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http://www.angelfire.com/ca/TORONTO/builders/orion1.html I'm hoping we can create a database of complete serial numbers for the 1982-84 Orion I deliveries. These serial numbers have the line sequence number representing characters 12-14 in the VIN number, which started at serial no. 457 (C5356457 goes to Markham Transit #2016, delivered 5/1982) and ended at serial no. 999 (E5563999 goes to Whitehorse Transit #14, delivered 7/1984). The first U.S.-built Orion I carried the serial number C6001449 (goes to Pacific Transit System #D10, delivered 7/1982). However, the 1982 Orion Is delivered to Toronto Transit Commission (8730-8739) may not have had the line sequencing in their serial numbers. You can see, when you read the info in the link above, that it gets rather messy when you read the serial numbers for the Grey Goose Bus Lines deliveries... even the line sequencing in these serial numbers is out of order in places. Confirmed serial numbers are listed for units 125 (D5493730) and 160 (D6702732, possibly one of the few U.S.-built Orion Is to go to Canada) among these deliveries, both delivered to said agency in September/October 1983. For example, let's figure out if these University of Virginia bus serial numbers are correct: 5139 - D6659661 5239 - D6669674 5337 - D6670675 ~Ben

Is it true that the 1982 and '83 Orion I's--the U.S. versions finished in New York--used the Allison HT747 transmission (rather than the original HT740) behind their DD 6V92TA engines? I'm talking about those buses as run by such agencies as: Pacific Transit System (Raymond, WA) Milford Transit District (Milford, CT) Montachusett Regional Transit Authority (Fitchburg, MA) Yakima Transit (Yakima, WA) SLO (San Luis Obispo) Transit (San Luis Obispo, CA) San Luis Obispo Regional Transit Authority (SLORTA) (San Luis Obispo, CA) GATRA (Taunton, MA) IndyGo (Indianapolis, IN) Waukesha Metro Transit (Waukesha, WI) The 1982 GATRA Orion I's are unique in that they were the only such 35-foot units finished in NY to carry the old model 01.504, since most of these got out with the model 01.506, which continued into part of 1984 (the year both the 01.504 and 01.506 were replaced by the 01.507). Did these three buses, numbered 8217 to 8219, use the Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine and Allison HT747 transmission? ~Ben

http://www.angelfire.com/ca/TORONTO/builders/orion1.html Is there any proof as to why the same order number of 177 was used for both Clallam Transit's and Jefferson Transit's orders of the 1984 Orion I? Both orders are for 35 foot long buses (Clallam's being of the older design while Jefferson's was of the then-current design). Could this mean consequently that both sets of two buses (581-582 for Clallam and 848-849 for Jefferson) came with Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engines and Allison HT747 transmissions? ~Ben

Does anyone remember the 1981 Orion I 01.504 demonstrator bus that was purchased June 17, 1983 by the Quality Inn (or "The High Q") of Orlando, FL? Because it was built in 1981 it would have had a Detroit Diesel 6V53N engine, but once it set foot here in FL it had to be changed to the 6V53T engine. Or, with modifications to the rear compartment, it could have had the 6V92TA engine. ~Ben

http://www.angelfire.com/ca/TORONTO/builders/orion.html If you gloss over this page (link above), Orion built three types of seating configurations for its two bus lengths (30' and 35'): transit, coach (suburban) and airporter, for a total of six configurations (this would increase to nine in 1984, when the 40' length showed up). The transit and airporter configurations had both front and back doors, but most examples of the coach configuration did not. A few exceptions to the rule did exist: transit-style buses without back doors were built for Beaver Bus Lines of Winnipeg, MB in 1985, 1988 and 1990, and for Transport of Rockland County of Pomona, NY in 1988; while CDTA of Albany, NY purchased some coach-style buses with back doors. The airport versions of the model 01.506 (which replaced the 01.504 in 1982) were built for Shortway Lines (Philadelphia International Airport) and Leaseco (San Francisco International Airport). Both orders used the Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine and Allison HT747 transmission. Is it true Orion did not assign a specific model number to the airport seating configurations (unlike the transit and coach configurations)? Transit bus models: 01.501 = 30 foot, no air conditioning 01.502 = 30 foot, air conditioning (originally designated USA specs when first brought over here in 1978, a year before the near-identical TMC CityCruiser showed up) 01.504 = 35 foot 01.507 = 35 foot (replaced 01.504 in 1984) 01.508 = 40 foot Suburban bus models (all front-facing seats and no back door): 01.503 = 30 foot 01.505 = 35 foot 01.510 = 35 foot (replaced 01.505) 01.509 = 40 foot Airport bus models: 01.506 = 35 foot ~Ben

This will be a tough question to answer, and here it goes: were there any Orion I's built in 1984 and 1985 that used the Voith D863 transmission behind the Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine (a la AC Transit's 1984 Gillig Phantoms numbered 1469 to 1483)? They can be model 01.502 (30 ft), 01.507 (35 ft) or 01.508 (40 ft). ~Ben

