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Hamilton Transit Centre

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Well, right now the 49 runs use the 480 to get from the Richmond 403 runs to 49 service. It's pretty plausible that the 480 would be redirected to Vancouver and be supplied by the 49's buses rather than the other way around. The 620 on the other hand would do well supplied by the older D60LFs out of the 403 runs. The slower 49 could probably use the aircon buses more in the summer than an express bus plowing down the highway that could have nice airflow through open windows.

On top of that I can see the 43s possibly getting some of that XDE60 love, and 480 runs being reverted to standard buses in off-peak hours to get those artics onto the 43 and other busy routes. The 480 is not the most well-used route and I would honestly even like to see it reworked (i.e. as a 43 run short-turned at Oakridge). Right now there are times when I see 43s being run with Nova-buses while the 480s continue to get the XDEs and I'd at least like to see that turned around.

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BTC will be getting 12 XDE60's early next year so you'll see them on the 43 44 99 135 145. It seems like all future orders of artics will be XDE, possibly XN if RTC and STC get the upgrade.

Back on topic. RTC will keep the 480 as it's own run and if they transfer artics to VTC for the 49, chances are they will be the XDE's.

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Not sure if it has been noted but HTC is to take the 227 and another NVTC route. Not sure where the info is coming from on the 33 & 84 but I don't think that is the case.

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Not sure if it has been noted but HTC is to take the 227 and another NVTC route. Not sure where the info is coming from on the 33 & 84 but I don't think that is the case.

I guess we can also conclude that HTC will run shuttles; as well as speculation as to whether or not the C9×s will move to HTC or RTC due to freed up space.

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All shuttle ops from OTC will be transferred to HTC in September 2016 so it will be a mixed depot, they are building a gas island as well. The 214 and 227 currently run from OTC so they will be transferred to HTC. The C98 will go to HTC conventional I would assume, not sure about the C92 as it is interlined with the 403 and 601 blocks.

The info regarding the 33 and 84 going to BTC was from a draft plan shown in the depots, but those have since gone to being a final plan and the 33 and 84 are back at VTC. VTC is also planned to run the N9 for some reason, not sure where that idea came from.

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The N9 transfer to VTC is actually very logical, assuming that trips start and finish downtown (in contrast to them starting and finishing at Coquitlam Centre as they do now). The N10 and N19 end at about the same time SkyTrain service begins, but the last westbound N9 leaves a significant gap in service to Vancouver. If the N9 starts and ends downtown, it would not only benefit the alcoholics by getting them home safe (as it had in the past), it would also benefit the workaholics by finally providing westbound service that ends later (or at least later than eastbound service).

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Yea that makes sense. I could see PTC doing the first N9 into town and back then a VTC bus start from downtown early enough to get to Coquitlam station for the second departure or have a bus go NIS from Brentwood, not much different from the current NIS from kootnay loop after a 160. Or it starts in service at Brentwood to Coquitlam.

I rushed typing this, but I hope it kinda makes sense. I think someone else mentioned earlier about the N9 possibly becoming like the N10, creating a 24 hour service for the evergreen line.

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VTC running the N9? I'm sure the ops will be thrilled about having to run NIS from Coquitlam at 4.30 in the morning an hour back to VTC.

It'll be the same thing with HTC driving all the way down to Chatham and 2nd Ave to start up the 410 22nd St Stn :P

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All shuttle ops from OTC will be transferred to HTC in September 2016 so it will be a mixed depot, they are building a gas island as well. The 214 and 227 currently run from OTC so they will be transferred to HTC. The C98 will go to HTC conventional I would assume, not sure about the C92 as it is interlined with the 403 and 601 blocks.

The info regarding the 33 and 84 going to BTC was from a draft plan shown in the depots, but those have since gone to being a final plan and the 33 and 84 are back at VTC. VTC is also planned to run the N9 for some reason, not sure where that idea came from.

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The VTC N9 is believed to be a typo. Makes for an interesting discussion, though.

