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23 hours ago, 140 Southshore said:

Page 18 of the book for this month's board of directors meeting reveals that SMART is proposing a logo change to the following:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/418944722577391616/1012005908202672169/unknown.png

I personally think the current logo is fine as it is.

WTF? Did they do -any- research into best practice? Either among transit systems -- or just among logo design in general?

I happen to think the current logo -is- due for a refresh. But this is not it. Looks like the title card from a bad spinoff of Star Trek that didn't make it past the pilot episode. Or some VHS cassette tape collecting dust on your shelf that you haven't touched since 1990.

Then again, this is precisely the kind of trash garbage I'd expect from an organization that resents its own existence.

 

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The meeting is taking place right now and in addition to the proposed logo, they also proposed a new website URL (smartmovesus.org) and new liveries to go with it:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/418944722577391616/1012436430015975434/20220825_150028.jpg

In the end, however, the logo change has been dropped.

Additionally, new TV ads have been completed and will hit the airwaves next week.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 8/25/2022 at 3:22 PM, 140 Southshore said:

The meeting is taking place right now and in addition to the proposed logo, they also proposed a new website URL (smartmovesus.org) and new liveries to go with it:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/418944722577391616/1012436430015975434/20220825_150028.jpg

In the end, however, the logo change has been dropped.

Additionally, new TV ads have been completed and will hit the airwaves next week.

Oh look... more diagonal stripes... hey a neighboring transit agency just redid their scheme to something like that... gotta be regional and all that right? 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...

Caught #4027 on the 495 today. The driver told me this was the first revenue run - some of us tracked it on the 375 on Saturday but that could've been a test I suppose. The front door was having some issues, with the left leaf failing to open a few times. 38 seats in the same layout as DDOT's proterras. Oddly enough it doesn't have the new full color screens, just an amber LED dot-matrix onboard.

image.thumb.jpeg.75cfbd23917fa40fa378b8cc103869bd.jpeg

Two more unpainted Proterras were at Oakland Terminal as well last Monday. I'd stumbled upon #4027 there after a lengthy wild goose chase trying to catch it in service, believing it'd hit the streets for a revenue run that day.

IMG_1287.thumb.JPG.087e3bb4994edf2c649bbc5010a0b214.JPGIMG_1299.thumb.JPG.9da9c1fcbaa8c82468dcc5a01a9b9e80.JPG

(a SMART employee told me that the Proterras are being painted, not wrapped, with the new livery, and so will the Gilligs and XD60s as they're progressively given the silver scheme)

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  • 2 weeks later...

Not much talk of Flex here, and it's not mentioned on the wiki - so I figure I'll summarize its fleet here.

 

Most of it consists of minivans, of which the most common is the pre-facelift (2017-2020) Chrysler Pacifica/Voyager, alongside some final gen Dodge Grand Caravans and current gen Toyota Siennas. Most of the Chryslers are set up with second-row bucket seats, meaning 5 passenger seats available (the front passenger seat is off limits), while a couple of Chryslers and all of the Dodges have wheelchair bays in the third row, with a three-seat bench in the second row. I've only been on one of the Toyotas (which only seem to run in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones), and it had the 3+wheelchair setup, though I'm not sure about the rest of them.

Almost all of the vans have the full Flex livery, while a couple just have a Flex or Via logo decal. I've read VINs on a couple of the Grand Caravans and found that they were 2020 models, but I'm not confident in assuming the same for all of them.

IMG_5974.thumb.JPG.cff14dba7589056cc8d042905a6d565f.JPGsmartflex_gdcaravan.thumb.JPG.3bd1b0857cd46a2d0d5127b5d4b033a7.JPGIMG_0112.thumb.JPG.5d3cb5cbd20ef276aacb300e02934d2c.JPG

In addition, there are some white 2019-2022 Chevrolet Malibus, most of which bear Flex decals slapped on the front doors. These have been part of the Flex pool at least since May 2021, and given the Michigan plate serials, they're still adding more. Initially, they only ran in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones, but have recently started appearing in Farmington and Dearborn.

image.thumb.jpeg.9bfea90eac065ed7d16ab3041316525e.jpeg

These were joined, within the past two weeks, by at least one new Chevrolet Blazer, similarly white with a logo decal.