Were there any Orion I's produced from 1982 to 1986 (when specified with the Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine and the Allison MT644, HT740 or HT747 transmission) that sounded closer to a Gillig Phantom built in those same years mentioned? They can be of any length (30' for 01.502 or 01.503, 35' for 01.506 or 01.507, and 40' for 01.508 or 01.509). ~Ben

http://cptdb.ca/wiki/index.php?title=Kingston_Transit_8382 When I entered that VIN for this 1983 Orion I, as typed (2B1129573D5509770), the VIN Decoder website says the check digit is incorrect. Therefore, I must now submit to you whether or not which of these two VINs is actually the correct one. Is it either 2B1129273D5509770, or 2B1129579D5509770? As the 6V53 was not used in the Orion I after 1982 save for the last OC Transpo 30-foot models (8371 to 8392), then I can only guess at whether or not Kingston's 8382 had the 6V53 (according to the typed VIN there) or if it had the 6V71N like many '83 Orions did. The engine code, which is the 7th digit in the VIN, would mean: 2 = Detroit Diesel 6V71N 5 = Detroit Diesel 6V53N (C40 injectors) ~Ben

I am wondering if Nolan (Stalwart23) or anyone else might be able to clue me in about the GATRA Orion I VIN numbers? They are listed below for you to see. 8217 01.504 2B1129774C6000532 8218 01.504 2B1129776C6000533 8219 01.504 2B112977XC6000535 8320 01.506 2B1129771D6000750 8321 01.506 2B1129775D6000752 8322 01.506 2B1129779D6000754 8923 01.502 2B1119772K6002264 8924 01.502 2B1119774K6002265 8925 01.502 2B1119776K6002266 8926 01.502 2B1119778K6002267 9127 01.507 2B1139770M6002910 9128 01.507 2B1139772M6002911 9129 01.507 2B1139774M6002912 9130 01.507 2B1139770M6002955 9131 01.507 2B1139772M6002956 Thank you, Ben (ClassicBusFan81)

Here's some Orion I VIN numbers from this link: http://notes.brandon.ca/tenders.nsf/0965fee38275b21186256ab0006ab633/2a3410cb38be0308862575080075ff51/$FILE/For%20Sale%20by%20Tender%20-%20Transit%20Buses.pdf #34 - 2B1129274C5414536 Model: 01.504 (35 foot) Year: 1982 Delivered: 11/1982 Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V71N Transmission: Allison MT644 #35 - 2B1169K74K5001955 Model: 01.508 (40 foot) Year: 1989 Delivered: 7/1989 Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V92TA Transmission: Allison HTB748 Other: Initially delivered to Toronto Transit Commission as #9360 with Cummins L10G CNG engine and ZF ECOMAT 4HP500 transmission; initially resold to GO Transit as #1713 with original ZF transmission replaced by Allison HTB748 transmission (and also sent to Calgary Transit where it was demonstrated as #8510); when re-resold to Brandon Transit in 1998 as #35, the L10G engine was replaced by the 6V92TA engine. #39 - 2B1169275H5001665 Model: 01.508 (40 foot) Year: 1987 Delivered: 8/1987 Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V71N Transmission: Allison HT747 #41 - 2B1139775K5002257 Model: 01.507 (36 foot) Year: 1989 Delivered: 9/1989 Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V92TA Transmission: Allison HTB748 #43 - 2B1139777M5002957 Model: 01.507 (36 foot) Year: 1991 Delivered: 11/1991 Engine: Detroit Diesel 6V92TA Transmission: Allison HTB748 ~Ben

http://cptdb.ca/wiki...ber_Explanation I have more engine code letters deserving to be seen on the page in the link above: N = Navistar T444E (7.3L) R = Cummins C8.3 S = Cummins L10-280E T = Cummins B5.9 U = Cummins M11-280E W = Cummins B5.9G Thank you, Ben