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It'll be the same thing with HTC driving all the way down to Chatham and 2nd Ave to start up the 410 22nd St Stn :P

Seems like a good excuse to start the runs from 22nd Street then! If he's gotta drive across Richmond anyway, might as well do it in service and pick up a couple people.

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Not really, it would be a lot quicker for a bus to just run via Highways 91 and 99, and then along Steveston Highway to the start point vs running in service along the 410 route.

Seems like a good excuse to start the runs from 22nd Street then! If he's gotta drive across Richmond anyway, might as well do it in service and pick up a couple people.

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There are a few buses that deadhead to 22nd in the morning and before PM rush for the C98, 104 and 410 so there's already that deadhead in play which will be shortened with HTC. It wouldn't take long, especially in the am to get to steveston.

I could see the 410 schedule being adjusted to have runs start and finish at Richmond center, but most of them ending at 22nd or even some trips that may be a 410 Queensburough from steveston.

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That's been talked about for a few years, to help with not delaying the interlines with the 401 402 and 407. However, the 410 won't be interlined with those once it's operating out of HTC. I guess this will all depend on funding, it would most likely be done once the evergreen line opens and service hours are made available.

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Good if the 410 is finally split. The route is WAY too long as it is now. But instead of terminating it at Brighouse (which is silly as there are many people that ride through, myself included, from the outer ends to points past Brighouse Stn), why not run it from Steveston Village to Six Road and Commerce Parkway (where the C96 goes now). Then eliminate the C96 entirely, replacing it with 405 diversions through Jack Bell Drive, etc. during peak hours. Then have a beefed up C98 (renumbered to something else, say 411) run via Fraserwood, Westminster Highway, etc., then down to its current terminus, and continue along Eight Road and back up to Westminster Highway to Six Road, then to Commerce Parkway where the new 410 would run. Then you'd have this new 411 run from HTC and leave the 410 out of RTC and linked with the other routes in Richmond.

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The problem with a six road and Commerce Parkway terminus is compromise. It means 22nd St to Richmond Centre is no longer a 1 bus route for no appreciable reason, but more importantly it means passengers are changing buses at a deserted business park in the middle of the night. Safety angle, I wouldn't feel safe doing that one bit. Brighouse is good because it's already a transfer point for a dozen bus routes, giving you options. Not to mention people getting on the 410 at 22nd St aren't all getting off at Six Road. Most of them are going to either A. residential between 6 road and 3 road or B. Businesses on 3 road. You don't want to make the system harder to use.

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The problem with a six road and Commerce Parkway terminus is compromise. It means 22nd St to Richmond Centre is no longer a 1 bus route for no appreciable reason, but more importantly it means passengers are changing buses at a deserted business park in the middle of the night. Safety angle, I wouldn't feel safe doing that one bit. Brighouse is good because it's already a transfer point for a dozen bus routes, giving you options. Not to mention people getting on the 410 at 22nd St aren't all getting off at Six Road. Most of them are going to either A. residential between 6 road and 3 road or B. Businesses on 3 road. You don't want to make the system harder to use.

Brighouse does seem like a great terminus for the 410 because their are more routes to get to places and if you put a terminus in the middle of nowhere those routes would loss ridership.

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The primary reason for the idea of splitting the 410 was because the route often gets delayed due to traffic and passenger loads which would delay the interlined routes from Steveston. Short layovers don't help either. However, now that HTC will be running the 410, it won't be interlined with anything in Richmond. While they could interline the 410 with the HTC routes from 22nd station, they may just keep it on it's own. I think planning and scheduling may want to see how things work out with the 410 not interlining in steveston before looking at splitting the route because I think enough people do use the route as it is now.

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Good if the 410 is finally split. The route is WAY too long as it is now. But instead of terminating it at Brighouse (which is silly as there are many people that ride through, myself included, from the outer ends to points past Brighouse Stn), why not run it from Steveston Village to Six Road and Commerce Parkway (where the C96 goes now). Then eliminate the C96 entirely, replacing it with 405 diversions through Jack Bell Drive, etc. during peak hours. Then have a beefed up C98 (renumbered to something else, say 411) run via Fraserwood, Westminster Highway, etc., then down to its current terminus, and continue along Eight Road and back up to Westminster Highway to Six Road, then to Commerce Parkway where the new 410 would run. Then you'd have this new 411 run from HTC and leave the 410 out of RTC and linked with the other routes in Richmond.

