that it was called "Glenorchy" and after that "Donway - York Mills".

I know that 162 was called Lawrence - Donway when it started in 1991. I meant when it was called Edwards Gardens between those dates you've mentioned.

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  • 7 years later...

Apologize for bumping an seven year old thread.

Given the 96 WILSON had their branches simplified by forming routes 118, 119, 186/996 in 2016, I think the 52G LAWRENCE WEST (Lawrence West Stn-Martin Grove via Westway) should be broken off as its own route called the 136 WESTWAY. 

If @wil9402 may able to see this, I could see the 86D SCARBOROUGH should also be split off to as the 114 WEST HILL with service hours and frequencies remain the same.

Given the 913 PROGRESS EXPRESS is in existence, I think the 134C should be split off as its own route again as the old 171 PROGRESS EAST route with buses routing via STC, Triton, McCowan, Bushby, Grangeway, Progress and Centennial College (the existing 171 MT DENNIS may need to be renumbered to 177) though the route will keep the same service hours and schedules. The existing 134 PROGRESS routing will remain the same but reverting to the old 134 TAPSCOTT route name and number.

 

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9 hours ago, BYD said:

Apologize for bumping an seven year old thread.

Given the 96 WILSON had their branches simplified by forming routes 118, 119, 186/996 in 2016, I think the 52G LAWRENCE WEST (Lawrence West Stn-Martin Grove via Westway) should be broken off as its own route called the 136 WESTWAY. 

If @wil9402 may able to see this, I could see the 86D SCARBOROUGH should also be split off to as the 114 WEST HILL with service hours and frequencies remain the same.

Given the 913 PROGRESS EXPRESS is in existence, I think the 134C should be split off as its own route again as the old 171 PROGRESS EAST route with buses routing via STC, Triton, McCowan, Bushby, Grangeway, Progress and Centennial College (the existing 171 MT DENNIS may need to be renumbered to 177) though the route will keep the same service hours and schedules. The existing 134 PROGRESS routing will remain the same but reverting to the old 134 TAPSCOTT route name and number.

 

I second this. 

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I think those branches that deviate significantly from the main route should be given a different route number and a different route supervisor to improve performance


-32C Eglinton West via Trethewey
-34C Eglinton East
-37A Islington via Rexdale
-43B Kennedy via Progress
-45B Kipling via Belfeld
-52G Lawrence West via The Westway
-66A/B split into separate routes since a large number of riders a headed towards Park Lawn
-70C O'Connor via St Clair
-71B Runnymede
-86D Scarborough
-110A/B Islingotn South via Horner
-116A Morningside
-123B/C/D Sherway split and reorganize
-134C Progress

 

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On 12/31/2018 at 10:08 PM, Xtrazsteve said:

I think those branches that deviate significantly from the main route should be given a different route number and a different route supervisor to improve performance


-32C Eglinton West via Trethewey
-34C Eglinton East
-37A Islington via Rexdale
-43B Kennedy via Progress
-45B Kipling via Belfeld
-52G Lawrence West via The Westway
-66A/B split into separate routes since a large number of riders a headed towards Park Lawn
-70C O'Connor via St Clair
-71B Runnymede
-86D Scarborough
-110A/B Islingotn South via Horner
-116A Morningside
-123B/C/D Sherway split and reorganize
-134C Progress

 

  • They can restore the old 123 SHORNCLIFFE name and have the 123F renamed back to the 124 SHERWAY (the number is currently in use by SUNNYBROOK which could be renumbered to "164"). You may forget the 38B HIGHLAND CREEK should also be split off to become its own route as the 138 UTSC-CENTENNIAL while the 38A and 116A can be (re-)integrated/absorbed into the 95 YORK MILLS. 
  • In that case, the 34B/C can be reintegrated back into the 100 FLEMINGDON PARK since why they have to split it in the first place which is so ridiculous. Extend the 34 by absorbing the 116B/C MORNINGSIDE routes.
  • Meanwhile, the 119 and 84 need some housekeeping. Cancel the 99 ARROW ROAD and reorganize the 119 (Bartor side), 99 and 84C into the 99 CLAYSON terminating from York Mills or Wilson Stn. with the hours of the current 84C and 99 ARROW ROAD retained. The 119 (Torbarrie) and 84D becomes the combined 116 OAKDALE running between Wilson Stn and Pioneer Village Stn.
  • The 108A should be split into its own route as the 119 GRANDRAVINE. Re-route its northern portion via west on Stong Ct., north on Jane St., east on Steeles Ave. W. into Pioneer Village Stn. to differentiate from the 108B routing.  
  • Undo the 1989 merger of the 38 and 110 into 38 HORNER (110A/B) and 110 ISLINGTON SOUTH (110C) and retain service hours and levels of the existing routes.
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The 38B barely diverges from its base route though - isn't the point of splitting branches into new routes to eliminate confusion, and not just giving every individual service the TTC runs its own number and name? The reason why it made sense for the 96 is because it had a million branches, had a cluttered map, and the service levels were difficult to figure out because there was so much info being thrown at you. If someone can't figure out how the 38B works, then there's a bigger issue there than being able to figure out where they are going.

I'd also argue that absorbing routes into each other just because they share a small portion of a corridor would generate more confusion, not less. There's a reason the 38A and 116A aren't a part of the 95 corridor. That would be like folding the 504 into the 501 just because they both run on Queen.

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While not specifically a branch, I would like it if they split the 54 Lawrence East into a new route east from the Lawrence East SRT station. Sometimes it takes half an hour to get a bus east of Port Union, because the route is so damn long.

I think if that was either a separate route or a completely separate branch of the 54 East the headways on the entire route would probably be a lot more stable.