Please let me know if these VINs are correct for all of these Mississauga Transit Orion V's. 1989 (units 8901-8925) 8901: 2B1569E76K5030001 8902: 2B1569E78K5030002 8903: 2B1569E7XK5030003 8904: 2B1569E71K5030004 8905: 2B1569E73K5030005 8906: 2B1569E75K5030006 8907: 2B1569E79K5030008 8908: 2B1569E70K5030009 8909: 2B1569E77K5030010 8910: 2B1569E79K5030011 8911: 2B1569E70K5030012 8912: 2B1569E72K5030013 8913: 2B1569E74K5030014 8914: 2B1569E76K5030015 8915: 2B1569E78K5030016 8916: 2B1569E7XK5030017 8917: 2B1569E71K5030018 8918: 2B1569E73K5030019 8919: 2B1569E7XK5030020 8920: 2B1569E71K5030021 8921: 2B1569E73K5030022 8922: 2B1569E75K5030023 8923: 2B1569E77K5030024 8924: 2B1569E79K5030025 8925: 2B1569E70K5030026 For page: http://cptdb.ca/wiki..._V_%27K_VINs%27 1990 (units 9001-9020) 9001: 2B1569E71L5030070 9002: 2B1569E73L5030071 9003: 2B1569E75L5030072 9004: 2B1569E77L5030073 9005: 2B1569E79L5030074 9006: 2B1569E70L5030075 9007: 2B1569E72L5030076 9008: 2B1569E74L5030077 9009: 2B1569E76L5030078 9010: 2B1569E78L5030079 9011: 2B1569E74L5030080 9012: 2B1569E76L5030081 9013: 2B1569E78L5030082 9014: 2B1569E7XL5030083 9015: 2B1569E71L5030084 9016: 2B1569E73L5030085 9017: 2B1569E75L5030086 9018: 2B1569E77L5030087 9019: 2B1569E79L5030088 9020: 2B1569774L5030089 For page: http://cptdb.ca/wiki..._V_%27L_VINs%27 Note: 9020 uses the Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine but with the same Voith D863 transmission as 9001-9019. 1991 (units 9101-9140) 9101: 2B1569E70L5030190 9102: 2B1569E72L5030191 9103: 2B1569E74L5030192 9104: 2B1569E72L5030207 9105: 2B1569E78L5030194 9106: 2B1569E7XL5030195 9107: 2B1569E71L5030196 9108: 2B1569E73L5030197 9109: 2B1569E75L5030198 9110: 2B1569E77L5030199 9111: 2B1569E7XL5030200 9112: 2B1569E75L5030203 9113: 2B1569E77L5030204 9114: 2B1569E79L5030205 9115: 2B1569E70L5030206 9116: 2B1569E72L5030255 9117: 2B1569E76L5030257 9118: 2B1569E76L5030260 9119: 2B1569E7XL5030262 9120: 2B1569E71L5030263 9121: 2B1569E77L5030266 9122: 2B1569E70L5030268 9123: 2B1569E79L5030270 9124: 2B1569E72L5030272 9125: 2B1569E76L5030274 9126: 2B1569E7XL5030276 9127: 2B1569E73L5030278 9128: 2B1569E71L5030280 9129: 2B1569E75L5030282 9130: 2B1569E79L5030284 9131: 2B1569E72L5030286 9132: 2B1569E76L5030288 9133: 2B1569E74L5030290 9134: 2B1569E76L5030291 9135: 2B1569E7XL5030293 9136: 2B1569E73L5030295 9137: 2B1569E77L5030297 9138: 2B1569E70L5030299 9139: 2B1569E75L5030301 9140: 2B1569E79L5030303 For page: (see 9001-9020) Note: 9137-9139 were delivered with Allison HT748 ATEC transmissions. 1992 (units 9201-9210) 9201: 2B1569K71N5030979 9202: 2B1569K75N5030984 9203: 2B1569K75N5030998 9204: 2B1569K77N5030999 9205: 2B1569K71N5031002 9206: 2B1569K70N5031010 9207: 2B1569K73N5031017 9208: 2B1569K77N5031022 9209: 2B1569K78N5031031 9210: 2B1569K79N5031040 For page: http://cptdb.ca/wiki..._V_%27N_VINs%27 Note: All units 9201-9210 originally were delivered with the Cummins L10-240G CNG engine and ZF ECOMAT 4HP500 transmission. By 250,000 miles, these were overhauled and replaced with the Cummins L10-280E diesel engine and Voith D863 transmission. 1993 (units 9301-9312) 9301: 2B1569S75N5031276 9302: 2B1569S77N5031280 9303: 2B1569S79N5031281 9304: 2B1569S70N5031282 9305: 2B1569S72N5031283 9306: 2B1569S74N5031284 9307: 2B1569S76N5031285 9308: 2B1569S7XN5031287 9309: 2B1569S71N5031288 9310: 2B1569S73N5031289 9311: 2B1569S73N5031292 9312: 2B1569S75N5031293 For page: (see 9201-9210) Note: Unlike the other L10-equipped units (8901-8925, 9001-9019 and 9101-9140), this dozen Orion V's would use the electronically-controlled L10-280E CELECT (a contraction of "Cummins Electronics") engine. The reason I assume units 9301-9312 to use the Cummins L10-280E engine is because, by 1993, that derivation had replaced the older, mechanically-controlled L10-240B and L10-270B engines. I apologize if any of the VINs I typed here are already in the databases mentioned. ~Ben

Can anyone identify if this 1983 Orion I 01.502 owned by Roy McCullough is an ex-Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport Transportation bus? It sounds like it has a Detroit Diesel 6V92TA engine and Allison HT740 transmission. Thank you, Ben