I would actually like the 410 to stay the way it is. The route is fine the way it is and many routes like the 160 are longer then the 410 end to end. What I would like to see is artics added to the 410 during the peak hours to avoid overcrowding issues. Also it would be nice if the fraserwood area was served by the route all the time instead of just during peak hours

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Once the evergreen line is fully operational, I could see artics possibly being sent from PTC to HTC unless they want to keep them there to have more capacity out to maple ridge. I am also curious if a handful of artics will be transferred from BTC to HTC for the 125. As for the 410 going to fraserwood all the time, that would be a waste of resources considering how frequent the 410 is and the lack of passengers from that portion of the route outside of peak hours.

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Once the evergreen line is fully operational, I could see artics possibly being sent from PTC to HTC unless they want to keep them there to have more capacity out to maple ridge. I am also curious if a handful of artics will be transferred from BTC to HTC for the 125. As for the 410 going to fraserwood all the time, that would be a waste of resources considering how frequent the 410 is and the lack of passengers from that portion of the route outside of peak hours.

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As a regular 410 passenger I have seen many passengers that wanted to go to the fraserwood area outside of peak hours. They ended up getting off nearby and had to walk there becuause the bus didnt go there. I also heard 2 passengers who were chatting with the driver said that it would have been good if the fraserwood area was served outside of peak hours. Maybe rather then having every bus serve the fraserwood area outside of peak hours, perhaps have every other bus serve fraserwood outside of peak hours? Also dont forgot the part that the 410 needs artics during peak hours due to overcrowding issues

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the 410 is approaching 7.5 minute frequencies for most of the day all week long and ridership is only growing. I think the solution might be to split the route into express and local components at this point.

  • local route A: current route from Stevenson village to brighouse. 15 minute service
  • local route B: current route from 22nd street station to Aberdeen via Fraserwood and then north on 3 road to bridgeport. 15-30 minutes depending on demand
  • 410 express: 22nd street station to Boyd/Westminster -> 91 -> no.6/cambie -> Aberdeen -> no.3 -> granville ave -> railway -> garry -> no.1 -> chatham. stops every 800mish with 15-10 minute service

there would probably need to be some extra service hours to implement this but I think it provides good local service and faster regional connections. the only thing that is really a problem is having to run any bus on the catastrophe that is 3 road. If only they kept the bus lanes ;).

maybe we could also get a highway bus station at cambie road and 99 to allow transfers from the 351/601

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The thing about the 410 (at least when it comes to the east-west segment) is there seems to be a divide between the two main travel markets: local traffic along the (definitely-busy) Cambie corridor and Queensborough, and inter-regional traffic that gets on at points in Richmond and rides all the way to 22nd St/vice-versa. I don't think it would suit travel patterns to split the 410 as a local/express along the current routing... rather, creating an optimized express route (i.e. "411") with highway coaches, that follows the 301's route from Richmond up to Westminster/91, then takes the 91A into 22nd St Station.

Queensborough residents will have the opportunity to transfer to the faster "411" service to Richmond Centre at Westminster/91 - which I've honestly already found to be pretty effective between the 410/301 when I used those routes to get to Kwantlen's Richmond campus from Burnaby, 2 years ago. There's quite an advantage to getting off at that stop and (if timed right) waiting about 5-10 minutes for the 301 rather than staying on the 410 continuing down Cambie - whether you're heading to KPU or through to Richmond Centre.

Even with a 20-minute starting frequency the "411" would probably be hugely popular as a regional addition (as long as it maintains those sorts of frequencies into evening hours). And not that this area is probably going to be particularly transit-friendly but it could improve transit links to the commercial complex on NE Alderbridge @ Garden City.

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