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5 hours ago, MK78 said:

While not specifically a branch, I would like it if they split the 54 Lawrence East into a new route east from the Lawrence East SRT station. Sometimes it takes half an hour to get a bus east of Port Union, because the route is so damn long.

I think if that was either a separate route or a completely separate branch of the 54 East the headways on the entire route would probably be a lot more stable.

34 Eglinton East used to be so damn long when it ran up Morningside. With Kennedy Station opening in 1980 In 1989, they split it with the 116 with only a rush hour branch to Kingston Rd. A few years ago, all 34 service east of Kennedy is reassigned to the 116B. I don't know why they haven't change the 54 but if they do shut Line 3 down for the Scarborough subway, the 54 will get split.

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1 hour ago, Xtrazsteve said:

34 Eglinton East used to be so damn long when it ran up Morningside. With Kennedy Station opening in 1980, the split it with the 116 with only a rush hour branch to Kingston Rd. A few years ago, all 34 service east of Kennedy is reassigned to the 116B. I don't know why they haven't change the 54 but if they do shut Line 3 down for the Scarborough subway, the 54 will get split.

August 31, 1989 is when the 116 Morningside began (I think).

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2 hours ago, Xtrazsteve said:

34 Eglinton East used to be so damn long when it ran up Morningside. With Kennedy Station opening in 1980, the split it with the 116 with only a rush hour branch to Kingston Rd. A few years ago, all 34 service east of Kennedy is reassigned to the 116B. I don't know why they haven't change the 54 but if they do shut Line 3 down for the Scarborough subway, the 54 will get split.

1 hour ago, D40-90 said:

The 34 Split happen in 1989 or 1990 almost 10 years after Kennedy was built

1 hour ago, Downsview 108 said:

August 31, 1989 is when the 116 Morningside began (I think).

A little bit of research would have shown the 116 Morningside route began service on September 3, 1989.

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On 1/5/2019 at 2:26 PM, Xtrazsteve said:

34 Eglinton East used to be so damn long when it ran up Morningside. With Kennedy Station opening in 1980 In 1989, they split it with the 116 with only a rush hour branch to Kingston Rd. A few years ago, all 34 service east of Kennedy is reassigned to the 116B. I don't know why they haven't change the 54 but if they do shut Line 3 down for the Scarborough subway, the 54 will get split.

Yeah, I remember when they finally reassigned the branch to 116B. Though it still creates some confusion most likely to people not knowing about it or not paying attention, when there's a 116B stopping at Kingston Rd. ahead of a 116A or C, there's usually a few folks with transfers in hand that hop on the A or C.

I wish they would split 54 East sooner rather than later, I don't think we'll see the Scarborough Subway Extension in at least 15 years, and I think that's being optimistic.

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On 1/6/2019 at 4:50 PM, MK78 said:

Yeah, I remember when they finally reassigned the branch to 116B. Though it still creates some confusion most likely to people not knowing about it or not paying attention, when there's a 116B stopping at Kingston Rd. ahead of a 116A or C, there's usually a few folks with transfers in hand that hop on the A or C.

I wish they would split 54 East sooner rather than later, I don't think we'll see the Scarborough Subway Extension in at least 15 years, and I think that's being optimistic.

If they want, they should have it split at Lawrence East RT Stn. with the 54 LAWRENCE EAST running between Eglinton Stn. to Lawrence East Stn. only. The eastern portion should be split into the new 114 CEDARBRAE-PORT UNION* route which can be divided/restructured into four branches:

  • 114A Lawrence East Stn.-Starspray Blvd. (7 days a week, 18 hours a day)
  • 114B Lawrence East Stn.-Orton Park (7 days a week, 18 hours a day)
  • 114C Lawrence East Stn.-U of T Scarborough (Monday to Friday, rush hours only)
  • 114D Lawrence East Stn.-Beechgroove (Monday to Saturday, daytime)

* - Naming proposals: Since the existing 54 east of Lawrence East Stn serves the neighbourhoods of Bendale, Cedarbrae, Woburn, West Hill, Port Union/Centennial and West Rouge, can anyone get a double-barrelled name for the route entity running from west to east? For example -  BENDALE-WEST HILL, WOBURN-CENTENNIAL, etc...

As for the garage who will operate it, I may assume New Eglinton or Malvern can run the route (depending on the availability of buses) 

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3 hours ago, BYD said:

If they want, they should have it split at Lawrence East RT Stn. with the 54 LAWRENCE EAST running between Eglinton Stn. to Lawrence East Stn. only. The eastern portion should be split into the new 114 CEDARBRAE-PORT UNION* route which can be divided/restructured into four branches:

  • 114A Lawrence East Stn.-Starspray Blvd. (7 days a week, 18 hours a day)
  • 114B Lawrence East Stn.-Orton Park (7 days a week, 18 hours a day)
  • 114C Lawrence East Stn.-U of T Scarborough (Monday to Friday, rush hours only)
  • 114D Lawrence East Stn.-Beechgroove (Monday to Saturday, daytime)

* - Naming proposals: Since the existing 54 east of Lawrence East Stn serves the neighbourhoods of Bendale, Cedarbrae, Woburn, West Hill, Port Union/Centennial and West Rouge, can anyone get a double-barrelled name for the route entity running from west to east? For example -  BENDALE-WEST HILL, WOBURN-CENTENNIAL, etc...

As for the garage who will operate it, I may assume New Eglinton or Malvern can run the route (depending on the availability of buses) 

Yeah, that could work, with the possible exception of a UofT branch, I think that is already served by enough routes. But the Beechgrove branch would make sense and you can then scrap the 86D Scarborough Beechgrove branch and make it more simple.

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