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Articulated buses are a market im surprised Gillig never ventured into considering the wide market that they supply for in the 30ft-40ft bus categories.

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On 7/21/2018 at 11:25 AM, MaT said:

Articulated buses are a market im surprised Gillig never ventured into considering the wide market that they supply for in the 30ft-40ft bus categories.

This comes up semi-regularly.

Gillig's bread-and-butter is small and midsize transit agencies. Most of these agencies have little or no use for articulated buses.

Considering the additional complexities of building artics -- and the fact that New Flyer and Nova already lead the market -- Gillig has little to gain by introducing an artic model. The sheer magnitude of an artic project at Gillig would distract from their daily business of selling two 35-foot buses at a time to Billings and Jefferson City and Muskegon.

Larger systems that run Gillig and artics... aren't terribly set back by sourcing to New Flyer (usually) for artics. See Pittsburgh, Spokane, Minneapolis, Honolulu, San Jose... several others. Regardless of manufacturer, artics require different parts than non-artics -- so even if Gillig did offer an artic, the "advantage" (no pun intended) to larger operators wouldn't be all that dramatic.

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, TTC T6H-5307N 2252 said:

is New Jersey the only state without Gillig buses?

300th post

For public transit agency use, yes.  Thanks to the near-total domination by NJ Transit which mainly uses NABI high-floor buses and MCI commuter coaches.  I don't know if there's any Gillig buses operating with private owners or shuttle operators in New Jersey though.

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19 hours ago, Buzz2kb said:

For public transit agency use, yes.  Thanks to the near-total domination by NJ Transit which mainly uses NABI high-floor buses and MCI commuter coaches.  I don't know if there's any Gillig buses operating with private owners or shuttle operators in New Jersey though.

The Port Authority of New York and New Jersey picked up a few used Gilligs from Delaware's DART - not sure if any of those ever operate on the Jersey side of the river.  

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On 7/21/2018 at 8:25 AM, MaT said:

Articulated buses are a market im surprised Gillig never ventured into considering the wide market that they supply for in the 30ft-40ft bus categories.

According to rumors from Gillig at the 2017 APTA, plan is they are going to show a prototype articulated model at the 2020 APTA. 

Some reason they waited is apparently there used to be too much competition and Gillig was going thru their move to the new Livermore facility.

I see why they are going for this now, not only are larger systems moving to Gillig buses, but those larger systems also usually operate artics and have to get either New Flyer or Nova which of course reduces fleet commonality. This would be major for Gillig too because they would be the only bus manufacturer to offer all 30, 35, 40, and 60 foot models. 

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I wouldn't be surprised if Gillig is working on a major update or replacement for the Low Floor design, which is now two decades old.  I always thought that if they were going to offer an articulated bus, it would be a newer design.

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18 minutes ago, RailBus63 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Gillig is working on a major update or replacement for the Low Floor design, which is now two decades old.  I always thought that if they were going to offer an articulated bus, it would be a newer design.

I sure hope so.

I mean, give Gillig credit for stepping into the big leagues. Gilligs aren't just for midsize cities anymore. And sure, their aftermarket/parts operation is, um, responsive.

For the good of the transit industry, though, the Gillig design needs some serious updating. The bone-jarring, motion sickness-inducing experience of riding a Gillig is not acceptable. And their institutional exterior appearance does nothing to make transit more attractive. Our biz has enough challenges as it is -- you'd think we'd at least make the vehicles somewhat appealing. That's the most visible part of our product, after all.

I have a whole other list of Gillig grievances from driving the blasted things.

If Gillig is working on something new, let's cross our fingers that they'll pay more attention to the "human experience" this time around -- both for those who ride and drive them.

 

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Border City Transit said:

I sure hope so.

I mean, give Gillig credit for stepping into the big leagues. Gilligs aren't just for midsize cities anymore. And sure, their aftermarket/parts operation is, um, responsive.

For the good of the transit industry, though, the Gillig design needs some serious updating. The bone-jarring, motion sickness-inducing experience of riding a Gillig is not acceptable. And their institutional exterior appearance does nothing to make transit more attractive. Our biz has enough challenges as it is -- you'd think we'd at least make the vehicles somewhat appealing. That's the most visible part of our product, after all.