Image

 

From sightings and discussions with drivers, I've reasoned that the fleet is owned by Avis Budget Group and leased to Via. I've checked multiple Avis locations in the area, and have found Flex vehicles parked at three: 34500 Plymouth Rd, Livonia; 34703 Van Dyke Ave, Sterling Heights; and Detroit Metro Airport. A friend has also told me they keep some at the Troy Civic Center park-and-ride lot. I believe the Farmington and Dearborn zones use vehicles from Livonia and DTW, while the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones pull from Sterling Heights. It seems, to me, to be an "east division" and "west division" split, with Woodward as a rough dividing line - I've rarely seen vehicles from one side used on the other, plus the "west division" only used the Chrysler and Dodge vans until just recently.

The vehicles are registered in a few different states. All of the Malibus and most of the Siennas have Michigan plates, and a majority of the Chryslers are registered in Florida. Others are registered in Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Nevada, Ohio, and Texas, with a mix of standard plates from some states and fleet plates from others.

 

If anyone's interested in adding Flex to the wiki, or is generally interested in the fleet, I've got an incomplete Flex roster, based on spots, in my SMART spreadsheet (a collaboration with @140 Southshore) here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1teQ3E6Km2RKEeU0KOi7a6Ow0DCrRMWzuj2ZHZ6EIO8o/edit?usp=sharing

This will be updated as I spot new units.

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  • 3 weeks later...

SMART could see its biggest expansion in decades as Oakland County voters have approved a countywide millage for the first time. Millage renewals also passed in Macomb County and in opt-in Wayne County suburbs.

https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/elections/2022/11/09/oakland-county-regional-transit-millage/69627039007/

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On 10/18/2022 at 8:33 PM, dtwtransit said:

Not much talk of Flex here, and it's not mentioned on the wiki - so I figure I'll summarize its fleet here.

 

Most of it consists of minivans, of which the most common is the pre-facelift (2017-2020) Chrysler Pacifica/Voyager, alongside some final gen Dodge Grand Caravans and current gen Toyota Siennas. Most of the Chryslers are set up with second-row bucket seats, meaning 5 passenger seats available (the front passenger seat is off limits), while a couple of Chryslers and all of the Dodges have wheelchair bays in the third row, with a three-seat bench in the second row. I've only been on one of the Toyotas (which only seem to run in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones), and it had the 3+wheelchair setup, though I'm not sure about the rest of them.

Almost all of the vans have the full Flex livery, while a couple just have a Flex or Via logo decal. I've read VINs on a couple of the Grand Caravans and found that they were 2020 models, but I'm not confident in assuming the same for all of them.

IMG_5974.thumb.JPG.cff14dba7589056cc8d042905a6d565f.JPGsmartflex_gdcaravan.thumb.JPG.3bd1b0857cd46a2d0d5127b5d4b033a7.JPGIMG_0112.thumb.JPG.5d3cb5cbd20ef276aacb300e02934d2c.JPG

In addition, there are some white 2019-2022 Chevrolet Malibus, most of which bear Flex decals slapped on the front doors. These have been part of the Flex pool at least since May 2021, and given the Michigan plate serials, they're still adding more. Initially, they only ran in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones, but have recently started appearing in Farmington and Dearborn.

image.thumb.jpeg.9bfea90eac065ed7d16ab3041316525e.jpeg

These were joined, within the past two weeks, by at least one new Chevrolet Blazer, similarly white with a logo decal.

Image

 

From sightings and discussions with drivers, I've reasoned that the fleet is owned by Avis Budget Group and leased to Via. I've checked multiple Avis locations in the area, and have found Flex vehicles parked at three: 34500 Plymouth Rd, Livonia; 34703 Van Dyke Ave, Sterling Heights; and Detroit Metro Airport. A friend has also told me they keep some at the Troy Civic Center park-and-ride lot. I believe the Farmington and Dearborn zones use vehicles from Livonia and DTW, while the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones pull from Sterling Heights. It seems, to me, to be an "east division" and "west division" split, with Woodward as a rough dividing line - I've rarely seen vehicles from one side used on the other, plus the "west division" only used the Chrysler and Dodge vans until just recently.

The vehicles are registered in a few different states. All of the Malibus and most of the Siennas have Michigan plates, and a majority of the Chryslers are registered in Florida. Others are registered in Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Nevada, Ohio, and Texas, with a mix of standard plates from some states and fleet plates from others.

 

If anyone's interested in adding Flex to the wiki, or is generally interested in the fleet, I've got an incomplete Flex roster, based on spots, in my SMART spreadsheet (a collaboration with @140 Southshore) here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1teQ3E6Km2RKEeU0KOi7a6Ow0DCrRMWzuj2ZHZ6EIO8o/edit?usp=sharing

This will be updated as I spot new units.

Weird not used to Para Transit vans most agencies have mini buses.

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  • 1 month later...
On 11/25/2022 at 2:48 AM, doglover44 said:

Weird not used to Para Transit vans most agencies have mini buses.

SMART has paratransit services too, and those use the usual minibuses- Flex is a whole different thing.

They've been getting quite a few new vehicles lately - some facelifted Pacificas and more Malibus. Plus a Chevy Equinox if I'm not mistaken. None are in the full livery wrap - just with these magnetic decals slapped on the doors.

image.thumb.jpeg.53223493219101ac808bdc69686f987d.jpegimage.thumb.jpeg.a860cb5250275992549bf33e1acf02b1.jpeg

They've also begun to store them at SMART park and ride lots rather than Avis locations. I checked Avis in Livonia last week and there wasn't a Flex vehicle in sight. These two were spotted at OCC Orchard Ridge; there are usually a few there.

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8 hours ago, dtwtransit said:

also I spotted another hybrid for the first time since fall last week - #3012 was deadheading midday on its way to SFTC, and ran 450 per the trackerimage.thumb.jpeg.1276abe0a81b03741df712006775fed2.jpeg

I’ve seen the hybrids recently too… I think maybe October or November was the first time.

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On 10/18/2022 at 8:33 PM, dtwtransit said:

Not much talk of Flex here, and it's not mentioned on the wiki - so I figure I'll summarize its fleet here.

 

Most of it consists of minivans, of which the most common is the pre-facelift (2017-2020) Chrysler Pacifica/Voyager, alongside some final gen Dodge Grand Caravans and current gen Toyota Siennas. Most of the Chryslers are set up with second-row bucket seats, meaning 5 passenger seats available (the front passenger seat is off limits), while a couple of Chryslers and all of the Dodges have wheelchair bays in the third row, with a three-seat bench in the second row. I've only been on one of the Toyotas (which only seem to run in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones), and it had the 3+wheelchair setup, though I'm not sure about the rest of them.

Almost all of the vans have the full Flex livery, while a couple just have a Flex or Via logo decal. I've read VINs on a couple of the Grand Caravans and found that they were 2020 models, but I'm not confident in assuming the same for all of them.

IMG_5974.thumb.JPG.cff14dba7589056cc8d042905a6d565f.JPGsmartflex_gdcaravan.thumb.JPG.3bd1b0857cd46a2d0d5127b5d4b033a7.JPGIMG_0112.thumb.JPG.5d3cb5cbd20ef276aacb300e02934d2c.JPG

In addition, there are some white 2019-2022 Chevrolet Malibus, most of which bear Flex decals slapped on the front doors. These have been part of the Flex pool at least since May 2021, and given the Michigan plate serials, they're still adding more. Initially, they only ran in the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones, but have recently started appearing in Farmington and Dearborn.

image.thumb.jpeg.9bfea90eac065ed7d16ab3041316525e.jpeg

These were joined, within the past two weeks, by at least one new Chevrolet Blazer, similarly white with a logo decal.

Image

 

From sightings and discussions with drivers, I've reasoned that the fleet is owned by Avis Budget Group and leased to Via. I've checked multiple Avis locations in the area, and have found Flex vehicles parked at three: 34500 Plymouth Rd, Livonia; 34703 Van Dyke Ave, Sterling Heights; and Detroit Metro Airport. A friend has also told me they keep some at the Troy Civic Center park-and-ride lot. I believe the Farmington and Dearborn zones use vehicles from Livonia and DTW, while the Auburn Hills/Pontiac, Troy, and Hall Road zones pull from Sterling Heights. It seems, to me, to be an "east division" and "west division" split, with Woodward as a rough dividing line - I've rarely seen vehicles from one side used on the other, plus the "west division" only used the Chrysler and Dodge vans until just recently.

The vehicles are registered in a few different states. All of the Malibus and most of the Siennas have Michigan plates, and a majority of the Chryslers are registered in Florida. Others are registered in Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Nevada, Ohio, and Texas, with a mix of standard plates from some states and fleet plates from others.