I have a whole other list of Gillig grievances from driving the blasted things.

If Gillig is working on something new, let's cross our fingers that they'll pay more attention to the "human experience" this time around -- both for those who ride and drive them.

 

 

 

 

I agree with you 100% I find myself wanting to drive the 2005 New Flyer CNG's in our fleet over the newest CNG Gilligs. Gilligs just aren't comfortable at least for me. I'm hoping the agency I work for,  the 60FT contract that was put out goes to New Flyer.

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The hearsay I’ve been privy to in the great white north has not been positive regarding the serviceability of them.

(fellow technician friend of mine has a father who retired out of the TTC and went south to live the snowbird life -had several winters worth of experience with the at Broward county transit)

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19 hours ago, Border City Transit said:

I sure hope so.

I mean, give Gillig credit for stepping into the big leagues. Gilligs aren't just for midsize cities anymore. And sure, their aftermarket/parts operation is, um, responsive.

For the good of the transit industry, though, the Gillig design needs some serious updating. The bone-jarring, motion sickness-inducing experience of riding a Gillig is not acceptable. And their institutional exterior appearance does nothing to make transit more attractive. Our biz has enough challenges as it is -- you'd think we'd at least make the vehicles somewhat appealing. That's the most visible part of our product, after all.

I have a whole other list of Gillig grievances from driving the blasted things.

If Gillig is working on something new, let's cross our fingers that they'll pay more attention to the "human experience" this time around -- both for those who ride and drive them.

 

 

 

 

Im not sure what year and specs the gilligs you drove were, but I hear many great things about Gillig Low Floors from our drivers and from other drivers at many other systems. Yes, the older Low Floors may have been a bit bouncy but as a rider they ride SMOOTH and more like a high floor rather than other low floors with their stiff suspensions. Post 2010 LF’s have different suspensions which are so much nicer than other brands of buses.

 

Don’t know why Gillig always gets thrown to the bottom.........

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Well for me I just don't like how the drivers area is set up its very cramped, controls are in odd places and I absolutely hate how the warning lights are above the windshield. So yeah maybe it is how my agency specified the buses but the newer ones (2016-2017) the drive like crap.Every bump in the road is felt in the steering wheel constant door problems electrical problems (maybe just new bus issues)  Other than that I will say Gillig has built a good bus but I do agree that they need to start from scratch especially with the tired exterior design and the cramped drivers area. My agency only has 15 New Flyer's and as I stated before I'd rather operate those over any Gilligs much more space in the drivers area the ride is so much better than even the new gilligs. But it seems Gillig has a contract with my agency until 2020 so they will replace the remaining 15 New Flyers and 24 Orion VII we have.

But I will say my favorite Gilligs in our fleet are  the 2006-2007 Gillig Hybrids out of silver spring depot  5300-5311,5313. 

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22 hours ago, OR Transit Fan said:

Im not sure what year and specs the gilligs you drove were,

"My" Gilligs ranged... from model years 2000 to 2010.

Our 2004 batch was noticeably smoother and better built than all the rest. One unit from that order, I actually enjoyed driving. But that was it: I probably took the wheel of 50 individual Gilligs... and I only 'bonded' with a single one.

That may sound ridiculous, but other operators here will know what I mean. You learn the quirks of each bus; the better ones really do feel like your partner on the job. So, props to 3027... my "token Gillig friend".

 

7 hours ago, vvozz said:

Well for me I just don't like how the drivers area is set up its very cramped, controls are in odd places

Yep. I didn't find the cockpit cramped per se, but just really awkward. When activating the turn signals, your left foot collided with the steering column and other ill-placed components on the floor. The position of the door handle could give you carpel tunnel. Even after the slight body redesign in 2002, the glare from interior lights is/was AWFUL. And on and on.

The over-the-windshield indicator lights never especially bothered me. But all things equal, yes I definitely prefer them on the dash.

It was bad enough driving Gilligs, but it's the rider ("passenger") experience that I find absolutely miserable. There's some kind of visibility obstruction in every seat. The ride quality is painful. The rattling can be so loud that it's hard to carry on a conversation.