 

If anyone's interested in adding Flex to the wiki, or is generally interested in the fleet, I've got an incomplete Flex roster, based on spots, in my SMART spreadsheet (a collaboration with @140 Southshore) here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1teQ3E6Km2RKEeU0KOi7a6Ow0DCrRMWzuj2ZHZ6EIO8o/edit?usp=sharing

This will be updated as I spot new units.

Hope they take good care of those Dodge and Chrysler vans. As for Smart as a whole, I have 2 questions. One, have they ever tested CNG powered buses? 2, have they ever considered Merging with DDOT?

On 1/3/2023 at 11:33 AM, dtwtransit said:

SMART has paratransit services too, and those use the usual minibuses- Flex is a whole different thing.

They've been getting quite a few new vehicles lately - some facelifted Pacificas and more Malibus. Plus a Chevy Equinox if I'm not mistaken. None are in the full livery wrap - just with these magnetic decals slapped on the doors.

image.thumb.jpeg.53223493219101ac808bdc69686f987d.jpegimage.thumb.jpeg.a860cb5250275992549bf33e1acf02b1.jpeg

They've also begun to store them at SMART park and ride lots rather than Avis locations. I checked Avis in Livonia last week and there wasn't a Flex vehicle in sight. These two were spotted at OCC Orchard Ridge; there are usually a few there.

What's with the out of state plates?

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 1/4/2023 at 6:37 PM, New Yorker 2001 said:

Hope they take good care of those Dodge and Chrysler vans. As for Smart as a whole, I have 2 questions. One, have they ever tested CNG powered buses? 2, have they ever considered Merging with DDOT?

What's with the out of state plates?

Most likely they were bought from dealerships that were outside the state.

As for the answer to your second question, they haven't. SMART however does have a mutual alliance/partnership with DDOT, although, they are two separate entities and SMART barely has a presence in Detroit outside of the FAST program, a universal transfer system with DDOT, and a few routes that have stops in Detroit.

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On 11/19/2022 at 11:52 AM, dtwtransit said:

Rumor has it that the 740 west to Novi is the first priority for expansion. Time will tell, though.

late but I think this should be the extended route (I apologize for the low quality of the edit):

Stop 1 - 12 Mile + Haggerty (already exists)

Stop 2 - 12 Mile + Meadowbrooks

Stop 3 - Twelve Oaks Mall (new transit center built on one of the Twelve Oaks Mall parking lots similar to how Fairlane Town Center has their bus stop)

Stop 4 - Oaks + Donnelson

Stop 5 -  Twelve Mile Crossing (new transit center built on one of the Twelve Mile Crossing parking lots)

Stop 7 - 12 Mile + Beck (new transit center built near the MDOT Park & Ride carpool lot)

Stop 8 - West Market Square Shopping Center 

Stop 9 -  Grand River + Beck 

Stop 10 - Grand River + Heyn

Stop 11 - Suburban Collection Showplace (new transit center built near the west side of the Suburban Collection Showplace)

proposal.jpg

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4 hours ago, UnitedTransit said:

Most likely they were bought from dealerships that were outside the state.

As for the answer to your second question, they haven't. SMART however does have a mutual alliance/partnership with DDOT, although, they are two separate entities and SMART barely has a presence in Detroit outside of the FAST program, a universal transfer system with DDOT, and a few routes that have stops in Detroit.

No matter where you get the car it'll be registered in its home state with an X plate if the transit agency owns it in Michigan. So the point of purchase would not determine the license plate the agency has on it when it's in service.

Edit:

They probably get sent where they are needed as things change or contracts are dropped.

https://ridewithvia.com/solutions/microtransit

Microtransit is what the FLEX service really is. They just decal it for whoever the service is for. There was mention of them being stored at AVIS locations... that's probably who they are rented from by VIA.

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8 hours ago, ns8401 said:

No matter where you get the car it'll be registered in its home state with an X plate if the transit agency owns it in Michigan. So the point of purchase would not determine the license plate the agency has on it when it's in service.

Edit:

They probably get sent where they are needed as things change or contracts are dropped.

https://ridewithvia.com/solutions/microtransit

Microtransit is what the FLEX service really is. They just decal it for whoever the service is for. There was mention of them being stored at AVIS locations... that's probably who they are rented from by VIA.

True. They're really just a way for SMART to compete with Uber and Lyft.

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On 1/4/2023 at 6:37 PM, New Yorker 2001 said:

What's with the out of state plates?

The cars are pulled out of the Avis rental fleet, whose cars are registered in a bunch of different states. I've never understood why that's a thing at the big rental companies, but that's pretty common practice in the industry. U-Haul is a notable exception, though, as their trucks are all registered in their native Arizona from what I've seen.

The Michigan ones wouldn't have X plates since they're not owned by SMART or any other govt agency.

13 hours ago, UnitedTransit said:

late but I think this should be the extended route (I apologize for the low quality of the edit):

Stop 1 - 12 Mile + Haggerty (already exists)

Stop 2 - 12 Mile + Meadowbrooks

Stop 3 - Twelve Oaks Mall (new transit center built on one of the Twelve Oaks Mall parking lots similar to how Fairlane Town Center has their bus stop)

Stop 4 - Oaks + Donnelson

Stop 5 -  Twelve Mile Crossing (new transit center built on one of the Twelve Mile Crossing parking lots)

Stop 7 - 12 Mile + Beck (new transit center built near the MDOT Park & Ride carpool lot)

Stop 8 - West Market Square Shopping Center 

Stop 9 -  Grand River + Beck 

Stop 10 - Grand River + Heyn

Stop 11 - Suburban Collection Showplace (new transit center built near the west side of the Suburban Collection Showplace)

proposal.jpg

I'd hope for more intermediate stops between the grid roads (SMART usually does every quarter mile from what I've seen). Streets (and sidewalks) are pretty sparse on that stretch of 12 but I'd hope for at least Cabot and maybe Summit westbound and the Yanfeng place and Holiday Inn eastbound.

Personally I'd limit the 740 to go as far west as Fountain Walk provided we also see an expansion of the 305 to Novi to cover the Grand River destinations. I'd maybe want it to go through Twelve Oaks, across Novi Rd into West Oaks and Fountain Walk, and then somehow end up at Novi Town Center to meet the 305.

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1 hour ago, dtwtransit said:

The cars are pulled out of the Avis rental fleet, whose cars are registered in a bunch of different states. I've never understood why that's a thing at the big rental companies, but that's pretty common practice in the industry. U-Haul is a notable exception, though, as their trucks are all registered in their native Arizona from what I've seen.

The Michigan ones wouldn't have X plates since they're not owned by SMART or any other govt agency.

I'd hope for more intermediate stops between the grid roads (SMART usually does every quarter mile from what I've seen). Streets (and sidewalks) are pretty sparse on that stretch of 12 but I'd hope for at least Cabot and maybe Summit westbound and the Yanfeng place and Holiday Inn eastbound.

Personally I'd limit the 740 to go as far west as Fountain Walk provided we also see an expansion of the 305 to Novi to cover the Grand River destinations. I'd maybe want it to go through Twelve Oaks, across Novi Rd into West Oaks and Fountain Walk, and then somehow end up at Novi Town Center to meet the 305.

If you want to really muddy the waters the U-Haul vehicles are all Arizona but the trailers are from all over the country. Even Alaska.

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On 1/16/2023 at 9:11 PM, dtwtransit said:

The cars are pulled out of the Avis rental fleet, whose cars are registered in a bunch of different states. I've never understood why that's a thing at the big rental companies, but that's pretty common practice in the industry. U-Haul is a notable exception, though, as their trucks are all registered in their native Arizona from what I've seen.

The Michigan ones wouldn't have X plates since they're not owned by SMART or any other govt agency.

I'd hope for more intermediate stops between the grid roads (SMART usually does every quarter mile from what I've seen). Streets (and sidewalks) are pretty sparse on that stretch of 12 but I'd hope for at least Cabot and maybe Summit westbound and the Yanfeng place and Holiday Inn eastbound.

Personally I'd limit the 740 to go as far west as Fountain Walk provided we also see an expansion of the 305 to Novi to cover the Grand River destinations. I'd maybe want it to go through Twelve Oaks, across Novi Rd into West Oaks and Fountain Walk, and then somehow end up at Novi Town Center to meet the 305.

Agreed. There are a bunch of suburbs in Metro Detroit that need new routes or route extensions that SMART is overlooking. If they wanted to, they could've made a more believable argument for their transit system to some of the suburbs that rejected it (Livonia, Plymouth, Canton, Bellevue, Flat Rock, etc.) 

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