And, while I'm not a big texter to begin with (proud flip-phone holdout! B) ), I literally can't text or read while riding a Gillig -- regardless of model year -- without getting carsick. I do not experience this sensation on other types of buses.

Whew. I'll cut myself off.

I don't drive them anymore. And, mercifully, New Flyers are abundant where I use transit the most!

 

 

 

 

 

 

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I wonder, does anyone have a weight comparison between a New Flyer D40LF®, Gillig LF, and New Flyer XD40?  It would be interesting to know how they compare in weight.  I do believe the Gillig LF is lighter than the New Flyer D40LF® since it uses aluminum body panels instead of steel (the XD40 has fiberglass body panels).

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59 minutes ago, ABQ RIDE said:

I wonder, does anyone have a weight comparison between a New Flyer D40LF®, Gillig LF, and New Flyer XD40?  It would be interesting to know how they compare in weight.  I do believe the Gillig LF is lighter than the New Flyer D40LF® since it uses aluminum body panels instead of steel (the XD40 has fiberglass body panels).

The LF, LFR, and LFA all have fiberglass body panels as well. Still, the Xcelsior is lighter than any of its predecessors. The front and end caps on Gillig Low Floors are also made of fiberglass. 

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4 hours ago, ABQ RIDE said:

I wonder, does anyone have a weight comparison between a New Flyer D40LF®, Gillig LF, and New Flyer XD40?  It would be interesting to know how they compare in weight.  I do believe the Gillig LF is lighter than the New Flyer D40LF® since it uses aluminum body panels instead of steel (the XD40 has fiberglass body panels).

It depends a lot on the options specified in the order.  From what I've seen, they're about the same -- a bit over 27000 pounds for a base model with light seats and minimal options.  Maybe the XD40 can come in a bit under 27000 if you choose standard windows, non-opening?  If you drop A/C, you save a few hundred pounds, but does anyone do that anymore, other than far northern and a few Quebec operators?  The low floors do not get the same ventilation as a New Look, so weather that may be tolerable in a Fishbowl would be unpleasant in a low floor.  Also, in cold climates, there will be auxiliary heaters and perhaps extra insulation that would add some weight back, I think.

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On 6/3/2018 at 10:51 PM, M. Parsons said:

A Gillig Phantom hybrid visited Edmonton for ETS to look at. It didn't operate in revenue service.

Finally found a pic in my archives. 

95680021.jpg

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15 hours ago, M. Parsons said:

Finally found a pic in my archives. 

95680021.jpg

When was that? The Gillig Phantom was one of the first, if not the first, demo buses to show off the new Allison EP System in 2001. I wonder if this was the same demo. In fact, I wonder if the one that visited New York in 2005 was the same bus too.

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5 hours ago, ADB said:

When was that? The Gillig Phantom was one of the first, if not the first, demo buses to show off the new Allison EP System in 2001. I wonder if this was the same demo. In fact, I wonder if the one that visited New York in 2005 was the same bus too.

This was in 2004. I thought April 2004 judging from the date stamp on near by photos  on this roll of film, but, Ken has the date as March on Barp with a lot more information so I'm much more inclined to go with that!

http://www.barp.ca/archives/2004/2004_archive.html

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I love Gillig products here in Dayton OH we have low floor Advantages BRT Hybrids and 4 BRT Trolleys years ranging from 2007-2017 and just got our 4 2018 30 footers at beginning of August

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006 by Munidave on Flickr

Here's a decent photo of the new headlight design variant that was posted on Flickr recently. The first photo I've personally seen of one. They really need to figure out a better design than this IMO. Obviously just going for parts commonality with the BRT cap. Even just replacing the existing chrome trimmed headlight fixtures with three holes would've looked better honestly.

 

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On 9/1/2018 at 11:20 PM, MVTArider said:

006 by Munidave on Flickr

Here's a decent photo of the new headlight design variant that was posted on Flickr recently. The first photo I've personally seen of one. They really need to figure out a better design than this IMO. Obviously just going for parts commonality with the BRT cap. Even just replacing the existing chrome trimmed headlight fixtures with three holes would've looked better honestly.

 

Those were a custom spec by VTA. Gillig offers that spec for other systems, but definitely isn’t replacing the standard Low Floor design.

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